The E3 2011 thread

[Malacite]

Re: The E3 2011 thread

Watching Invisible Walls, really good episode this week.

And yeah, I gotta agree with them, it's looking like Nintendo's to win or lose. And above all these, they need to not fuck it up this time with the major 3rd party support. I do not want to buy another $300 paper-weight. I want to see some big support this time around with amazing games, and not just 2 or 3 games I might buy a year.

[cidbahamut]

Re: The E3 2011 thread

Ugh. I think I'm done with Nintendo if they're just going to roll out more and more gimmicks.

[Omgwtfbbqkitten]

Re: The E3 2011 thread

No matter what people want to say, deep down they know Nintendo cannot thrive with a console that is EXACTLY like Sony and MS's offerings. When you think about it, that's what Gamecube was and it became a dumping ground for ports - which was not the case at all for DS and Wii.

Adding touchscreen/tablet-like functions would essentially mean the sky's the limit on user interface, similar to how things are done the DS and 3DS now.

Think of it like this. Okami wants; you to draw to solve puzzles. Analog is too slow, motion control too sensitive.

Touchscreen? Perfect.

Games like Dark Souls or Etrian Odyssey with no in-game map? You'd be able to do your cartography on the touchscreen - no graph paper needed. And you could make map notations very fast, akin to Zelda Phantom Hourglass and Spirit Tracks - much faster and accurate than the notations you'd do for maps in FFXI.

SSFIV3D and DOA Dimensions have move shortcuts, letting players ease in to the experience. There are merits to both ways Capcom and Team Ninja went about it. Team Ninja's is admittedly a bit more informative, but Capcom was wise to let players filter out players that were using it online so no "EOing" online in SSFIV3D.

There are a ton of ways to benefit and, sure, some devs are going to be uncreative and stick a map or HUD elements down on the touch screen - but that's exactly what Zelda OOT3D is doing and it makes the top screen and all its action look much prettier. That and I spend a lot less time fiddling with inventory as it will just be on the bottom screen or in Cafe's case the controller screen.

This can be something that will be functional for the casual and hardcore. you just gotta get those that want to live under rocks and hate iPads to own up and I think they will over time.

[DakAttack]

Re: The E3 2011 thread

It would be cool if the 3DS could be used as a controller, but what would that make the "controller"? Is it essentially a tablet device with digital controller software? Actual buttons? Does it play 3DS games, or will they be PSP Go style?

[Omgwtfbbqkitten]

Re: The E3 2011 thread

With all the fan mock-ups out there and an attempt to just-so-slightly step ahead of the competition in power, I think you could move that sort of thing into a traditional controller with dual analog - it would just be a bit wider to accommodate it.

I used to play FFXI on PS2 withe the Logitech keyboard/controller hybrid. A traditional controller with a standard keyboard wedged in the middle, just minus the number pad. I could comfortably set it in my lap and switch between functions as needed. I'd imagine the Cafe controller would be a bit smaller, perhaps with a touch screen akin to what the DS has to keep cost relatively low. I don't think there would be a need to go too much in the direction of the multi-touch stuff iPads do, as that would distract from using traditional inputs, but the possibilities are still endless with a single-touch screen.

Personally, I'd love a reboot of Steel Battalion for 3DS or the Cafe with such a controller. All the dreams of that game could be realized and connect to a larger audience without losing the traditional controller or being forced to pay out for a large piece of plastic (which I do admit I bought). Any extension to the controls of the mech could just be done via touchscreen, when you think about it. Nude Maker sort of did that in Infinite Space for DS and they developed Steel Battalion for the Xbox originally

Though I would suspect this kind of controller would come at the expense of dropping rumble, but I've come to see that as frivolous over the years. Nice for some games but generally underutilized. Team Ico, Polyphony Digital, Kojima Productions and the Trauma Team guys at Atlus genrally made the best use of rumble, all Nintendo did was popularize it (though I suppose that Sega AM2 technically pioneered it with the arcade versions of Outrun).

[DakAttack]

Re: The E3 2011 thread

Rumble was just another gimmick.

[cidbahamut]

Re: The E3 2011 thread

Rumble was just another gimmick.

Yes, but it had the decency to be supplemental rather than something they built an entire console around.

[Omgwtfbbqkitten]

Re: The E3 2011 thread

Yes, but it had the decency to be supplemental rather than something they built an entire console around.

MS and Sony coming up with their own motion controllers validates what Nintendo did - Nintendo proved there was a bigger market out there for gaming. This industry cannot move forward by pandering to the so-called hardcore alone. Now Nintendo can come back toward the hardcore with something more traditional, but still slightly unconventional while keeping motion controls around.

Without years of forced experimentation, we wouldn't know what the place for touch screens and motion controls was. Now we do. The very fact that move is optional for every game on PS3 is exactly why Move has done nothing but flounder no matter how much better the technology is. And I like Move better than Kinect, but the fact it doesn't force anything is why it fails.

Kinect and Wiimotes succeed because they demand certain types of games be made for them.

[cidbahamut]

Re: The E3 2011 thread

No one's arguing the gimmicks didn't bring in boatloads of cash BBQ.

I'm saying the gimmicks do nothing to add to my gaming experience and only serve to detract from it in a disproportionate number of cases.

---------- Post added at 12:21 AM ---------- Previous post was at 12:20 AM ----------

Kinect and Wiimotes succeed because they demand certain types of games be made for them.

Bad ones?

[Raydeus]

Re: The E3 2011 thread

Very bad ones.

[Kailea]

Re: The E3 2011 thread

No one's arguing the gimmicks didn't bring in boatloads of cash BBQ.

I'm saying the gimmicks do nothing to add to my gaming experience and only serve to detract from it in a disproportionate number of cases.

---------- Post added at 12:21 AM ---------- Previous post was at 12:20 AM ----------


Bad ones?

it is only a gimmick if it is a useless addition, and sorry but I found the addition of motion controls to be nice and refreshing to the standard controller, as I will this new idea, touch screen controller .

[cidbahamut]

Re: The E3 2011 thread

I find it gets in the way of user input, so yes I'd call it fairly useless as an input device. But hey, that's just my experience and I'm clearly in the minority or it wouldn't be selling so damn well.

[Omgwtfbbqkitten]

Re: The E3 2011 thread

No one's arguing the gimmicks didn't bring in boatloads of cash BBQ.

I'm saying the gimmicks do nothing to add to my gaming experience and only serve to detract from it in a disproportionate number of cases.

You keep using that word, "gimmick."




What it really means for you is something you just don't like, didn't really try to adapt to or perhaps just don't want to become comfortable with. In reality, a gimmick is just some trendy fad that eventually goes away. Something that ebbs and flows rather than permanently settles into place. Whether or not you find a place for it is totally irrelevant for the millions and millions of other people that do.

I don't watch TV. Its not a snobby, hipster tool thing that I do. Its just I've found other ways to access TV content that doesn't entail me to schedule my life around the TV, a DVR to record shows or a satallite feed I can delay and queue. None of that stuff is for me. I don't call those things gimmicks, though, because its not and those things clearly have applications for other people that have roommates or wives and children that want to watch something besides old episodes of Mythbusters and The X-Files like I would on Netflix.

I find it gets in the way of user input, so yes I'd call it fairly useless as an input device. But hey, that's just my experience and I'm clearly in the minority or it wouldn't be selling so damn well.

Things like motion controls and even 3D aren't things that instantly calibrate to your comfort zone. You'll find it interesting that the same exact thing applies to dual analog controllers for many, many games. Some people play with an inverted camera control scheme and other don't. Some games don't give you the option to change the control scheme.

I've heard people endlessly whine about MGS: Peacewalker's control scheme and I never once had a problem with it. I played shooters with face buttons functioning as the second analog stick for Goldeneye and Perfect Dark. MGS isn't an FPS, but like those games, its generally not the run-and-gun affair that many FPS are. I can't even begin to imagine why someone would want to run and gun in a game about being undetected.

[cidbahamut]

Re: The E3 2011 thread

Sounds like someone's butthurt that I'm picking on Nintendo. What a surprise.

[Omgwtfbbqkitten]

Re: The E3 2011 thread

Sounds like someone's butthurt that I'm picking on Nintendo. What a surprise.

Um, no. Given Apple, MS and Sony all engage in motion and touch control technology I'm kinda defending them all here along with Nintendo. My sister wants Kinect and there's one shooter that I think its kinda cool. I think Dance Central is a great game for Kinect.

I want Move, mostly for shooters so I can enjoy them just like I do on the Wii and I very much want Sony and Nintendo to keep moving forward with their respective versions for that reason. I want an iPad2 because I think its great - its not something I want games for exactly, but SE has some nice offerings there.

Why not try having an actual reason behind your assertions rather than sounding like a bitter bitch 24/7? It really gets old.

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Setting cid's nonsense aside:

- I have high hopes for the new Tomb Raider if they commit fully to the survival elements and blend them with the more classic platforming/puzzle approach. Survival added a nice edge to games like MGS3, even if they were silly at times.

- DX:HR is still looking very, very good. I hope this reboot goes well.

- MGS 3DS has some fun ideas layered into the remake, such as Photo Camo. Its exactly what it sounds like - create camo for Snake using the 3DS camera. They're also using the gyros to make climbing trees and crossing hanging bridges feel a little more perilous.

- Journey is still looking like a fascinating PSN game. The ability to wander and explore undirected and discover is a rare treat in games these days, but one I always enjoy. The co-up is unconventional, but cool.

- From Dust looks amazing. It may be the game Black and White and Doshin the Giant were always meant to be, just minus the giganitc, obnoxious deities. And Peter Molyneux's ego.