A message from the thieves.

[Voila!]

Originally posted by Regulat0r
Voila, why do you always have a attitude problem?

It's passed down from post to post.

[ddg2]

And this will be my last post in this thread.

Thank god, your stupidity was becoming contagious.

[neighbortaru]

jesus-fucking-christ ddg! didn't you get the hint the first time you were banned?

[AtraposBLM]

Originally posted by ddg
Warrior- Can effectivly deal damage, and take the hate in emergencies, if not tanking the whole fight.

Ninja- Can pull effectivly using Utsusemi (spelling? I'm not a ricer, sorry). Can effectivly tank while subbing warrior. Can deal moderate damage and participate in mulitple skill chains by utilizing the dual wield effect. Keeping two types of one handed weapons allows them to swich back and forth, depending on what weapon skill is needed for the chain.

Ranger- Can pull, deal damge.

Monk- Up to 30 monk can tank fine, with the correct gear. While also dealing massive damage.

Thief- They can pull and controle hate, dealing critical hits for decent damage every 1 minut.

Redmage- They can heal, enfeeble, and melee. Suck it.

Bard- They can buff, and heal using Regan type songs (sorry I'm not too educated on Bard songs)

Beast master- Let's not even touch this ok? They CAN charm monsters, and melee them... Let's just not touch this one.

Dark Knight- Melee and enfeeble.

Dragoon Knight- Deal lots of damage, support the party using Wyvern breath, or deal more damage with it. Up to 30, they can tank.

Paladin- Tank, and heal.

Summoner- Heal with summons, deal damage with summons.

I guess that's it, dumbass.

Let's see here. You were saying that Sam was the only job with only one purpose, other than BLM and WHM? Let's look at your reasoning:

WAR - DD and Tank. Tanks well throughout the game, although not an ideal choice from about lv37-lv74 (Flash makes PLD suddenly much better at keeping hate, and not having Utsusemi: Ni makes Nin better at avoiding damage. War is still a close 3rd to tanking in that time span. At lv74, War/Nin might actually be better than Nin/War, but I have no experience saying one way or another). We basically agree here, only WAR's can be more than just a back-up tank, and they're actually the best tank for the first 37 levels of the game.

NIN - Pull using utsusemi? Do you mean that if you use /nin, you're a better puller due to blink? Well...sure, but that doesn't really prove anything about Nin. In my assorted 170+ levels of this game (72 as blm, 36 as whm, 22 as rdm, 10 as war, mnk, nin, and sam), I've seen nin pull exactly Zero times. Why? You generally don't have the tank pull, because to make Chain 4, 5, and the occasional 6, it's much easier to have the puller (usually a RNG/NIN, THF/NIN, WAR/X, or in some of my fun parties, BRD/WHM) leave before the mob is fully dead to make sure that travel distance is not the reason why you missed a chain. Also, NIN make great tanks from 12-20ish (2 nin in the Dunes makes partying ridiculously easy). From there, WAR or PLD make better tanks until lv37. From there on, NIN make better tanks for slow, hard hitting mobs, and PLD make better tanks for anything else. PLD also holds hate better, but NIN can compensate using a lot of ninjitsu. Also, if you have more gil than you know what to do with (namely, MILLIONS of it), NIN/BLM can be an effective DD and simultaneous Tank. However, to do that requires an assload of cash, and I believe is only feasible from lv51 on (elemental staves become available at lv51). NIN 2 hour is very handy when you pull something that you just can't handle. Dead mob and no penalties on death = sweet. It's also a handy warp for those of you without BLM 17.

MNK - mainly agree with you, although they're one of the more consistent DD. I'm not sure about MNK tanking abilties - I know they can tank in dunes and Qufim, but I'm not positive how much further they can take it. Ask a MNK who's tanked. I'd be willing to let a MNK with good gear tank as late as Gustav Tunnel though (lv38-40), maybe even further if it was someone I trusted.

THF - Agree with you here. But it's basically one role - Hate Control. Even their burst damage is a form of hate control. Basically, you invite a thf to allow other DD's to do more damage. The fact that THF comes with damage is more or less irrelevant. If SATA + VB did zero damage, but had the added effect of making it impossible to get the mob off the PLD, a THF would still be invited for that reason. Well...maybe not Zero damage...but you get the point. The damage is a bonus, not a role. THF has one role (albeit a complicated one)....does that make them useless?

RDM - One of the most versatile jobs in the game. Melee's effectively from 1-30 with normal gear, 30-50ish with exceptional work (Reference: Ruic, lv52 RDM/NIN in an abnormal party). Master enfeebler, second best party supporter, endurance healing. For many levels, is tied with WHM for best healer.

BRD - One role - Party support. The fact that they do numerous things is irrelevant. Ballad, Madrigal, debuff. The fact that they only have one role is NOT a downside - it just means they're great at what they do.


BST - I have not partied with a BST, nor have I played one to any level. Let a BST comment.

DRK - Enfeeble? Erm, unless you mean they can cast 1 absorb per battle...then sure, that's enfeebling. However, even that enfeeble does one thing - increase the damage done by the party. If you invite a Dark, you want Damage, plain and simple. That's all a DRK is good for, and they're not the best at it until about lv68. Even then, it's arguable. DRK's are valuable for their DAMAGE. Period. One role does not equal bad.

DRG - Sure, in lower levels, can tank, just like anyone with /war can tank. Most DRG's use a /melee, and as such, Wyvern Breathes are usually non-existant (except adding to the DRG's WS damage). Upper levels, the plight of the DRG is saddening, as they can't really do much of anything. At the same time, I've partied with a few DRG's in the past few levels (one at 70, one at 71) who managed to hold their own. It's just that other jobs would've been better. When a DRG get's Pentathrust, it's king damage dealer for a level or two. Other than that, they're mainly average DD.

PLD - With *very few* exceptions, PLD = Tank. Period. They're the best at holding hate bar none from lv37-75. Before then, they struggle with holding hate when compared to a good War/Mnk. Talk to Rugal about the very limited times a PLD can be an added DD, and the expense at which it comes. Also, ask any PLD, they cure not neccesarily to heal, but instead to retain hate. Either way, it goes back to the fact that PLD = tank. Again, one role does not equal bad.

SMN - They're a whm with different buffs from lv1-lv66 (or 68...whenever it is that Fenrir gets Eclipse Bite). From then on, they're more or less a WHM with 1 minute burst damage. Gilthanes and I partied for lv70 a few times (he went lv70->71, I went from ~2k into level to ~30k into level). We both argreed that barring the few occasions where Garuda would do 1400 damage with Predator Claws, I was dealing more damage more consistently. SMN's are incredible helpful to have, however, in HNM fights. Earthen Ward (stoneskin-ga) and Aerial Armor (blink-ga) make fights against mobs like Fafnir much easier, requiring much less healing of the melee's who can't do anything to avoid taking damage from AoE attacks. They're also great for having Hate-Free damage, although this is mainly a moot point, as any DD who gains hate simply temp-logs and comes back Hate-Free.

As for the ones you forgot:

RNG - Damage, damage, damage. Yes, they can pull....so? If you invite a RNG, you want DMG. They spend the most of the game as top dogs of damage, who can only arguably be said to be second best to BLM's. Frequently, a RNG's ability to unload damage and keep going (/nin) makes them great for long battles where intense damage is needed (BCNM's). One role does not mean bad.

SAM - Just like any other melee job, can tank 1-25 with /war just fine. As a DD, SAM serves one of two purposes. One, it's to make a renkei with another melee damage dealer and the tank (which for a long time, rng *cannot* do, although they can in higher levels). Or, it's to do 1 renkei with 1 partner. If this is the case, the samurai can frequently do 2 weapon skills for every one that their partner gets off. This elevates SAM damage to be on par with most other DD's. SAM are very helpful from lv30 on. SAM can also be a *very* good damage dealer once they learn Sidewinder at lv58/29 SAM/RNG (I might be off a level or two on that). Two roles - DD or Renkei maker.

BLM - One role? Erm...k, thanks. Damage, and back-up healer. Also, for a good portion of the game, emergency party rescue in the form of escape (until RDM can get it from sub), and second best person to try to Sleep adds (elemental seal). Well...I guess they're actually the 3rd person to ask to sleep adds (BRD - RDM - BLM). Also handy to take along for Warp II. Don't have one? Have fun walking back from Sky...

WHM - One role. Healing. For many parts of the game, the best Healer in the game. Also, makes any party safer by having the higher raises. One role does not mean bad. Also, until lv72, only job able to make leveling in faraway places easy. Don't have one? Have fun walking to Yhoator jungle, Xarcabard, or Altepa.




Just because a job has 1 role doesn't make it bad. By your logic, nobody should invite BRD's, PLD's, WHM's, DRK's, or RNG's (and from 30+, MNK) because they only have one role. Why is that so sad? Is a Doctor sad because he doesn't know how to repair a car? No, he specialized in something, foregoing other studies, to become the best at what he could do. Since when did specialization = bad? Seriously man...you think you're awesome because you make arguements from what you've read, but until you play this game, and play it to a respectable level (~65 at least), your opinion is rather difficult to take seriously. Also, lay off the grammar whoring. Attacking the surface of someone's arguement only proves that you can't touch the arguement it presents. Weak.

[Unholy Prince]

Originally posted by AtraposBLM
Also, lay off the grammar whoring. Attacking the surface of someone's arguement only proves that you can't touch the arguement it presents. Weak.

best quote to come out of this thread. I'm remembering that one.

[Ashtyr]

There's a reason this game is teamwork-based. Some of you need to go back to listening to Linkin Park while pretending you're Squall and angsting about how much your life sucks and how you don't need anyone else.

Fags.

[Tomatoes]

BST - I have not partied with a BST, nor have I played one to any level. Let a BST comment.

In PT setting, rivals RNG in total damage output when including jug pet damage. However, is limited to 1h Axe for SC options. Also, doesn't gain TP as fast as more dedicated melee classes imo. Can also handle occasional links relatively safely.