new SE interview by Bercus over on BG

[Omgwtfbbqkitten]

Re: new SE interview by Bercus over on BG

I've only played FFXI and another MMO, but I do keenly remember getting to the end of the other one and people complaining that it was "overcrowded" or "broken " with "little to do."

They complained even when they didn't level other characters, persue crafting, PvP, do quests or missions. They claim there is "nothing left" for them to accomplish.

They did and continue to do this because, ultimately, both they and their friends have one shallow goal - "1337 gear" - and they fail to realize that the MMORPG wasn't made for them, that there is no "fairness" in endgame nor should there be.

RMT is a demon fueled not by the "haves" but the "have-nots" that wish they were the "haves." SE can mass ban, make mobs harder, HNMs force-popped, players can make their silly little RMT blacklists - RMT will still be here, still thriving because of the "have-nots" still wanting to be a "have." And in their endeavor to become a "have" they make the game worse not only for themselves, but legit players as well.

[Taskmage]

Re: new SE interview by Bercus over on BG

Can you show me a vid/pic of Kel'Thuzad dying? I don't think anyone has even made it into his chamber yet. Maybe 1 or 2 very hardcore guilds have, I'm pretty sure he has not been defeated.

Actually, yeah. Google ftw.

[levish]

Re: new SE interview by Bercus over on BG

75s quit for a large number of reasons. I've lost a lot of friends over the years, and I've been 75 myself for a very long time. Sometimes it's frustration over end-game, but honestly, hardly anyone quits because they can't fight the Kings in FFXI. There's tons of stuff to do at level 75 these days; Assault, merits, Limbus, Dynamis, ENM, sky, sea, etc. You don't really have to ever visit a ground HNM camp anymore if you don't really want to.

Quite simply most people quit because FF takes up too much of their time.

Camping NM's that takes up 3-6 hours of your play day and more than likely giving 0 accomplishment would really push those buttons for me, especially if I wanted to be fully tinked out.

Camping NM's is just unnecc. it'd be perfect if you could grab your orb or whatever and just go fight whatever you needed and not just waste time. Then tweak the rarity of items through the difficulty of the BC fight.

[Icemage]

Re: new SE interview by Bercus over on BG

75s quit for a large number of reasons. I've lost a lot of friends over the years, and I've been 75 myself for a very long time. Sometimes it's frustration over end-game, but honestly, hardly anyone quits because they can't fight the Kings in FFXI. There's tons of stuff to do at level 75 these days; Assault, merits, Limbus, Dynamis, ENM, sky, sea, etc. You don't really have to ever visit a ground HNM camp anymore if you don't really want to.

Do I think the Kings are broken? Of course. I've fought and killed them all many times. They would be really difficult if the level cap were, say, 70 or lower, but even mediocre level 75 players can defeat them with just a sprinkling of strategy.

I like the idea of turning the zones with the ground HNMs into BC arenas. Dial up the difficulty on the Kings (making King Behemoth more like Chlevnik, etc.) so that the items still aren't easily acquired. Would solve a lot of the end-game drama (though not all, since, even though this discussion has mostly revolved around the major ground NMs, there are others that are under serious contention like Roc, Serket, King Arthro, etc.).


Icemage

[levish]

Re: new SE interview by Bercus over on BG

Endgame is the Proverbial awesome sandwich shop that everyone doesn't want to go to because there's always a line going out the door of the shop.

I mean sure the sandwiches are heavenly but you have to wait your whole lunch hour, without actually being able to get one, because there is only one counter filling orders.

[Vyuru]

Re: new SE interview by Bercus over on BG

Do you know why the 30-50s are quitting? Because everybody knows why the overwhelming majority of 75s are leaving. These are our in-game friends that are leaving. We hear their reasons everyday. Calling for a research group or writing up a contrived scenario to counter such an obvious claim isn't productive.

Er... No

The 30-50 crowd are quitting because either they think that the gear is too expensive, Genkai's are too hard, the players are too rude, the gil sellers are too irritating, drama in the LS, not enough time to play etc.

I hardly think some level 30 character is going to be thinking that since they will never fight against one of the Kings then they may as well quit the game.

[Ziero]

Re: new SE interview by Bercus over on BG

And yet people do and yet people 'last long'.

Well then that's a bigger problem in this game then the actual Kings. SE needs to find people who know how this game works, both technically and community wise, to watch over it and enforce the rules. How come no one ever asks about why GMs know so little about in game information?

I think that would have been more important a question then many that were asked in this interview.

[Murphie]

Re: new SE interview by Bercus over on BG

And yet people do and yet people 'last long'.

Sad but true.

[Legal Fish]

Re: new SE interview by Bercus over on BG

If people are dumb enough to warp hack en-mass to *the* most popular monsters in game, they won't last long.

And yet people do and yet people 'last long'.

[Ziero]

Do you know why the 30-50s are quitting? Because everybody knows why the overwhelming majority of 75s are leaving. These are our in-game friends that are leaving. We hear their reasons everyday. Calling for a research group or writing up a contrived scenario to counter such an obvious claim isn't productive.

I've known lots of 30-50/60s who quit and not *once* did I hear it being caused by them thinking lvl 75 players quit. Most 30-50/60 don't care about your average 75 player or what they do. Those that do are usually babied to 75 themselves then start complaining that endgame is broring because all they do is dynamis/sky/camp an HNM.

I'd like that idea, but once all the possible zones were learned, you'd have have RMT and other players willing to use hacks to immediately pop at the correct location for claim. Could possible be used for a while to find who all is using these hacks and subsequently ban them.

If people are dumb enough to warp hack en-mass to *the* most popular monsters in game, they won't last long. Increasing the king's strength, i.e. making the NQ as strong as the HQ, would mean more people would be needed to fight them. If you have 20 people all warp to the same zone at the same time, lights are gonna go off and GMs will start banning. It's easer to catch a warp/speed hacker then a claim bot.

Edit: Guess auto-merge isn't working yet ._.

(sexy mod edit: merged for you)

[Caspian]

Re: new SE interview by Bercus over on BG

They need to make kings stronger and change the way they appear. Whether that means making them forced spawn, ENM/BCNM type fights like BRP and others have suggested, or (my personal favorite idea) changing their spawn location with the added possibility of multizone pop areas.

I'd like that idea, but once all the possible zones were learned, you'd have have RMT and other players willing to use hacks to immediately pop at the correct location for claim. Could possible be used for a while to find who all is using these hacks and subsequently ban them.

[Murphie]

Re: new SE interview by Bercus over on BG

Can you show me a vid/pic of Kel'Thuzad dying? I don't think anyone has even made it into his chamber yet. Maybe 1 or 2 very hardcore guilds have, I'm pretty sure he has not been defeated.

No, I can't. Because I don't play WoW anymore. I don't concern myself with what's going on in games that I don't play. Plus, he was added after I left.

Regardless, for the most part, people tear through that stuff in WoW. I mean, that's ALL they have to do at WoW endgame. Either PvP or run endless instances. I'll take the flexibility of FFXI's system over the extremely limited job and raid system in WoW any day.

[Legal Fish]

Re: new SE interview by Bercus over on BG

No, they reach the end of it in 2 days.

Can you show me a vid/pic of Kel'Thuzad dying? I don't think anyone has even made it into his chamber yet. Maybe 1 or 2 very hardcore guilds have, I'm pretty sure he has not been defeated.

[Ziero]

Re: new SE interview by Bercus over on BG

Whatever you all argue about there is one fact, the kings are flawed. They are weak mobs, relativley speaking, that spawn in tiny rooms and drop *THE* best items in game. That in and of itself is the problem with them.

Is it a level wide, game breaking problem? To some. But some people complain you have to work to get an airship pass or that g1 is too hard to do ect.

Does it need fixing? Sure as hell does, as do many other HNMs and big 'boss' fights that drop absolute crap in comparison. Seriously, compare Bahamut's Zagnal with the Ridill. It's almost ridiculous as to how crappy some of the newer gear is compared to older stuff. Throw in the increased difficulty of new fights compared to kings and it's even more worthless to do the 'big' battles.

They need to make kings stronger and change the way they appear. Whether that means making them forced spawn, ENM/BCNM type fights like BRP and others have suggested, or (my personal favorite idea) changing their spawn location with the added possibility of multizone pop areas.

Newer, harder, stronger mobs and fights should drop newer, stronger, better gear, or at least things that can compete with the current stuff. But this hasn't been the cash recently. Any new 'great' gear is easily obtained through repeatetive assaults and most new HNMs drop very little worth mentioning, if anything at all. Endgame content does need more work because much of it s just not worth the effort.

[Murphie]

Re: new SE interview by Bercus over on BG

People who reach the endgame of an MMO and then quit aren't really an anomaly. I've seen it in every other MMO as well. Ideally, yes, SE would be able to hold onto those subscriptions, but that doesn't mean that they will do it every time, or even most of the time.

A lot of it has to do with their individual situation: What kind of LS they are in, what kind of friends they have, etc. I know people who have been playing this game for years, and keep leveling new jobs, and doing things at endgame no matter what. And I know folks who reach 75 and get bored and quit. Saying that either is the standard isn't really possible for me.