KH Re: Coded release date

[Omgwtfbbqkitten]

Re: KH Re: Coded release date

Is Reconnect: Kingdom Hearts the new name for Re:Coded since it never got a US release anyway?

Also, do they really need to rescue all the nobodies? Just Axel and (somehow) Xion would be enough for me.

Xigbar is kinda cool in a total bastard kind of way, though. Kinda glad he was the one that got the most screen time of Organization XIII. I hated how you just kinda met him and offed him in KH2.

Still, there's one nagging thing about Braig/Xigbar that doesn't sit right with me.

There was a point in 358/2 Days where he flipped out at Xion because he saw Ventus in her. Still curious why he would get frustrated with Ventus when he faced Terra and Aqua.

[Gobo]

Re: KH Re: Coded release date

Is Reconnect: Kingdom Hearts the new name for Re:Coded since it never got a US release anyway?

Also, do they really need to rescue all the nobodies? Just Axel and (somehow) Xion would be enough for me.

Xigbar is kinda cool in a total bastard kind of way, though. Kinda glad he was the one that got the most screen time of Organization XIII. I hated how you just kinda met him and offed him in KH2.

Still, there's one nagging thing about Braig/Xigbar that doesn't sit right with me.

There was a point in 358/2 Days where he flipped out at Xion because he saw Ventus in her. Still curious why he would get frustrated with Ventus when he faced Terra and Aqua.

No, its just the Fan name people are giving the secret scene from Re:Coded.

Yeah, they all have to be rescued, at least according to Ansem, since he felt like he wronged them all.

Probably the same reason he pointed out to Sora "He (Ventus) always used to give me the same look." Yet Ventus glared at him once. There was something in that instance that really caused Braig to get pissed at Ven and it lingered in Xigbar.

Now my question for you BBQ

We know now that Roxas looks like Ventus because Sora houses Ven's heart and Roxas took "data" from that as well as Sora when he was born. But, did Roxas also take Ven's heart too?

At that point in time, Sora had proven himself enough to perform a right of succession without a keyblade master, so he didn't need Ven's heart to use a Keyblade. Roxas also shows true emotion, something he shouldn't be able to as a nobody. We also know that Sora was only had half his power until Roxas returned to him. Sora can dual wield because of Ventus's heart, but Roxas also could after he merged with Xion. Not stating my opinion, just what we know.

[Omgwtfbbqkitten]

Re: KH Re: Coded release date

Gobo's question

We know now that Roxas looks like Ventus because Sora houses Ven's heart and Roxas took "data" from that as well as Sora when he was born. But, did Roxas also take Ven's heart too?

I think that if they're looking for a cosmic loophole to bring Ventus back to life, that Roxas gaining Ventus' heart from Sora would be it.

Remember the charm Aqua cast on Kairi? That was the thing that allowed not only her heart to remain protected, but what brought Sora back from being a Heartless. Not long after you have Roxas as a Nobody, but showing emotion. I think Roxas is Ventus' heart, just no memories. He also has no memory of his previous life, but all the other Nobodies have memories of their previous lives, as its the only point of reference they have to emulate emotions as they have no hearts.

And Axel knows of Ventus, he made a promise to be his friend. He knows from dealing with Roxas and Xion that things just don't add up about them as nobodies. He uncovers the truth about Xion, that she's a replica, but later knows to get his friends back that Sora is the key. When he can't get Roxas out of him, he simply chooses to help Sora.

Did Axel know Ventus' resting place is within CO? Probably not. Xemnas knows there's something hidden there based on him sending the Organization turn the place upside down a few times. He knows everything that Xehanort's Heartless know, that where CO stands is where Eraqus once taught his pupils.

Nobodies don't seem to suffer the consequences of memory loss in that place, only people with hearts do, Aqua being the sole execption.

Roxas could probably exist separate from Sora inside CO, but without Aqua, there's no way anyone can find the body of Ventus.

But Namine was also technically born from Sora's heart and can affect his memories, she might also be required to awaken Ventus. Roxas has the heart, but Namine has the memores. And Ventus has memories stored inside of Sora whether he is aware of them or not. And without the story of Coded, Sora can't be aware of Xion even, even though she, too, is part of him.

I think to bring Ventus back you'll need Aqua, Namine, Kairi, Roxas, Xion and Sora to be involved. I think Riku also inherited part of Terra's spirit through Xehanort's Heartless, so he may be needed as well.

Sadly, I think I've just spoiled all future KH games with my own speculation.

[Gobo]

Re: KH Re: Coded release date

Gobo's question

I think that if they're looking for a cosmic loophole to bring Ventus back to life, that Roxas gaining Ventus' heart from Sora would be it.

Remember the charm Aqua cast on Kairi? That was the thing that allowed not only her heart to remain protected, but what brought Sora back from being a Heartless. Not long after you have Roxas as a Nobody, but showing emotion. I think Roxas is Ventus' heart, just no memories. He also has no memory of his previous life, but all the other Nobodies have memories of their previous lives, as its the only point of reference they have to emulate emotions as they have no hearts.

And Axel knows of Ventus, he made a promise to be his friend. He knows from dealing with Roxas and Xion that things just don't add up about them as nobodies. He uncovers the truth about Xion, that she's a replica, but later knows to get his friends back that Sora is the key. When he can't get Roxas out of him, he simply chooses to help Sora.

Did Axel know Ventus' resting place is within CO? Probably not. Xemnas knows there's something hidden there based on him sending the Organization turn the place upside down a few times. He knows everything that Xehanort's Heartless know, that where CO stands is where Eraqus once taught his pupils.

Nobodies don't seem to suffer the consequences of memory loss in that place, only people with hearts do, Aqua being the sole execption.

Roxas could probably exist separate from Sora inside CO, but without Aqua, there's no way anyone can find the body of Ventus.

But Namine was also technically born from Sora's heart and can affect his memories, she might also be required to awaken Ventus. Roxas has the heart, but Namine has the memores. And Ventus has memories stored inside of Sora whether he is aware of them or not. And without the story of Coded, Sora can't be aware of Xion even, even though she, too, is part of him.

I think to bring Ventus back you'll need Aqua, Namine, Kairi, Roxas, Xion and Sora to be involved. I think Riku also inherited part of Terra's spirit through Xehanort's Heartless, so he may be needed as well.

Sadly, I think I've just spoiled all future KH games with my own speculation.

Reply

Aqua's spell only prevented Kairi from being lost in the lanes between. It guided her to someone with light who would be able to protect her (Sora). Since Kairi is a pure light being, that is what brought Sora back as well as their connection.

The no memory thing was explained well back in KH2. Sora was a heartless for such a brief time, nothing of his past made it to Roxas. (some will argue Sora was a heartless until Roxas rejoined him). Same with Namine. She was born from Kairi's heart and Sora's Body and soul, which is why she has power over his memories and everyone connected to him.

It's Namine

who finds that Sora is connected to Terra, Ven and Aqua as she finds these bits of his past as a kid when she repairs the damage she did

I doubt Roxas could even set 3 feet in CO. Sure Sora was there, but he was also close to Ventus, his other somebody. Going back there will likely cause the same reaction as it did in Days. And the memory loss was purely Namine being forced to fuck with Sora, Donald and Goofy's heads

I agree it will take at least Aqua to find Ven again and Riku to find Terra. However, I also wonder if Vanitas will show up again. And if so, will he have contaminated everyone who is connected to Sora/Ventus, making multiple copies of himself? Then again, I just like Vanitas.

[Omgwtfbbqkitten]

Re: KH Re: Coded release date

Stuff about Terra, Aqua, Ventus, Sora, Kairi and Riku

Aqua is certainly the key to getting to Ven, but I doubt there's much left of Terra to revive. Xehanort's Heartless was purged from Riku in Ansem's little explosion in KH2, there's nothing left of Xemnas, either. As far as Terra's body goes its just gone unless Xehanort's Heartless found his way into Ansem the Wise through that explosion (entirely possible).

Vanitas could come back, I suppose, as awful as the doppelganger trope is it seems to run all through the series. I guess Sora needs one too.

If I have to deal with Vanitas ever again, they better keep the system BBS had. I'm rather fond of Mine Square just because it has a way of dealing with teleport-happy jerks like him. The reversal system, too.

[Gobo]

Re: KH Re: Coded release date

Stuff about Terra, Aqua, Ventus, Sora, Kairi and Riku

Aqua is certainly the key to getting to Ven, but I doubt there's much left of Terra to revive. Xehanort's Heartless was purged from Riku in Ansem's little explosion in KH2, there's nothing left of Xemnas, either. As far as Terra's body goes its just gone unless Xehanort's Heartless found his way into Ansem the Wise through that explosion (entirely possible).

Vanitas could come back, I suppose, as awful as the doppelganger trope is it seems to run all through the series. I guess Sora needs one too.

If I have to deal with Vanitas ever again, they better keep the system BBS had. I'm rather fond of Mine Square just because it has a way of dealing with teleport-happy jerks like him. The reversal system, too.

Heh, his Lingering Spirit is a fucking pain in the ass. Only has 1 HP bar, but has stats out the wazoo and gives little to no breathing room. Best I've gotten in 1/2 of his HP with Aqua, though I was level 36 at the time.

Riku and Terra

But why I say Riku will be part of the way to find Terra is that Riku is Terra's successor. Terra's Lingering Sentiment (his mind and emotions) still exists in the graveyard. I'm sure we'll get to visit that again. Hopefully not fight it through, once was enough XD.

It would also be interesting for Vanitas to return because his face could take form of whomever touches ven's heart. Evil Kairi anyone?

[Omgwtfbbqkitten]

Re: KH Re: Coded release date

Riku and Terra

But why I say Riku will be part of the way to find Terra is that Riku is Terra's successor. Terra's Lingering Sentiment (his mind and emotions) still exists in the graveyard. I'm sure we'll get to visit that again. Hopefully not fight it through, once was enough XD.

It would also be interesting for Vanitas to return because his face could take form of whomever touches ven's heart. Evil Kairi anyone?

Its just that

There's no body for Terra to go back to that I know of - unless he likes living in his bodiless armor -because Xehanort's Heartless and Xemnas were destroyed. We always knew Riku was Terra's successor before BBS came along,

I don't think Terra will ever fully return. He may be as players first met him in KH2 Final Mix and be someone that continues to haunt the graveyard for all time. His placement at the end of the story seemed quite iconic to me.

[Gobo]

Re: KH Re: Coded release date

Its just that

There's no body for Terra to go back to that I know of - unless he likes living in his bodiless armor -because Xehanort's Heartless and Xemnas were destroyed. We always knew Riku was Terra's successor before BBS came along,

I don't think Terra will ever fully return. He may be as players first met him in KH2 Final Mix and be someone that continues to haunt the graveyard for all time. His placement at the end of the story seemed quite iconic to me.

hmm

A ghost as a warning. I guess we'll see. I do wonder what other "paths" Master Xehanort had planned in case the take over of Terra failed. I doubt he could have known of how to become a Heartless (and a nobody, since they weren't known of, at least as far as we know, until shortly before KH1).

[Omgwtfbbqkitten]

Re: KH Re: Coded release date

Well, at any rate, I'm hoping Maleficent and the Heartless start getting a bit more screentime instead of having to be second-string baddies. I know that whole "we'll help the good guys for as long as it serves our ends" anime trope pretty much damns them to being second stringers, but c'mon, Maleficent is THE Disney baddie to end them all.

You know what really bugged me about BBS, though?

No High-ho. We go to Snow White's world, we see the dwarves go off to the mines and they do so without the High-ho song? We don't even get to hear it as a theme for the level. Total wasted opportunity.

And as far as each world went, Stitch, Hercules, and Peter Pan got all the best stories. I was really hoping for a bit more out of the Snow White, Cinderella and Sleeping Beauty worlds. Of those three, Cinderella fared the best

If there's one thing that always has bugged me about KH, part of what makes these worlds they visit so classic is the music. Then there's just stuff like seeing the entire evolution of Belle and Beast's relationship without Gaston and Lafou showing up at all. And Gaston is one of those "glorious bastard" kinds of villains, too. He even has a bastardly theme.

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fhG9hKiplfQ]YouTube - Beauty and The Beast - Gaston[/ame]

That reminds me, I'm grabbing that BD this week. I don't have a player, I just want it.

Its just like they saved the "musical" stuff for the Little Mermaid.

Hell, I'll be royally pissed if they do Princess and the Frog and there's no focus on music. In respect to that movie, avoiding it is just incomprehensible. It would be like doing Stitch in Hawaii without working in an Elvis tune.

[Gobo]

Re: KH Re: Coded release date

Well, at any rate, I'm hoping Maleficent and the Heartless start getting a bit more screentime instead of having to be second-string baddies. I know that whole "we'll help the good guys for as long as it serves our ends" anime trope pretty much damns them to being second stringers, but c'mon, Maleficent is THE Disney baddie to end them all.

You know what really bugged me about BBS, though?

No High-ho. We go to Snow White's world, we see the dwarves go off to the mines and they do so without the High-ho song? We don't even get to hear it as a theme for the level. Total wasted opportunity.

And as far as each world went, Stitch, Hercules, and Peter Pan got all the best stories. I was really hoping for a bit more out of the Snow White, Cinderella and Sleeping Beauty worlds. Of those three, Cinderella fared the best

If there's one thing that always has bugged me about KH, part of what makes these worlds they visit so classic is the music. Then there's just stuff like seeing the entire evolution of Belle and Beast's relationship without Gaston and Lafou showing up at all. And Gaston is one of those "glorious bastard" kinds of villains, too. He even has a bastardly theme.

YouTube - Beauty and The Beast - Gaston

That reminds me, I'm grabbing that BD this week. I don't have a player, I just want it.

Its just like they saved the "musical" stuff for the Little Mermaid.

Hell, I'll be royally pissed if they do Princess and the Frog and there's no focus on music. In respect to that movie, avoiding it is just incomprehensible. It would be like doing Stitch in Hawaii without working in an Elvis tune.

Maleficent gets some screen time in Coded, but she is not the main antagonist (who it is, is rather interesting).

Yeah, I was really looking foward to hi-ho. Shit Jessie McCartney was a pop singer, so he could have sung along. Haily Joel Osment sung in KH2, which I was painfully reminded of last night replaying KH2.

There were some nice deviations form the plots of the classic 3 for BbS. The whole escort with Snow White was basically an expansion of a 20 second bit in the movie. Killing off Lady Tremaine and the sisters was a bit surprising though.

They redid Little Mermaid, so I am sure they could add Gaston in KH3.

Hmm worlds for KH3. P&F for sure. Probably will revisit Pirates too. Beauty and the Beast with a Gaston plot? There is all of Pixar to explore. The Muppets are owned by Disney too. Pocahontas and Hunchback haven't been done yet. Could do Tangled as well, since that is getting released this fall. Lilo and Stitch could be done, since Stitch has a connection to the BbS trio.

[Kailea]

Re: KH Re: Coded release date

funny how many people see KH as a kid game since it has to do with Disney characters....and they fail to see how really deep and complicated it is. Get people all the time in the store, "oh that looks like a kids game" and all I can do is blink and stare at them for a moment.

[TheGrandMom]

Re: KH Re: Coded release date

funny how many people see KH as a kid game since it has to do with Disney characters....and they fail to see how really deep and complicated it is. Get people all the time in the store, "oh that looks like a kids game" and all I can do is blink and stare at them for a moment.

This happens with Pokemon all the time...

[Omgwtfbbqkitten]

Re: KH Re: Coded release date

They redid Little Mermaid, so I am sure they could add Gaston in KH3.

Beast turned human by the end of KH2, I believe. Unless they screw with it so somehow he reverts, I can't see it happening. They may just be done with Beauty and the Beast unless they need Belle and the princesses again for something.

Stitch they can continue with since we really only got the first half of his story, which worked fine on its own.

They'll have plenty of excuses to revisit Tron, that was a real treat for a lot of people the last time around.

Hercules will just always be a part of KH, even with the storyarch being done. Just toss in a new SE character to guest in there.

[Gobo]

Re: KH Re: Coded release date

Beast turned human by the end of KH2, I believe. Unless they screw with it so somehow he reverts, I can't see it happening. They may just be done with Beauty and the Beast unless they need Belle and the princesses again for something.

Stitch they can continue with since we really only got the first half of his story, which worked fine on its own.

They'll have plenty of excuses to revisit Tron, that was a real treat for a lot of people the last time around.

Hercules will just always be a part of KH, even with the storyarch being done. Just toss in a new SE character to guest in there.

I wonder if the Tron revival has to do with KH2. I'll be honest (and I will probably get flack for this) but I had no idea what Tron was until KH2.

And sure they can screw with Beast. I mean, Ursala was killed in KH1 and she appears to be perfectly fine in KH2. If they want to add more B&tB, they will find a way.

[Ketaru]

Re: KH Re: Coded release date

funny how many people see KH as a kid game since it has to do with Disney characters....and they fail to see how really deep and complicated it is. Get people all the time in the store, "oh that looks like a kids game" and all I can do is blink and stare at them for a moment.

"Deep" and "complicated" aren't really the words I would use to describe Kingdom Hearts. Merely well-told. I'd sooner say that Kingdom Hearts is an example of how a simple stories that are palatable for children need not be pandering or dumbed down for their sake.

The series certainly has a lot of stuff to memorize and take into consideration in its story, but I often play and wonder how much of it is thought out in advance and how much of it is made up as they go along. There are parts of the stories that seem to be intentionally left questionable to leave things open to a sequel.

Stuff

For example, in the very first game, I always felt uncomfortable with the idea that the Ansem you battle in it is really the true Ansem. Dialogue in the game described Ansem as an older man, not the one we've come to know as Xehanort's Heartless. The Ansem's Reports also describe a friendship with Mickey Mouse, and somehow Mickey beings friends with Xehanort's Heartless seemed so terribly unlikely. The Ansem's Reports also sound as if they were written by somebody who wished to keep the darkness from destroying his world, not somebody who would invite it in.

Nonetheless, I'd be surprised if concepts in the series like Terra, Master Xehanort, or the Keyblade Wars were even on the table at the time of Kingdom Hearts I. It is engaging because it's well told, but it isn't all that original. The relationship between Terra and Xehanort was uncomfortably a lot like watching Star Wars: Revenge of the Sith.

Telling the story with honesty and conviction goes a long way too. The story of Kingdom Hearts seems like it genuinely believes in its theme of faith in friendship (which always seem to come in 3s: Sora-Donald-Goofy, Sora-Riku-Kairi, Terra-Aqua-Ventus, Roxas-Axel-Xion). You've got characters facing great dangers for the sake of friendship. You've got character defying authority for the sake of friendship. You've got characters making morally ambiguous decisions for the sake of friendship. And you've got characters sacrificing self for the sake of friendship. It's a subject common in stories for kids, but seldom an important element in an epic about the fight between good and evil. Liken it to how key the character interactions in Lord of the Rings is to the story.

Also deceptive is the difficulty level of the series. Using preconceived notions of Disney and just going by the cover art, it is so easy to reason that the game is intended for kids, only to be confronted by the surprising difficulty level of some enemies in the games. I don't know anybody else, but trying to beat Xehanort as Aqua infuriated me at how flawlessly you have to approach that final battle. Granted, I was playing on the third hardest difficulty level, so I can't say how weak he might be in the easiest version.

Even in the first Kingdom Hearts, I remember originally having a lot of difficulty with the very first Guard Armor boss and Trickmaster boss, even in the normal mode.

More Stuff

I agree Aqua felt more like the main character.

My rationale for that was that she was the only character that felt like an outside interference in the grand scheme Xehanort cooked up. Speculation that Terra was somehow the Xehanort in the future games floated around the internet for a while. So when you play his storyline and see him performing villainous deeds and succumbing to darkness within him, it felt more like watching a tragedy unfold than a story of heroism. Ventus was an integral part of the plan and, as you go through his story, it seemed more like he was being yanked along, falling right into the trap. Playing Aqua's storyline, it never felt like she was being anybody's fool.

I agree with you 2 on this one. Aqua ended up being my favorite character.