FF13 and FF vs 13

[Cometgreen]

Re: FF13 and FF vs 13

Concerning the possibility of a 360 port: Though I'm not all that excited about FFXIII right now, it would be great to know I have the opportunity to play it on the off-chance it is good. I love me some Final Fantasy, but it's not worth $660 to me.

[Manatra]

Re: FF13 and FF vs 13

This has never been done in a FF before, along with FF players previously complaining that SE never makes sequel to a story line. Well now you got your wish and what do you do? You bitch about it, WTF? It seems it's true, a pure Utopia is only possible in solitude. Which I find quite sad, since it's a pretty lonely living style.

We aren't complaining, or at least I'm not. But based on Squaresoft's recent track record with this compilation and sequel business, I am expressing deep concerns with the way this project could turn out. This is especially true in the light of FFX-2 and Dirge of Cerberus, which I would go so far as to say that they are the biggest embarrassments to the Final Fantasy name since Mystic Quest.

The other concern I have is that the more sequels and spinoffs that Squaresoft makes, the more they cheapen the Final Fantasy brand. I mean, look at Resident Evil in the period after RE2. It took awhile for the franchise to regain its footing in light of the number of spinoffs that were made.

[Macht]

Re: FF13 and FF vs 13

We aren't complaining, or at least I'm not. But based on Squaresoft's recent track record with this compilation and sequel business, I am expressing deep concerns with the way this project could turn out. This is especially true in the light of FFX-2 and Dirge of Cerberus, which I would go so far as to say that they are the biggest embarrassments to the Final Fantasy name since Mystic Quest.
The other concern I have is that the more sequels and spinoffs that Squaresoft makes, the more they cheapen the Final Fantasy brand. I mean, look at Resident Evil in the period after RE2. It took awhile for the franchise to regain its footing in light of the number of spinoffs that were made.

Your consern though is exactly what SquareEnix put up as their reasoning before for not making sequals to a story. Not sure if it was the gamers or the money hungry pigs that provide them the money to produce it that just didn't care. Either way one of the two swatted it away, get the feeling it might of been both.

Though really also have to remember FFX-2 and Dirge of Cerberus were created as after-thoughts. Generally the after-thought types tend to stink badly, not quite sure why. This one though the story line looks to of been plotted out before-hand, now it's just a matter of the developers getting it right.

[Omgwtfbbqkitten]

Re: FF13 and FF vs 13

Next off naming the 3 titles FFXIII, this is suppose to a single world viewed by three perspectives uniquelly. This has never been done in a FF before, along with FF players previously complaining that SE never makes sequel to a story line. Well now you got your wish and what do you do? You bitch about it, WTF? It seems it's true, a pure Utopia is only possible in solitude. Which I find quite sad, since it's a pretty lonely living style.

Actually, the first world to get multiple re-visits was Invalice.

Final Fantasy Tactics - 1997 (The Lion War for PSP 2007)
Vagrant Story - 2000
Final Fantasy Tactics Advance - 2003
Final Fantasy XII - 2006
Final Fantasy XII: Revenant Wings - April 2007 (Japan)
Final Fantasy Tactics Advance II - 2007?

With the exception of VS, all of these titles are under the umbrella of the Invalice Alliance project. Invalice is a large world and has been seen from many perspectives already. It has been seen from perspective of government agents, young men who signed up to fight for their countries, the cast of FFXII and even from the perpective of a children in a dreamworld version of the realm based on a book that told Invalice's history.

Its been done before and right now, its being done better. People can complain all they want about FFX-2, but its not a total mess like Compilation of Final Fantasy VII. A common problem CoFFVII and FFXIII already share is the cell phone game problem. Before Crisis and this FFXIII game as cell-phone-only are incredibly STUPID ideas. Yeah, Japanese people love cell phone games, Americans don't and I don't think EU players do, either.

Put these games on platforms were they'll be widely acceessable and at least get a chance to become classic games. Cell phone games are a waste of potential. I don't think Before Crisis ever even came stateside. I want to play it, but damn, put in on DS or PSP at least.

As far as KH and KH2's play if you didn't go for the Final Mix versions, then there is more content and other stuff that was intended for the game you've missed. This content does tend to flesh out the game more and make it more intresting, just again capitalizm and impatience skrews something again.

Content from Final Mix is a remake of Chain of Memories, mostly. If you missed Chain of Memories before, you probably chose to do so because you didn't want to get a GBA to play it. Those that did play it knew at least half of what the hell was going on in KHII.

As for as how Kingdom Hearts plays, the console versions' gameplay was a bad joke at best. Chain of Memories was the one with the gameplay. So if Final Mix does hit the states some gamers will finally get to play an installment with actual gameplay and not just buttonmashing.

Finally to comment on is the Shiva and motorcycle bit. Taking the concepts of how the developers have been going with FFX, FFXI, and FFXII I would think that Shiva will not be the bike perse but would operate more as the bikes power source and probably brain. Thinking more like her essence "haunts" the object. Also to add from what I've read an all it sounds like Nomura was using that only as an example. He did state that the summons would be different and not restricted to an element as well.

FFX and FFXI gave us Shiva as a directly controllable summon and not just a one-shot attack, that's not really a radical change, but an enjoyable evolution. Shiva in FFXII is a battleship, ice summon duties got passed on to another directly-controllable esper of the same element. Problems here? None.

Shiva as a motorcycle? Thats OK if its just a motorcycle. Fenrir was a motorcycle once, but he was always a motorcycle in FFVII, he didn't turn into one. What's really going on here is a direct rip-off of what other games do. Alternative functions for summoned beasts are more Shin Megami Tensei and Pokemon than they are Final Fantasy. FF shouldn't need to rip-off other franchises.

Mostly, I'm just tired of Nomura and Kitase being at the helm of the series. A new perspective is needed and these guys just don't have it.

I think Nomura is an awesome artist, but he needs to be freed from Final Fantasy for a while. I'm actually looking forward to the DS game he and the KH team are doing. It looks original and fun. Nomura has a knack for putting together a nice story, too. Its just Kitase's stories are so ... emo. And Nomura's bondage-gear-clad heroes make it way too emo.

Matsuno was actually pushing the series in a very mature and natural direction with Invalice and FFXII, something we haven't seen in quite some time. Too bad it looks like he's left SE. Supposedy he's doing something for Wii with another company in the future.

FFXII's shift in gameplay has been said to be radical, but I think it was just a natural evolution to what existed before. FFXIII seems to be going for the drastic change of KH-style action-RPG, which isn't needed or appreciated in the slightest.

[Feba]

Re: FF13 and FF vs 13

bbq, don't you mean Ivalice?

Anyway, the only reason i'm posting in this thread:

only seen it on Gtech TV

NEVER call it that again. G4 TV has NOTHING to do with Tech TV anymore. G4 took everything that was good from Tech TV, ate it, and fed it back to the viewers as excrement. G4 is now little more than a monster that goes around eating up the hopes and interests of ACTUAL geeks and nerds in a quest to make a quick buck.

They might as well call it Spike2.


For FF13, i'll try to reserve judgement until I've seen more of it an give a damn. Personally i'm waiting for Reverent Wings to give me an excuse to buy a DS.

[Macht]

Re: FF13 and FF vs 13

Content from Final Mix is a remake of Chain of Memories, mostly. If you missed Chain of Memories before, you probably chose to do so because you didn't want to get a GBA to play it. Those that did play it knew at least half of what the hell was going on in KHII.
As for as how Kingdom Hearts plays, the console versions' gameplay was a bad joke at best. Chain of Memories was the one with the gameplay. So if Final Mix does hit the states some gamers will finally get to play an installment with actual gameplay and not just buttonmashing.

Ehh, not like you needed to play Chain of Memories to figure out it's story from KH2. I mean they couldn't make it more obvious that Sora has met the orginization members but his memories were taken away. From the conversation and intro seems Nomine had a part in it.

Heck story even talks about rikku and how he had confronted Roxas before. The game gave enough info for you to at least get the jist of Chain of Memories story. Also the Final Mix isn't just mostly a remake of Chain of Memories, they also added more content and even more battles.

I mean the obvious one that anyone could see is that they added in an actual battle between Sora and Roxas instead of just being a cutscene (That battle looks like it'll be crazy, Roxas had 2 full rows of health). They added Reaction commands to the part of the game that is Chain of Memories, along with other changes.

As far as attacking Nomura, I really wouldn't target him so much about that. After all it's the whole capitalizm structure that tends to bastardize things. Nomura is just doing what is basically part of his job and make a game that'll have a potential appeal. What's the safest way to go with doing this? Just find what is popular in current culture and run with that. If you want to be pissed at someone then you should be pissed at the ones that would be pushing him to make games with good sale potential and don't give a damn if it is bastardizing.

I mean in that respect you could say the same with FFXI, were some go stating it's a cheap knock-off of EQ. Really aside from the base structure that just about any MMO follows I can't see that relation they speak of. Like I stated at the beginning no matter how much you want to say otherwise, the company has please those holding their stocks and providing them the money to make money first. Unless you are ok with the games going well over a $100 price mark, so that they might be able to sustain themselves.

[Omgwtfbbqkitten]

Re: FF13 and FF vs 13

It needs to come out in the US at any rate <.< People only got a gist of what happend in CoM, but you were pretty oblivious to the other members of Organization XIII and what went on with Riku otherwise.

[Macht]

Re: FF13 and FF vs 13

It needs to come out in the US at any rate <.< People only got a gist of what happend in CoM, but you were pretty oblivious to the other members of Organization XIII and what went on with Riku otherwise.

Not really the others of Organization XIII are talked about in the notes when you get to "The Land that Never Was". So I did read some detail about the ones that were defeated in CoM. All of the members defeated in CoM had a little detail about them on the game. So I did get some bits a pieces here and there about Zexion, Maluxea, Lexaeus, and Vexen. From parts of it they do suggest there was loyalty issues within the organization, and it's probably what lead Rikku into accepting the darkness.

I wouldn't be surprised by Axel's behavior that he probably conspired against Zexion. May not know the exact details, but the game did provide enough info to make logical guesses.

[Omgwtfbbqkitten]

Re: FF13 and FF vs 13

Not really the others of Organization XIII are talked about in the notes when you get to "The Land that Never Was". So I did read some detail about the ones that were defeated in CoM. All of the members defeated in CoM had a little detail about them on the game. So I did get some bits a pieces here and there about Zexion, Maluxea, Lexaeus, and Vexen. From parts of it they do suggest there was loyalty issues within the organization, and it's probably what lead Rikku into accepting the darkness.

I wouldn't be surprised by Axel's behavior that he probably conspired against Zexion. May not know the exact details, but the game did provide enough info to make logical guesses.

A smattering of details in a beastiary doesn't exactly equal to fleshing out a character and diologue. There's a whole side to the Riku part of the story that isn't even touched upon in KH2. The Organization was merely a background element to his story and the consquence of the primary conflict was out of left field if you jumped straight to KH2, even if you did pick up on it in the middle of the game.

[Macht]

Re: FF13 and FF vs 13

A smattering of details in a beastiary doesn't exactly equal to fleshing out a character and diologue. There's a whole side to the Riku part of the story that isn't even touched upon in KH2. The Organization was merely a background element to his story and the consquence of the primary conflict was out of left field if you jumped straight to KH2, even if you did pick up on it in the middle of the game.

Out of left field? What they did talk about a small bit of Rikku being defeated and it leading him to accept the darkness to gain more power. Even stated that he did it to help Sora, so just finding the gaps that don't fit in KH and KH2 you can figure parts of it to of been CoM. With how they tried to manipulate Roxas and Sora I would guess they did something along the lines with Rikku. They saw him as a pawn to use and when he did his job they tried to get rid of him because he was likely to much of a threat.

Not rocket science to understand the behavior of "Like begets like".

I mean it's even the same with Malifecent, the comments she makes when she reaches that castle suggests she's been there before. So it's like she must of been there before, don't recall seeing it in KH so it had to be CoM, along with how Pete's behavior is towards Sora in KH2 and his relation there between Maleficent it suggests that Sora probably wasn't the one to kill her in CoM. With the story on KH2 it only leaves two other potentials to of done that, being Mickey or Rikku.

Since in large part Disney's character play a sort of sub-role my bet would be that Rikku was the one to do Maleficent in. Unless they really threw something out of left field and had an organization member dispose of her because she's probably a useless pawn to them around that point.

[Pai Pai Master]

Re: FF13 and FF vs 13

Pfft. Just play RE: Chain of Memories this fall and get a chance to catch up. At least the gameplay in that will be better than KH2. -.-;

[Omgwtfbbqkitten]

Re: FF13 and FF vs 13

I'd dissect what Macht said, but I'd end up spoiling a lot and that's not fun.

[Omgwtfbbqkitten]

Re: FF13 and FF vs 13

New Patent just cropped up the other day:

Final Fantasy Haerisis XIII

"Haerisis" means an adherance to a religious opinion contrary to church dogma or a dissent or deviation from a dominant theory. There was such a theme in FFX.

There is also said to be two more games in this FFXIII series, four of six known so far. Hopefully SE won't be stupid enough to keep the cell phone game exclusive to cell phones this time.

[Macht]

Re: FF13 and FF vs 13

New Patent just cropped up the other day:
Final Fantasy Haerisis XIII
"Haerisis" means an adherance to a religious opinion contrary to church dogma or a dissent or deviation from a dominant theory. There was such a theme in FFX.
There is also said to be two more games in this FFXIII series, four of six known so far. Hopefully SE won't be stupid enough to keep the cell phone game exclusive to cell phones this time.

Well since they are creating the cell phone one with 3D Models it would seem a bit silly to keep it cell phone only. Kind of a waste of time and programming to spend that much time for a cell phone only game.

[Pai Pai Master]

Re: FF13 and FF vs 13

Dunno, Before Crisis did extremely well in Japan so it's unlikely they'll put Agito on anything other than mobile phones. It's supposedly a very similar game.

Haeresis is probably either gonna be a 360 exclusive or a Wii exclusive. It's unlikely they'll do another PS3-only FFXIII game any time soon. Either that or it's this next MMORPG they're working on for 360, Vista and PS3.