The issues with FFXI that we don't often discuss

[Armando]

Re: The issues with FFXI that we don't often discuss

No, I'm not - I understand very well how you can be too lazy to make a macro set for PvP. I just don't see how you'd have to "waste a ton of time" to get it done. >_>

[Aksannyi]

Re: The issues with FFXI that we don't often discuss

Armando you are underestimating the laziness of the average FFXI player.

[Armando]

Re: The issues with FFXI that we don't often discuss

In many cases, players have found it to be incredibly effective and that is why the penalty is an annoyance - a lot of players use gear swaps and don't want to waste a ton of time writing a macro set just for PvP.

Forgive me for being inexperienced at PvP, but how can it possibly take a ton of time to write a macro set for PvP when you barely have any equip swaps to do? You just slap on the raw /ja, /ma, /ws, etc. commands in there along with the PvP-specific commands and you're done.

It's not like macro space is an issue any more either.

[Murphie]

Re: The issues with FFXI that we don't often discuss

I don't understand why YM is thanking Dirtyclown for saying that YM was so off base that it didn't even need to be responded to.

[MrMageo]

Re: The issues with FFXI that we don't often discuss

Staves arent necassary at 75 on player in pvp Once you have hit 75 and begin to merit you start to gain a very large advantage over mobs. Then you look to INT/MND to fill in the other holes because they affect both potency and accuray. The last thing on the list of necesity is staves. (Speaking in terms of enfeebles, for Nukes if you don't use a staff your asking for a resist)

Personally the order I look at things is this.

Skill>INT/MND>MACC (includes staves and other MACC boosting items)

As for the reaon Balista, and Brenner are always vacant. People want to PVP not play a stupid 20 minute game. It may have been big a while ago, but like most of the secondary events in this game it has lost alot of its flavor. Whenever I go to Brenner or Ballista it is 1:1 fights or team vs team fights with no game involved.

Also comes the little fact the Island can only be reserved by one person every 2 hours, for money. All be it a little amount of money but still, paying to enter a zone once every 2 hours is pretty lame. Hell if you leave to change jobs you gotta pay again.

[dirtyclown]

Re: The issues with FFXI that we don't often discuss

Go ahead and shove your foot in your mouth then, I have no reason to here. Hell you didn't even touch the topic of staves, which what YM was clearly protesting, instead, we got some diatribe about RDMs not hasting or regenning you, which has nothing to do with staves.

I didn't mention anything about staves because I thought it was rather obvious that they're invaluable for a Red mage and didn't feel like repeating something that doesn't need to be repeated. I forgot that you like to nitpick small details that have nothing to do with anything, though. My mistake.

[Omgwtfbbqkitten]

Re: The issues with FFXI that we don't often discuss

Open mouth, insert foot.

Go ahead and shove your foot in your mouth then, I have no reason to here. Hell you didn't even touch the topic of staves, which what YM was clearly protesting, instead, we got some diatribe about RDMs not hasting or regenning you, which has nothing to do with staves.

I mean, people only do gear swaps for the accuracy/haste/TP/Damage increases they see from it, I'm sure those thousands of tests out there proving it to be true are totally wrong

[Murphie]

Re: The issues with FFXI that we don't often discuss

. . . In all seriousness, maybe it's just because spells become so impossible to get off without resists, even with the atrocious Staves, that some don't even bother wasting the MP anymore. But, that's just me.

I'm not picking on you personally, YM, but this is a clear example of when your lack of actual experience shows through.

The situations where even with staves you can't land an enfeeble are few and far between. For most content that players will encounter, enfeebling is fine. The reason most of them don't bother in endgame meripo is because there isn't any time for it, or the mobs are too weak to warrant enfeebles, because they die too quickly. It's not because they've just given up.

The staves aren't atrocious. They are one of the best tools any mage past level 51 has. When you eventually get to that level, maybe you'll understand it better.

[dirtyclown]

Re: The issues with FFXI that we don't often discuss

That's because I'm leveling Paladin right now. Paladins have no Enfeebling Magic skill.

. . . In all seriousness, maybe it's just because spells become so impossible to get off without resists, even with the atrocious Staves, that some don't even bother wasting the MP anymore. But, that's just me.

Not trying to kill your boner or anything, but how hard can it possibly be? Not all ToAU mobs have resist rates that are off the charts, do they? I think the answer is that there is a majority who play the job, but would rather stand there in their cool hats and occasionally throw a refresh or a Cure IV my way, and outside from that, do little else. Not even a Regen comes my way. I don't see Haste very often anymore either, and when I do the Red mage casts it on the DDs and me like twice then stops bothering with it unless asked. I don't just stand there and use Provoke sometimes when tanking, the PT would die if I did. I've played Red mage before, and I don't see why it's difficult for someone to perform their job in a slightly less than half assed manner.

Before we can even give any validity to your "opinion," you must first give reasons to back it up. Opinions CAN be wrong and yours doesn't even have a reason behind it.

Open mouth, insert foot.

[Omgwtfbbqkitten]

Re: The issues with FFXI that we don't often discuss

Now, just hold on a moment and let me speak my opinion here: my opinion is you've got it backwards. If anything, it's the whole gear-swapping concept that's stupid, and I feel the penalty will not be permanently shunned by any more than the fiercest elitist begrudgers in the game if it became the law of the land everywhere else.

You're entitled to your opinion otherwise, but don't try telling me that my opinion is "wrong."

Before we can even give any validity to your "opinion," you must first give reasons to back it up. Opinions CAN be wrong and yours doesn't even have a reason behind it.

In many cases, players have found it to be incredibly effective and that is why the penalty is an annoyance - a lot of players use gear swaps and don't want to waste a ton of time writing a macro set just for PvP.

[Yellow Mage]

Re: The issues with FFXI that we don't often discuss

Red mages don't enfeeble anymore. D:

That's because I'm leveling Paladin right now. Paladins have no Enfeebling Magic skill.

. . . In all seriousness, maybe it's just because spells become so impossible to get off without resists, even with the atrocious Staves, that some don't even bother wasting the MP anymore. But, that's just me.

(I would love to see our rosy Weapon-skill to be introduced later on to either give a bonus to Magic Accuracy or hit the target with some kind of reduced Magic resistance: either way, it has to be steep. Of course, since the weapons are going to be on the level of relics . . . S-E has to make with the Magic Accuracy in other areas, first. And a lot of them.)

And, worse, is that gear swapping - a way of life for most people in PvE - is penalized in PvP. That's really stupid.

Now, just hold on a moment and let me speak my opinion here: my opinion is you've got it backwards. If anything, it's the whole gear-swapping concept that's stupid, and I feel the penalty will not be permanently shunned by any more than the fiercest elitist begrudgers in the game if it became the law of the land everywhere else.

You're entitled to your opinion otherwise, but don't try telling me that my opinion is "wrong."

[DakAttack]

Re: The issues with FFXI that we don't often discuss

One would think that a finer overall balance would occur when you take both PvP and PvE into account. I only know of Blizzard's endless quest for balance so my opinion is limited. In their case they've found themselves playing tug of war between what the devs want and what the current voices of the people want.

Balance in FPSs is evidently difficult to come by as well. Bungie just couldn't do one thing without creating and destroying cheap and overused tactics. Not that they would get points for trying. I'm not sure saying anything on BF2142 is worth the effort while DICE hesitates to admit it even exists. Like BF2 you can gain points, ranks, and earn unlockable weapons. Most of what you can unlock is useless, while some of the starter weapons are of the most all-around efficient.

[Omgwtfbbqkitten]

Re: The issues with FFXI that we don't often discuss

Plenty of people care about PvP, a lot of people love PvP.

Then how come most Ballista on NA hours go cancelled and no on ever uses the Dioramas? After the first three weeks, who does Pankration anymore.

PvP in this game does not succeed because the majority does not care for it in FFXI.

One big reason for that is 60+, there's no real PvP balance between the jobs. BLU, MNK and RDM will own most of anything they come across. RNG will obliterate anyone without shadows of buffs. This game was balanced for PvE, for PvP there is no way to fully balance the uncapped fights. The most balanced fights are at 60 caps.

And guess what? No one wants to do those because its capped. And, worse, is that gear swapping - a way of life for most people in PvE - is penalized in PvP. That's really stupid.

WoW was balanced for PvP and they still don't have it down right. How long did Shaman get to be god in that game? Every job is a hybrid in that game, though, so without specialists, how can you hope to balance it?

Anyway, its not an easy thing to add into either game and be fair about it at the same time. I've yet to find a finely-balanced PvP game in any MMO. I can find them in FPS everywhere and the reason there's balance there should be obvious:

Nothing levels up. If it does, not so much that it makes a tremendous game-breaking difference.

[Aksannyi]

Re: The issues with FFXI that we don't often discuss

It's true, I'm just trying to get people to think that us WHMs need some love too. :p

[Mhurron]

Re: The issues with FFXI that we don't often discuss

Some would argue that a WHM worth their salt wouldn't really need a refresher in an XP party. I've had several parties on WHM without one and suffered very little because of it.

Undoubtably for Merits and EXP at later levels a Refresher is not needed. However, is that what the party wants, or are they going to get a refresher as well? Many times, it will be the latter.

A good WHM is a hell of a lot better than a mediocre RDM, even if "endless" MP is what you seek in a healer.

Merit or later levels exp, RDM and WHM are pretty interchangeable with no negative consequences. This is because, wait for it, RDM is good enough for those situations. Where WHM shines as the premier healer, where the best healer is actually needed, are the same situations where RDM is busy doing it's support duties. When you aren't going against a mob that smacks you into next week at every turn and you don't have to throw 4 enfeebles at it and keep them on come hell or high water you can have a WHM or a RDM as the healer and no one would notice.