Brd Psa #2

[Omgwtfbbqkitten]

Re: Brd Psa #2

What Sevv says rings true. I had to spend a bit of time looking for another mage job I actually could enjoy just for the specific fact that it couldn't be 100% overshadowed by whatever else I had. I don't mind that SCH overshadows my BST because SCH is fun. It takes quite a bit of time to find a job proportionate in power and that you can actually enjoy. For a time, I though RDM might be it, but found out I was wrong there. However, at this point I may finish it to 75 just for a little extra leverage against certain jobs.

Aside: Well, the other compelling reason being I need to grind SCH to 75 ASAP and don't want to leave Selphiie hanging w/o a static partner. Plus, I can't pull the "I has no gear for it" card on RDM when SCH has a lot of gear for it.

COR is not so much of a problem, I can get a lot of what I need on the job whenever I play it, I just object the the mindless use of /WHM when there are several better subjobs to use, even at endgame. Gods, Omgea/Ultima and HNMs I'm fine with /WHM. Tell me to /WHM in Limbus, anywhere not Dynamis-Jeuno or other parts of endgame and I'll get a little ticked at you because you're showing me how little you know of the job.

In fact, that's probably my biggest gripe about endgame - I mean, hi2u five new jobs added in the last two years. If you're going to tell me BLU isn't useful at endgame events, I'm going to beat you with a frozen fish. I think a PUP/DNC is going to help a bit in Salvage/Dyna/Limbus. Seriously, lets take some time to rewrite endgame strategy - put down the Zilart/Promathia endgame handbook and let's write a new chapter. The game has changed.

I mean, sure, you can enjoy your PLD's "diorite PTs," but Itaz, you yourself have been scraping and clawing these last several weeks to get anything for your PLD in terms of EXP. You should be more keen the the issue I'm talking about here than anyone.

[Iarendiel]

Re: Brd Psa #2

Looking at the OP, I can't help but feel some BRDs exaggerate their plight. May sound a tad unsympathetic, but, *ahem*:

Spoken like someone who doesn't have a fully leveled Bard.

Grow a spine; learn to say "No."

Demand to be allowed to use other jobs X% of the time, and get promises from the leaders they would use your other Lv.75 jobs--and keep track the record so you can say "No" louder, if necessary. Give yourself a "No BRD" week every now and then, too.

Believe it or not, I think this is done frequently, which is why Bards (at least on my server) have a very bitchy and/or diva (or bardzilla) reputation for being so picky.

Most of all, have fun while you are on BRD.

I don't think that Bards have anything but fun on their Bard when they are playing it when they want to play it. I think that BBQ is merely pointing out the fact that many people take advantage of those who have a Bard, because it's easier to nag someone into coming as Bard, than leveling the job themselves and walking a mile in a Bard's shoes.

For my part, I love Bard. I love being Bard in all situations, and I'm always up for taking my Bard to endgame type stuff. I've actually found myself not enjoying any job as much as I enjoy my Bard. But I completely understand where people are coming from, because I've seen members want to come as one of their other 75 jobs and be told, "Well you would be most useful as Bard, since we don't have as many", or "We could really use you as Bard, please help us out". Who out there with tact is going to still sit there and refuse after those requests? It makes it really hard to not feel bitter against others, especially since those doing the requesting, or making those comments are people who don't have the job leveled themselves, and so don't understand the constant nagging a Bard is already receiving, or they just don't care...which is even worse.

Every player in the game has a right to play their jobs when and how they want. Unfortuantely you can't rely on other players to respect that. You either like it, or lump it.

....or post PSA's.

[Icemage]

Re: Brd Psa #2

Really the problem is that the vast, vast majority of players would rather have cid dripped into their eyeballs than play Bard, but everyone wants one for their parties.

Campaign has alleviated the situation somewhat. Now it's 60 seconds instead of 30 seconds before I get an unsolicited party invitation after changing into Bard without being /anon. :p

Personally I enjoy playing Bard. It's not as multidimensional or hectic as RDM, but it has some intracacies of its own, especially in a faster paced merit party setting.

But that's a far cry from saying I want to roll the dice on random strangers when I want merits/XP, especially when I have access to a perfectly fine LS full of skilled players to draw upon.

Besides that, I'd rather merit on RDM. It's more challenging, and I find that fewer players are able to anchor down the RDM position successfully than BRD, particularly as my RDM is spec'd almost entirely around gaining merits.


Icemage

[Pteryx]

Re: Brd Psa #2

In my endgame/event LS, one person who has BRD sometimes grumbles a bit when asked to come on BRD, but he's actually asked to come as PLD or melee DD job most of the time. Instead, the leader usually brings the BRD when one is needed.

In my Dynamis LS, a quarter of the people seem to just check who's already online and pick which job to bring, mindful that we need crowd control, tanks, and healers. Except for Dynamis Lord, I don't think the leader bothers to tell people what to come as--not even those with BRD75. We auto-magically come with reasonable number of needed jobs most of the time.

In my social/main LS, there are two BRD75's. As far as I can tell, one never gets pestered for merit parties by LS members, and I'm the only person who bugs the other BRD--but she's my sister, so I'm allowed to--in fact, I think I'll finally be able to merit with her BRD for the first time ever this coming Sunday! (Yes, we make an appointment a week in advance when we want to bother our BRDs. ._. )

It sounds like you have an amazing, incredible shell. (Apparently literally incredible, seeing as people here seem to be dismissing your testimony as bullshit without coming out and saying so.) From all I've heard, most endgame shells are not like this; people tend to be far more self-serving. I might actually consider endgame if there were a shell like that on Midgard. -- Pteryx

[Omgwtfbbqkitten]

Re: Brd Psa #2

Besides that, I'd rather merit on RDM. It's more challenging, and I find that fewer players are able to anchor down the RDM position successfully than BRD, particularly as my RDM is spec'd almost entirely around gaining merits.

I'm actually hoping SE cranks BRD up to be a little more busy with that single-target ability they've talked about. This way, buffing would become more intricate for BRDs. In a way, COR already got the fix to thier single target buff issues with /DNC being added. COR has the free time to melee and could apply /DNC far better than a BRD could. The catch is, for /DNC to pan out for things like Aspir Samba, you'd have to take frontline MP users against Aspir-able mobs.

But that's not really a huge catch, there are plenty of Aspir-able mobs to choose from. So COR can feed MP to PLD, BLU or DRK in this way without always having to drop Evoker's on the frontline.

BRD getting a single target fix for their AoEs would go a long way in changing some of the rather rigid, elitist setups we have now. Most particularly, it would help get PLD back in the mix because BRDs would no longer have an excuse to shun them. Busier BRDs mean less time trotting out to pull and that buffs actually stay up, which once again opens the door for jobs like THF to be pullers again. If the ability could be subbed, that actually makes /BRD even more useful as a subjob and less of the novelty sub it is now.

A single target ability doesn't close the door on BRD pulling entirely, but with more buffs to pass around to jobs that need them, BRDs who neglect the needs of their party members will have a harder time going unnoticed.

[Icemage]

Re: Brd Psa #2

It sounds like you have an amazing, incredible shell. (Apparently literally incredible, seeing as people here seem to be dismissing your testimony as bullshit without coming out and saying so.) From all I've heard, most endgame shells are not like this; people tend to be far more self-serving. I might actually consider endgame if there were a shell like that on Midgard. -- Pteryx

There are at least two prominent endgame linkshells like this on Midgardsormr. One is Japanese, one is North American. There's a third that I don't know enough about internally to say for sure, but suspect they're in a similarly healthy situation.


Icemage

[Akashimo]

Re: Brd Psa #2

End game shells are self-serving, because its a time sink, you have competition. Its like a school that promises a job in the end. You have fellow companions at the same time, they're your long run rivals.
______________________________

usier BRDs mean less time trotting out to pull and that buffs actually stay up, which once again opens the door for jobs like THF to be pullers again.

If this ever happens, I'd be a very happy thief. I actually miss pulling for exp/merits, set hate, go back to pull near mob death if no sams, rng or wars in the party.

[Iarendiel]

Re: Brd Psa #2

usier BRDs mean less time trotting out to pull and that buffs actually stay up, which once again opens the door for jobs like THF to be pullers again.

Lol, if that happens I would be such a happy Bard, because I get so tired of pulling. :D

[Olorin401]

Re: Brd Psa #2

Well.. here's my problem.

I'm down to a 4k buffer on my BRD. I need another 26 merits to cap out my BLM stuff, 33 more just to max my INT, and another 5 because I need to max Shellra V. Then I need to start on my BRD, plus my RDM will be 75 in the near future.

And. I. Hate. Colibri. Merit. Parties.

So I'm gonna take your advice on this one BBQ and see if I can get some merit time in @ Castle Oz [S]. Besides.. it's ALWAYS good to have Allied Notes stashed away because Sprinter Boots are teh pwn (at least until I get my Herald's Gaiters)!

[Akashimo]

Re: Brd Psa #2

So I'm gonna take your advice on this one BBQ and see if I can get some merit time in @ Castle Oz [s]. Besides.. it's ALWAYS good to have Allied Notes stashed away because Sprinter Boots are teh pwn (at least until I get my Herald's Gaiters)!

You mean campaign? You can't get allied notes like Conquest points or Imperial Standing by just killing mobs with your signet/sanction/sigil up.

[Omgwtfbbqkitten]

Re: Brd Psa #2

Yeah, Sigil doesn't give Allied Notes at all.

You get all the +hHP/+hMP of Signet and the option to stack Sanction + Campaign buffs in WotG zones with Sigil, that's it. Allied Notes are only obtainable from Campaign and Campaign Ops.

[Silent Howler]

Re: Brd Psa #2

Seriously, lets take some time to rewrite endgame strategy - put down the Zilart/Promathia endgame handbook and let's write a new chapter. The game has changed.

(Yes, please.)

[ItazuraNhomango]

Re: Brd Psa #2

I mean, sure, you can enjoy your PLD's "diorite PTs," but Itaz, you yourself have been scraping and clawing these last several weeks to get anything for your PLD in terms of EXP. You should be more keen the the issue I'm talking about here than anyone.

Er, totally different situations.

I don't expect random strangers to be sensitive to my needs to level/use PLD. Not going to hold a grudge they rather have other jobs for their merit/exp parties.

For a linkshell, though, there is a long term relationship. That means an on-going give and take situation. If a player does enough giving on BRD, the LS should let them take some breaks.

Spoken like someone who doesn't have a fully leveled Bard.

Yep; BRD30--and I couldn't find party for days, last time I was on it.

My sister, though, has BRD75 (and zillion of gear for it). We're in all the same Linkshells: social, endgame/event, and Dynamis. Last few months, she's been on WHM 95% of the time for endgame/event, and bounces between RDM, SMN, and WHM for Dynamis. For social LS's events? BST, WHM, SMN, etc--whichever she thinks it's the best.

I'm not saying a BRD should be a diva and go "I only bring BRD when I want to!" Rather, they should be able to negotiate with their Linkshells so at least they won't be burned out from being stuck on the job.

Who out there with tact is going to still sit there and refuse after those requests?

Good point. Guess my endgame/event LS is just polite; leader doesn't request people use jobs they don't want to use unless it's absolutely needed.

For example, we don't melee burn Kirin, so we usually only use one BRD--a duo boxed character. Sometimes, we just do without a BRD all together. Not everything need a BRD, after all.

It makes it really hard to not feel bitter against others, especially since those doing the requesting, or making those comments are people who don't have the job leveled themselves, and so don't understand the constant nagging a Bard is already receiving, or they just don't care...which is even worse.

>_>;

Not that I'm uncaring, but the my friends who have BRD leveled all find ways to cope. Or, in case of my sister, the problem doesn't even seem to exist.

Every player in the game has a right to play their jobs when and how they want. Unfortuantely you can't rely on other players to respect that. You either like it, or lump it.

Or, negotiate for a happier median, at least within one's Linkshell.

Edit:

It sounds like you have an amazing, incredible shell. (Apparently literally incredible, seeing as people here seem to be dismissing your testimony as bullshit without coming out and saying so.) From all I've heard, most endgame shells are not like this; people tend to be far more self-serving. I might actually consider endgame if there were a shell like that on Midgard. -- Pteryx

Seems like folks are focusing on my endgame/event LS. It's my first such LS, and I joined not because it's incredibly good at getting loot (it's not, lol), but because it's friendly.

While I've no experience what other LS's are like, I see no reason why other LS's can't be accommodating; BRD isn't needed for everything, after all, and keeping members happy is always a good idea.

[Omgwtfbbqkitten]

Re: Brd Psa #2

My sister, though, has BRD75 (and zillion of gear for it). We're in all the same Linkshells: social, endgame/event, and Dynamis. Last few months, she's been on WHM 95% of the time for endgame/event, and bounces between RDM, SMN, and WHM for Dynamis. For social LS's events? BST, WHM, SMN, etc--whichever she thinks it's the best.

I'm not saying a BRD should be a diva and go "I only bring BRD when I want to!" Rather, they should be able to negotiate with their Linkshells so at least they won't be burned out from being stuck on the job.

Again, you're showing how oblivious you actually are. Your sister has a WHM, RDM and a SMN. She has other influential jobs to offset BRD. If you have a tank job or a melee job and have BRD as your support job, ten times out of ten, you will be asked to come BRD.

It takes a certain kind of personality to tolerate being in constant supporting roles, some of us can certainly stand to do it part of the time, but most people cannot stand to do it all the time. They need a catharsis and many endgame LS leaders do not understand this and instead see thier members as a means to an end.

[ItazuraNhomango]

Re: Brd Psa #2

Again, you're showing how oblivious you actually are. Your sister has a WHM, RDM and a SMN. She has other influential jobs to offset BRD. If you have a tank job or a melee job and have BRD as your support job, ten times out of ten, you will be asked to come BRD.

I already mentioned earlier a member of my endgame/event LS has BRD, PLD, and other jobs--he's on BRD only a 1/3 of the time--probably less. While I'm not the most observant person there is, "ten times out ten" is not the fate of our BRDs--not unless they want it to be the case.

What I didn't mention was that LS has no shortage of WHMs.

Oh, and my sister doesn't mind playing BRD at all, AFAIK. It's just lately she's in the healer groove, enjoys it, and the leader rather likes her performance.

If she ever overdose on WHM, we have a guy who's always asking "Can I come as WHM?" anyway, plus bunch of others who have the job ready. Heck, lately, we even have a former(?) member who jumped server--but grabbed a semi-retired member's WHM to play with us.

It takes a certain kind of personality to tolerate being in constant supporting roles, some of us can certainly stand to do it part of the time, but most people cannot stand to do it all the time. They need a catharsis and many endgame LS leaders do not understand this and instead see thier members as a means to an end.

That's a bit sad; how hard is it to understand people like to switch up every so often?


* * *

For those who are in endgame LS's and observe that BRD players never get to use anything else, may I ask how the membership came about? Are you all in those "Apply, and we shall decide if your jobs/gears/experience are useful to us, then we may let you in" kind of LS's?

If so, I guess it's "How can we use you?" from day one, and it may be harder to say "No".

The endgame/event LS I'm in was originally a social LS, and doesn't have a "We're all just guns for hire" mentality. (Otherwise, with only a thinly merited RDM75 and mostly cheap-ish AH gear a few months back, I would have never made it in. )

That may be one reason why we don't abuse our members by insisting they be stuck on "optimal" jobs 24/7; "The BRDs" get to play WHM, SMN, PLD, NIN, and etc., while our previously NIN main tank is now PLD 95% of the time. The leader himself keep switching between PLD, NIN, RDM, THF, BRD, and whatever as well--often to accommodate what the members want to go to event as.