To my fellow Dragoons

[Malefas]

Amazing, you compare damage and totally disregard weaponskills/skillchains...

Let me guess, jump owns too? Because it does damage and "Last Resort" only increases your attack?

/exit bubble.

[ryushi]

DRG

yeah I just recently got into DRG and I have decided to take it to 75 but yeah dude, that post was kinda Rude but I must admit I agree wth you because I have been in a number of noob parties that abuse my DRG/WAR job and add me to the provoking team where I am clearly not a Tanker, so yeah I have to agree with you in the "screwing" bit.

[RiceCooker]

Drgs a awesome job ^^ *but* they are missing something i dont know exactly what though but i some how feel they are missing something hopefully SE will give them a new

im a THF during battles im always keeping an eye on Sata times and lining up for Sata, sata+viper its fun also i steal from time to time and mug. with drg well i only got a lvl 8drg but im taking it all the way it will be my main after i get TH2 anyway with drg i see myself attacking then pretty much just jumping when cooldown is complete and renkei when TP is up unlike THF i wont have to line up i just stand in one spot jump wait jump wait jump then renkei dont flame im all for this job i have been since i picked up the instruction manual and look at the job lists but i can see myself getting abit bored just waiting for jump times to come up so i can jump then back to auto attack -_- they need some pet abilities or something it would be kool to have your wyvern do different attacks maybe have lvl 10, 15, 30, 45 wyvern abilities? eg: Fire Dash (wyvern dashes at the mob with a fire element *downtime 5mins*) or atleast have your wyvern attack what mob u want it two like Bst i dunno im just throwing up ideas

anyway great thread
keep it up Dragoons

[ryushi]

Yeah!! maybe instead of a DRG's 2 hour being "call wyvern" it could be something else, something that may link you and the wyvern up for a split seconed, like uh.. a sorta spirit combing or somethng that could make your wyvern do more damage and become invincible for maybe about 2 minutes.. I think DRG's need a 2 hour ability rather than just calling a wyvern to fight by there side.

[Dark Aphalite]

Trust me, you think you will get DRG to 75 and all, I mean, I thought the same, but after level 50 you start to get less and less motivated.
After 60 it is a joke.

The WS we get are so bad which ultimately kills us.

Also I am dissapointed with Jump. Dragoons have Jump as a trademark move so it should have been much more than just an extra attack.

[moonyaco]

Dragoon is a great class, whenever i'm making a party, i wouldn't hesitate to get a whm, a tank pal/war, 2dragoons and a blm as pure dmg output. This may sound odd, but i truely feel that dark knights totally suck before they can equip all those high lvl accuracy gears and dragoons kick ass from 35 onwards, with 2 jumps and acc bonus. The dmg they do is huge no matter what lvl i'm playing with them.

However all we see here is bashings on dragoons saying how crappy they are and after checking out all the different posts, its more or less the same. Drgs want stronger jumps, stronger wyverns, stronger WS. Sure jump is the drg's trademark, a 2hr to summon a wyvern is weak, drgs ws after penta do shitty dmg. Drg AF is worthless compared to other jobs. Its true that they need major improvements in these areas, but its equally true that other jobs face different aspects that need improvements too like red mages needing a unique set of spells after 55. Monks need some good dmg boosters before they get dragon kick etc.

Is pentathrust such a defining factor for dragoons that warrants all players to stop playing it or even not inviting them into pts at any lvl? In my humble opinion, it makes dragoons function like samurais since they are gaining tp almost as fast as them. What makes dragoons fun in FFT or FFV is its ability to jump( even though dmg from it isn't impressive). Wyvern is a great addition to dragoons for their dmg output. I don't see anyone mentioning about the decent extra dmg wyverns deal with their breaths during weapon skills.

I could suggest making drg 2hr work like a summoner's 2hr, turning the wyvern into a dragon for 30 seconds, or multiple jumps at one time. Jump dmg doing 3 times more than normal and always hitting. Wyverns magic bursting on all skill chains and healing after every jump. Weapon skills that do 800 dmg with wyverns breathing for 1/3 as much at high lvls. Drgs need more job traits like atk bonus 2, acc bonus 2. You know, wars/drk/sam/mnks would be offering money to join parties if this really happens. Aka, Dragoons would be too powerful. I doubt mentioning any suggetions or moaning over dragoon's weak points here would mean anything but tarnish the reputation of dragoons. I mean, aren't you tired of seeing the same thread over and over? I've nothing against dragoons, in fact i love playing it and enjoy having them in parties, its just that crying over spilt milk and beating the dead horse ain't doing much help if all we do is post some mindless chatter here which S-E wouldn't even bother reading.

I've never grped with high lvl dragoons much to know how usefull/useless their wyverns are after 60, or how little dmg they really do compared to other jobs. The opinions from high end dragoons on how bad they are relative to warriors/drks esp are just their own perspective. All we need is One Thread, showing a graph that compares dmg output between different melee jobs, drk/drg/war for example at a certain lvl. Over time we might be able to formulate a graph for a dragoon's dmg potential at different lvls. This way we would have hard evidence to encourage S-E to do something about this job since dmg output is the real issue that needs to be looked at.

I believe that leaving mages, tanks like pal/war/nin and the support, brd, aside, we have mnk, drg, drk, rng, sam and thf that take dmg slightly better than mages, and hence their sole purpose in pt is to deal dmg. It would be silly to ensure that all these 6 jobs deal the same dmg output for the sake of balance. There has to be some difference in their dmg output. Personally, i find dragoons to be pretty strong amongst these lot, losing only to rng/thf for sure and drks with high end acc gears.

Sorry for missing out on bsts, cos i have no idea whatsoever about them. I play a red mage and have gotten really irritated that they aren't implementing Refreshra or Hastera for us. Everquest is making spells more convenient like more grp buffs at higher lvls, but in ffxi, the spells aren't really worth looking forward to at high lvl. I sure hope they'd make a quest for a great spell for every mage job at lvl 65 just like a questable weapon skill for the melee and a questable ultimate weapon for each job. But then again, its another wishful dream that everyone has for their own favourite jobs that S-E wouldn't be looking into anytime soon.

Just for the EQ players, It took almost 4 years for Sony entertainment to fix hybrids, how long would you expect S-E to do anything about dragoons if all you do is make posts after posts here about your opinions for upgrade without substantial facts along with your arguements like a comparable statistic between job usefulness in parties. It is only then that your suggestions in my opinion would come into consideration.

p.s i love dragoons and so does anyone that comes into this forum. I just got tired of reading the same stuffs here till i fell asleep reading 1 thread halfway yesterday. Feel free to disagree with me. :sweat:

[Dark Aphalite]

Well after Penta you get Skewer which is decent.

And our AF is not bad at all, much better than say.. DRK.

[Lone Dragon]

What the fuck do you mean 'damage boost before dragon kick'? ;/

They've already parsed damage, it's not just based on a simple pov.
Skewer is ok, but Rampage can outdamage it. ._.

[2.0]

Originally posted by moonyaco
Dragoon is a great class, whenever i'm making a party, i wouldn't hesitate to get a whm, a tank pal/war, 2dragoons and a blm as pure dmg output. This may sound odd, but i truely feel that dark knights totally suck before they can equip all those high lvl accuracy gears and dragoons kick ass from 35 onwards, with 2 jumps and acc bonus. The dmg they do is huge no matter what lvl i'm playing with them.

However all we see here is bashings on dragoons saying how crappy they are and after checking out all the different posts, its more or less the same. Drgs want stronger jumps, stronger wyverns, stronger WS. Sure jump is the drg's trademark, a 2hr to summon a wyvern is weak, drgs ws after penta do shitty dmg. Drg AF is worthless compared to other jobs. Its true that they need major improvements in these areas, but its equally true that other jobs face different aspects that need improvements too like red mages needing a unique set of spells after 55. Monks need some good dmg boosters before they get dragon kick etc.

Is pentathrust such a defining factor for dragoons that warrants all players to stop playing it or even not inviting them into pts at any lvl? In my humble opinion, it makes dragoons function like samurais since they are gaining tp almost as fast as them. What makes dragoons fun in FFT or FFV is its ability to jump( even though dmg from it isn't impressive). Wyvern is a great addition to dragoons for their dmg output. I don't see anyone mentioning about the decent extra dmg wyverns deal with their breaths during weapon skills.

I could suggest making drg 2hr work like a summoner's 2hr, turning the wyvern into a dragon for 30 seconds, or multiple jumps at one time. Jump dmg doing 3 times more than normal and always hitting. Wyverns magic bursting on all skill chains and healing after every jump. Weapon skills that do 800 dmg with wyverns breathing for 1/3 as much at high lvls. Drgs need more job traits like atk bonus 2, acc bonus 2. You know, wars/drk/sam/mnks would be offering money to join parties if this really happens. Aka, Dragoons would be too powerful. I doubt mentioning any suggetions or moaning over dragoon's weak points here would mean anything but tarnish the reputation of dragoons. I mean, aren't you tired of seeing the same thread over and over? I've nothing against dragoons, in fact i love playing it and enjoy having them in parties, its just that crying over spilt milk and beating the dead horse ain't doing much help if all we do is post some mindless chatter here which S-E wouldn't even bother reading.

I've never grped with high lvl dragoons much to know how usefull/useless their wyverns are after 60, or how little dmg they really do compared to other jobs. The opinions from high end dragoons on how bad they are relative to warriors/drks esp are just their own perspective. All we need is One Thread, showing a graph that compares dmg output between different melee jobs, drk/drg/war for example at a certain lvl. Over time we might be able to formulate a graph for a dragoon's dmg potential at different lvls. This way we would have hard evidence to encourage S-E to do something about this job since dmg output is the real issue that needs to be looked at.

I believe that leaving mages, tanks like pal/war/nin and the support, brd, aside, we have mnk, drg, drk, rng, sam and thf that take dmg slightly better than mages, and hence their sole purpose in pt is to deal dmg. It would be silly to ensure that all these 6 jobs deal the same dmg output for the sake of balance. There has to be some difference in their dmg output. Personally, i find dragoons to be pretty strong amongst these lot, losing only to rng/thf for sure and drks with high end acc gears.

Sorry for missing out on bsts, cos i have no idea whatsoever about them. I play a red mage and have gotten really irritated that they aren't implementing Refreshra or Hastera for us. Everquest is making spells more convenient like more grp buffs at higher lvls, but in ffxi, the spells aren't really worth looking forward to at high lvl. I sure hope they'd make a quest for a great spell for every mage job at lvl 65 just like a questable weapon skill for the melee and a questable ultimate weapon for each job. But then again, its another wishful dream that everyone has for their own favourite jobs that S-E wouldn't be looking into anytime soon.

Just for the EQ players, It took almost 4 years for Sony entertainment to fix hybrids, how long would you expect S-E to do anything about dragoons if all you do is make posts after posts here about your opinions for upgrade without substantial facts along with your arguements like a comparable statistic between job usefulness in parties. It is only then that your suggestions in my opinion would come into consideration.

p.s i love dragoons and so does anyone that comes into this forum. I just got tired of reading the same stuffs here till i fell asleep reading 1 thread halfway yesterday. Feel free to disagree with me. :sweat:

Moonyaco, what you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I've ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response was there anything that could even be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this forum is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul!

P.S. Should have expected it from a RDM/NIN

[csBahamut]

Moonyaco, what you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I've ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response was there anything that could even be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this forum is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul!

At least he made an atempt at an intelligent discussion.


I don't pay DRG at all(lvl 1 still), but my brother plays DRG. In fact, we play in the same static party. PLD/WAR(me), DRG/WAR(brother), RDM/BLM(sister), WHM/BLM(friend), and THF/NIN(met online. one of the few good players we wanted to stick with) We do perfectly fine leveling(so far). We usually have to be a bit selective on what we level on, and even go away from typical leveling spots. We're not the typical powerhouse party with tons of big damage dealers. I was told we would have problems ater on, and I believe that they mean we will kill a bit slower, but why does that matter? I play this game because I like it, and I want to keep playing it. I don't want to get a game that I can beat in a few days, those are boring. We're going to make it to the 'endgame' by whatever means possible.

Here's our current plans:
1) Find a SAM. Having a Samurai opens up a lot of skillchains to our group besides just THF and DRG distortion. It will also allow us to do 2 renkei per battle. So we don't have a BLM or RNG nuking, so we'll do more smaller damage instead. Having a SAM will allow us to do 2 Light, or 2 Dark renkei per battle(once we get high enough). Then, our WHM and RDM will get to burst twice per battle (I don't think our WHM should be MB'ing so much, but he likes it and has been able to keep up with MP - and minor hate control problems for me, but nothing I can't handle)

2) Find places to level. It's easy to find leveling places listed online, but some of them are crappy now that everyone knows what they are, and overcrowd the spots. Also, these spots work best for they typical party configurations. We're a set party, we have the freedom to explore, and experiment. We won't let the limitations of popularity and big damage numbers limit our ability to enjoy the game. If we're lucky, we'll find some awsome new places that will make DRG truly shine, like it should.


If anyone has any tips or advice to help us accomplish these goals, please feel free to tell us. Just don't come and state "That will never work." or "You're a bunch of retards." Those are NOT helpful remarks. It'll be tough, but why play a game if it was easy? Easy stuff is boring!

[2.0]

So that's why static parties can suck. If you've got gimp party members you're stuck with them.

[csBahamut]

So that's why static parties can suck. If you've got gimp party members you're stuck with them.

Sorry, but again, this does not offer any helpful information. You offer no proof as to why your statement is true. If it's because we kill slow, then your statement is false. We don't have to kill really fast to still enjoy the game. Players spend more time farming that leveling, yet they still complain leveling takes to long? Why rush it. Take it slow and easy. Make it enjoyable. Leveling doesn't have to be an 'exp grind'. You want a quick game, pick up one from the rental store and beat it in a day or two.

[2.0]

[moonyaco]

By Lone Dragon
What the fuck do you mean 'damage boost before dragon kick'? ;/

this is why

Originally posted by Xephoid
MNK is handicapped before 60. In fact, because of 0% ability to do distortion chain (and the fact that you don't fight bones before 67), make them possibly the least desireable melee before 60. They automatically get 2 "no" votes from the THF and the BLM in the party, and the 22497592475 WAR, DRG, SAM, DRK that are LFG gets the pick.

To mix monk and THF in the same party before 60 is... well I don't know what that party is thinking. THF needs to end the distortion skill chain with viperbite. Monk can't start or end it at all befor 60.

I've heard japanese players refusing to invite monks into pts for any reason untill they get dragon kick AND are fighting bone type monsters. From personal experience, i would always choose drgs/rng/thfs/wars instead of monks, drks only if they have sniper rings(sorry, but i just can't stand seeing them miss over and over...period). Basicly, its just an example about other jobs needing improvements too, i'm sure everyone believes their own ones need some upgrades. Let us not stray from the topic.

Moonyaco, what you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I've ever heard. !

Why? please explain...could you show us what isn't? You've "read", not "heard" btw.

At no point in your rambling, incoherent response was there anything that could even be considered a rational thought.!

ok... please enlighten us on this...may i ask what is your defination of rationality?

So that's why static parties can suck. If you've got gimp party members you're stuck with them.

Is this rational? I thought it was just a silly opinion without reasoning. I would suggest that you read the defination of "rational" at www.dictionary.com. I mean its up to you. I intend to argue about drgs not this.

Everyone in this forum is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul!

Right...you're the only clever one..happy now? its "read", not "listened" btw. I apologise if you can't see the point and won't give me any scores. What sin have i commited to require mercy from god? This is no act of blasphemy...

P.S. Should have expected it from a RDM/NIN

i play rdm/blm too in case you feel its so important to be worthy of posting anything. I still get invites, i'm always efficient in pts even when i play rdm/nin, it provides me with some form of amusement cos rdm is a little dull when all you do is refresh/haste/cure. Joining renkei makes it fun and interesting. I have sufficient mana gears and convert+refresh ensures that i always have mana to buff and mb. Anyway, there is no need for personal attacks to undermine another post, it would defeat the purpose of the arguement.

p.s Sorry for straying from the topic..

[2.0]

Originally posted by csBahamut


Sorry, but again, this does not offer any helpful information. You offer no proof as to why your statement is true. If it's because we kill slow, then your statement is false. We don't have to kill really fast to still enjoy the game. Players spend more time farming that leveling, yet they still complain leveling takes to long? Why rush it. Take it slow and easy. Make it enjoyable. Leveling doesn't have to be an 'exp grind'. You want a quick game, pick up one from the rental store and beat it in a day or two.

You're right. Long as you play in your little bubble everything is right as rain. Your party's not that bad. It could be worse by having a RDM/NIN or some other gimp combo.