Scary Conversation with a Senior GM

[Macht]

Originally posted by Modri
You're high. It takes at least 15 seconds just to get a response from someone typing on a keyboard. So assuming everyone types ONE response to the GM when they arrive, and the GM can then leave, and that the GM is answering queue requests without pausing for any reason whatsoever, yes they could handle that many calls.

You're what we like to call "a liar".

15 seconds depeding on your typing abilities, and for PS2 users depending on the area they are in and it's currently latency. Like I already said before and seems I have to say again they were only Approximates, if a person did work non-stop on it like that then those number would be right or damn close.

The point of it is just because they respond to you fast has no real basis in the number of calls they get. Put a little more logic and listen before starting to throw accusations, it was like I was talking to a wall in a previous thread and getting the same on this one.

Look up the words approximates and/or estimates, the numbers are not actual but based on BEST or depending on how you look at it WORST case scenarios. Also depending when you consider the time to start and end with each request changes everything as well.

You going to consider the time that someone is writing the request to send to the GM as part of the time for the GM to respond? Sounds silly to me to consider that time as part of it but then yes it will reduce the numbers. What you want to assume that the GM spends at least 5 min. with each one?

Then from my previous mathmatics adding those asinine changes you still have 20,160 requests done in the approximation of a week and 1,048,320 a year if there are 30 GMs working only on a 8hr basis.

20k reports on bugs or other problems seems extreemly small to me. That's a measly 4% with just 500k users, there is just no way that there is 96% of the entire populous that doesn't care what's going or is doing something of an illegal action. If you wanted to debate 50% against me I might accept that but that still shoots the number of reports/requests much higher then 20k a week.

EDIT:

Ok, re-adjusted my mathmatics and went by estimates that reports only occur in heavily populated areas. Assuming that each of the populated areas have 300 people each that's about 22% - 33% of the population aware of the event doing something.

Alright that sounds more reasonable in an estimation. in any case though all I was trying to get across is that the GMs most likely do get a lot of requests and demanding immediate action isn't likely. It takes time but when the action is done it'll make an impact enough that anything extra we decide to do in line with it just complies to make that action even greater.

Almost forgetting the reason why I was posting on this thread, if I remember right it was something started about someone saying that the GMs doing nothing or nothing going to be done about the gil buyers/sellers and we shouldn't be "jerks" to try and hinder the gil buyers/sellers growth because it'll have no effect (Terrible logic and way of thinking I might add).

[Modri]

Originally posted by Macht
15 seconds depeding on your typing abilities, and for PS2 users depending on the area they are in and it's currently latency. Like I already said before and seems I have to say again they were only Approximates, if a person did work non-stop on it like that then those number would be right or damn close.

The point of it is just because they respond to you fast has no real basis in the number of calls they get. Put a little more logic and listen before starting to throw accusations, it was like I was talking to a wall in a previous thread and getting the same on this one.

Look up the words approximates and/or estimates, the numbers are not actual but based on BEST or depending on how you look at it WORST case scenarios. Also depending when you consider the time to start and end with each request changes everything as well.

You going to consider the time that someone is writing the request to send to the GM as part of the time for the GM to respond? Sounds silly to me to consider that time as part of it but then yes it will reduce the numbers. What you want to assume that the GM spends at least 5 min. with each one?

Then from my previous mathmatics adding those asinine changes you still have 20,160 requests done in the approximation of a week and 1,048,320 a year if there are 30 GMs working only on a 8hr basis.

20k reports on bugs or other problems seems extreemly small to me. That's a measly 4% with just 500k users, there is just no way that there is 96% of the entire populous that doesn't care what's going or is doing something of an illegal action. If you wanted to debate 50% against me I might accept that but that still shoots the number of reports/requests much higher then 20k a week.

EDIT:

Ok, re-adjusted my mathmatics and went by estimates that reports only occur in heavily populated areas. Assuming that each of the populated areas have 300 people each that's about 22% - 33% of the population aware of the event doing something.

Alright that sounds more reasonable in an estimation. in any case though all I was trying to get across is that the GMs most likely do get a lot of requests and demanding immediate action isn't likely. It takes time but when the action is done it'll make an impact enough that anything extra we decide to do in line with it just complies to make that action even greater.

Almost forgetting the reason why I was posting on this thread, if I remember right it was something started about someone saying that the GMs doing nothing or nothing going to be done about the gil buyers/sellers and we shouldn't be "jerks" to try and hinder the gil buyers/sellers growth because it'll have no effect (Terrible logic and way of thinking I might add).

You can theorize all you want. It's a simple fact that it takes more than 15 seconds for a GM to solve a player issue, and it's a simple fact that they don't work non-stop all day long.

[Braanu]

Please stop your arguement. It has NOTHING at all to do with the topic of my thread. If you want to discuss how long it take a GM to respond to someone and how many GM Calls they can handle in a day, that is either another thread for you to start or its something you should whine to eachother about in PMs.

The topic of this thread is making people aware that GMs dont have all the tools at their disposal to help identify and solve the gil farming for internet sales problem. And discussion along those lines is encouraged. Please stop trashing my thread with your bickering about something completely off-topic.

Thank you in advance.

[Blitz15]

i hear lots of complaints about GMs

[salador]

rgfegs

cmon' guys!!! why are you tying to shut down ige?! it's awesome!!! i use it every one and awhile

[Lasareth]

It's not IGE itself--it's the fact that SE has absolutely no enforcement of its contracts. Either that or they just want to screw over the players.。

[lun4tic]

GMs are just there to get you unstuck out of sticky places, and to log reported disputes for later use.

[entena]

I got lost hahahaha

Three major topics have come up in this topic.

1) GMs are useless.
2) Gil Buyers/Sellers are the bane to existance.
3) Because its against the TOS they shouldn't be doing it.

1) GMs do suck, I never had a reason to call upon one, and I don't really see someone telling you that they work for IGE a big deal to the GMs. Like someone else brought up, I'm sure they have more pressing things to attend to, and if they don't, they probably just don't care.

2) To tell you the truth, I don't see much wrong with gil buying/selling. So what if people want to spend their RL money on game money. Rather than spend 8-10 hours farming, they spend 1-2 hours working in RL. And to the point that it gives an unfair advantage to them, well, life is not, never has been, and will not in the near future be fair, so live with it. Flamers and Whiners gain more enmity on my hate list then gil buyers.

3) No they shouldn't be doing it, but why is gil buying such a big deal? Using fraps, or those logger programs, is also against the TOS but people do it all the time and it has become widely acceptable throughout the ffxi community. "Well I don't use those programs", I'm sure you are completely innocent of never breaking any rules, laws, or TOS, so you, my friend, are the one exception. It's like the pot calling the kettle black.

Do I buy gil? No, I don't want to spend more RL money than I have to on a game, I have fun enjoying my time in game and with the community on my $12.95 monthly. Would I buy gil? No, I'd rather spend it on other things. Do I think gil buying is retarded, to some extent yes, but I can understand a person's reasons for doing so.

As for those that would like to debate with my reason, or flame me for my opinions, please send me a PM so that I remember to come back to this thread and respond to your post in an appropriate manner.

[salador]

fgfdg

entena, I think you are so right

[solmeir]

what is wrong with gil selling, is that it is ruining the ability for people to use an area for AF gear etc.

As discussed on this forum, and others- try doing AF in upper delfutts tower while you are still in the early 40's (and before anyone starts- you should be able to do this then), and watch the gil farmers train mobs on you get you out of there, or intimately know the chest spawn areas to make AF achievement a hellish experience
So these people are ruining areas for others.

As more gil is sold, more people become gil farmers... so you can expect this trend to continue into other aspects & areas of gil earning.

personally, im not opposed to buying gil either (although I dont)- but ruining areas for others is not accetpable, so I will have to change my stance

[ibroyles]

Yeah one thing for all you guys who act like gil-buying is ok with you. "It doesn't affect me" is the common response. Oh yeah? What about when gil-sellers start seeing better ways to make money, aka your way to make money. Imagine gil-sellers dominating Ifrits, Yughott, Palborough and Gugsen. Imagine them camping NMs that you like to camp, farming in areas you like to farm. Now, tell me how frustrating it is when there's other people in your farming areas, WHO ARE USUALLY DOING IT FOR THEIR OWN CHARACTER. Add in the fact that gil-sellers are doing it to make money, and you have one frustrated farmer. Enjoy.

[TARUCLOUD]

TARU'S RULE!!!!!

any1 in midgarsormr in the taru allience LS
I AM

[ibroyles]

Re: TARU'S RULE!!!!!

Originally posted by TARUCLOUD
any1 in midgarsormr in the taru allience LS
I AM

wtf are you talking about gtf outta here.

[Blitz15]

entena...

finally someone with some sense. good 4 u :-)

/bows

[ibroyles]

Re: I got lost hahahaha

Well I told myself I wouldn't debate this here, but considering entena actually had a couple of decent points I figured I would reply.

Originally posted by entena
2) To tell you the truth, I don't see much wrong with gil buying/selling. So what if people want to spend their RL money on game money. Rather than spend 8-10 hours farming, they spend 1-2 hours working in RL. And to the point that it gives an unfair advantage to them, well, life is not, never has been, and will not in the near future be fair, so live with it. Flamers and Whiners gain more enmity on my hate list then gil buyers.

I see your point, but the thing is saying "life is not fair" doesn't mean that "FFXI isn't fair" also. Big difference between real life and FFXI is that FFXI is a video game, and rules are placed so that it IS fair for all players. After all, that's why certain bounds are placed on the game so that others can't gain an advantage without any actual work into the game. Then again, I'm not too worried about gil-buyers getting an advantage on me, because of all the "gil-buyers" who posted here, none of them really look like quality gamers, imo. Then again its just my opinion, and everyone is entitled to their own, including you.

One major reason most people flame against gil-buying is because they think their character, which they put more time and effort into, should be seen as better in game than a gil-buyer who basically pays for his character. Like I said, this doesn't really worry me. What I am worried about is that there are too many people who think that gil buying is "OK" to do to advance your character, when it is actually along the same lines as using a game genie on a CRPG to get unlimited gil. I don't know when this new generation of gamer got this idea, but it disgusts me to no end. Gaming is supposed to be fun remember? When it gets to be a chore such that I feel the need to buy myself equips(w/real life money mind you) just to feel happy with the game, I'm quitting.

Originally posted by entena
3) No they shouldn't be doing it, but why is gil buying such a big deal? Using fraps, or those logger programs, is also against the TOS but people do it all the time and it has become widely acceptable throughout the ffxi community. "Well I don't use those programs", I'm sure you are completely innocent of never breaking any rules, laws, or TOS, so you, my friend, are the one exception. It's like the pot calling the kettle black.

The reason nobody complains about fraps and parsers is that it doesn't give you an unfair advantage in game. Since when is being able to see the damage you do or take pictures considered an unfair advantage? That kind of hurts your argument because it looks like you are just grasping at straws, looking for a way to say "AHA! got ya! you use a program to take pics!" Also, I think I'm pretty safe in saying I've never broken the TOS. You can call bullshit on me all you want, but since I'm on PS2 it kind of limits the ways to break the TOS in the ways you are stating, and of course I have never MPK'd or anything like that.