Elvaan Thiefs ain't so bad?

[Omena]

Originally posted by Rogan
well actually I said the mithra thf that did over 400 were in CN, the elvaans that did 160 were in gustav, still kinda a noob spo but yeah.. believe what you want though I saw maybe 3 or 4 elv thfs they all did a little under 2 hundred with sata Viper Bite

He failed the trick attack. A proper SA+TA+VB just doesn't do 160.

[ibroyles]

Hell even a normal SATA should do more than that, the guy obviously knows nothing about THF.

[Jaggywaggy]

What was said about if you took Stan's gear and put it on a mithra is true. It'll just be a better result, although stan "proved" elvaan thief can be very good without question.

About the farming elvaan thf vs taru thief of higher level, that's really not a fair comparasion vs mobs which you can easily reach cap damage on. Elvaan > taru obviously in str, str is far more importent in farming.

Also you said you had Dex+ rings and he had snipers(+acc). Now while + acc is supposed to help DE vs xp mobs the dex+ would be more useful for EP and TW, simply because there shouldn't be acc issues to worry about. What good are sniper rings vs mobs you hit 99.99% of the time anyway? Exactly

And the base agi and dex difference between elvaan and mithra thief is not 4 agi and 4 dex. Where are you making this stuff up from. Back when I use to be 30-40 the difference back then between a mithra friend and myself(hume) was about or slightly higher than 4 dex/agi. I find these made up claims of 4/dex/agi at 60 to be pure BS.

However yes I think it can be overcomed, Stan proved it, but don't try to hide facts, 4dex/agi, haha you wish. I for one don't neglate to invite elvaan thiefs when playing a job besides my thief. Thief is more about timing correctly, working with others, and maintaining good SATA gear and good tp building gear.

Lastly DrSerpico's post I didn't find all that offensive...And his sig doesn't mention thievies, more or less likely favorite to least favorite races. I myself don't like elvs much either as far as looks go, nothing about the stats.

[ibroyles]

I did say I didn't find his post offensive, but his sig was taken from a post bashing elvaan for the worst race as THF. I'm just simply offended because he chimed in on another post about Elvaan THFs sucking a while back, now on this one, and he still has the bashing race thing in his sig. No big deal really I'm just wondering what his problem with the Elvaan race is.

[DrSerpico]

Oh, you do, do you?

My main beef with elvaans are with elvaan fanboys who say elvaans are the best at everything.

"Elvaans make great whms, we have high mnd!"
"There's lot's of +mp items, we elvaans make UBER summoners"

"With the right gear, elvaans are the bestest thieves!"
"I have high str, therefore I'm the best at everything."

Don't get me wrong, elv's make the best drk, dmg mnk, arguably war and pld. They are great melees. They are above the rest in every melee job... Except thief. What makes me bash back really hard is people who fail to see the flaws, and only think their race is best at everything.

Too long have I heard "Well, elv can be just as good as X in X job, if not better!". Those who don't adapt the holier than thou elvaanity, credit to you. Those who do? Insecurity issues. I'm a mithra. I'm not the best race for ANYTHING besides thief. Elvaans saying that the difference is hardly visible is spitting in my face.

"I'm a mithra, I'm just as good as elv drk, because I hit more. Never mind me hitting 300-500 less on sata+spinslash due to really weak str, It's hardly noticeable."

Happy with your answer? This has derailed from the original thread. Pursue this, and we'll talk it over in PMs, so as to not disturb the thread furthermore. My reason to posting this publicly is that as you pointed out, some people may have been offended by my opinions on elv thf and my race preference. Now they know why, if they still have problems with it, just talk to me about it.

Serpi out.

[Ozymandis]

I just had a small thing I wanted to add. I recently partied with an Elvaan THF in Crawler's Nest who had terrible gear. His SATA Viper Bite, which DID land perfectly, hit for less than 200 damage. Against a fly.

I could imagine an Elvaan THF doing that little of damage with SATA VB. It's not unbelievable at all.

[ibroyles]

Wow. You should've taken that guy aside and shook him. That is ridiculous. I've done more than that with ONLY SA+WS on ITs.

[Ozymandis]

Originally posted by ibroyles
Wow. You should've taken that guy aside and shook him. That is ridiculous. I've done more than that with ONLY SA+WS on ITs.

Heh. I ended up politely excusing myself from that group. The WHM was level 43 without haste, and we were fighting Crawlers and Flies. I was slowed, there was no real debuffer, and I ran out of shadows at the end of a Hornfly fight. The WHM didn't heal me, and I died with the fly at a sliver full of life.

He goes on my "no-party list".


Edit: also, he was wearing level 17 boots to pretend like he had Leaping Boots. And a hairband to pretend he had the Emp. Pin. It was great

[Rogan]

see it's not just me..whether they are failing it or not doesnt really matter if theyre gonna fail it 80% of the time

[Blacki]

hmm

Hmm

i didnt knew that my reply will make all this bullshit about elvaan being gimbed thfs and im sorry that i said mithra sux in str
mithra are made to become thfs but that doesnt make every other race playing the job is bad every race can play every job right if you have the right equip ... thx for those who invite galka whm or taru war or a elv blm ..

Originally posted by Rogan
see it's not just me..whether they are failing it or not doesnt really matter if theyre gonna fail it 80% of the time

ok what do we have here ??

a new drg who is not happy about CoP .hehe

throwing is good for you ----> i idont think you can even land it on the mob :dead: :dead:

well just face it you are useless sux dont go flaming in thf fourms i think you dont even know how thf job is?? go play with your blue pet

and btw omfg SATA+WS only 160 /clap

your so fckin noob elv with no gear can make SATA for 200

my SATA+ws dmg is always about 450-500 on flies i made about 630..

DrSerpico plz go to hell

you are so noob just coz you are a mithra that doesnt make you the best in every thing its all in the player and i think you are so noob thinking that other races cant play every job right

** sorry for my bad english huh?? lol

/kneel to all thfs

:dead:

[Ixaera]

I lost the point of this thread...

My contribution? If you like the Elvaan race, go for it If you're picking a race specifically to be a thief, go for Mithra.

Thieves wield very low damage weapons -- even massive str won't really make up for our crappy swings, I don't care if you're Steelfleece Baldrich -- dagger sucks no matter what str you have. An extra 2-10 damage does not add up that much -- but it probably *will* make up a little of the difference on SATA damage.

160 sounds very low for any race thief on IT at what...40-something? I was leveling drk in the jungle the other day and a hume thf was doing about 160 SATA's (everytime). But I didn't peek at his gear, so I don't know about how he was equipped.

Most of the mithra thieves I know don't spend much on gear. It's sad really -- hell, I haven't even really put much gil into my equipment...I level whm also, and I put real effort into leveling my ninja sub so that's not cheap either.

Considering that an Elvaan's STR isn't contributing much at all to SATA and their DEX and AGI are a lot lower (no, not just 7 points between both, twice that...), if you put both into the same gear, the Mithra will do more SATA damage. PLEASE keep in mind that the damage range on all race's SATA is large on ITs. Don't just take the Mithra's lowest number for the night and pit it against your highest. (It's human nature to do so...so it's understandable, but just be fair.)

To those who don't think 14 extra DEX and AGI is that much...why even bother with the leaping boots and hairpin? Why...it's only 12 extra DEX and AGI

Anyway, I don't care. Elvaan thief, mithra thief...the difference isn't THAT much -- so who cares?

It's not like a galka whm or anything :spin:

[Elsurion]

My personal Problem with the Elv THF is their look, they look strange holding only a dagger with their legs forming an o.

Also what i have to add here, every job can be played good and bad. An Elv THF can outdamage a Mth THF und certain circumstances.

And dagger deals a lousy single hit dmg, but when it comes to SATAn and SATAnVB then it goes up to 700dmg easily

[Rouge]

Elvaan thief, chiming in...I usually have very respectable damage outputs while leveling, and I'd like to think the majority of my gear is near top of the line.

For reference: http://ffxi.allakhazam.com/profile.xml?54723

The only time I've ever done noticeably bad damage is one time when leveling in Quicksand at level 47, I was whiffing badly against Beetles and hitting for extremely low numbers (Less than 200 on SATA o.O). Although I think it might have just been the level difference, since now they're pretty pathetic now, only 3 levels higher. I think my top damage was against a bat (no surprise here...), somewhere around 650ish with a 350ish distortion. And I've received compliments, so...yeah. Elvaan thief work quite well, if you're willing to put time into them. I should parser my damage next XP party and compare...

[neighbortaru]

wait a sec, you are using a badly equipped elv thf to illustrate your point on how bad elv thf's are??? am I the only one to see the fallacy in that?

[leii]

well every elvaan thf i have ever partied with did less sneak/trick damage than me usually around 50-150 damage less than me. so i would say elvaan thfs are not as good. but their normal hits do about 3-5 more damage than me.