Xbox 360 gets soft start in Japan

[Jarre]

Re: Xbox 360 gets soft start in Japan

I managed to get hold of the presentations for both teh xbox360 and teh playstation 3. The playstation literaly wiped the floor with the xbox. The graphics for a start, processing power, PS3 having bluetooth controllers and look what games are up for offer, plus the fact that you can backwards compatible PS2 games on it (something the xbox can't do so I've been told). The PS2 graphics core is more powerfull than 2 GForce 7800 ultra pro graphics cards in SLI configeration (until recently the most powerfull graphics cards availiable on mainstreem for pc's.) Plus the fact that there was talks of the graphics engine being so supieror, square are considering the next FF installment for the PS3 rather than the xbox. Just a note, the PS2 still hasn't been fullfilled fully power wise and FFXII being released for the PS2 with its brilliant graphics, some of the ps2 new games are at the stage of what half of the xbox360 games will be, plus there is some interesting RPG's thats going to be released in the future.

[Macht]

Re: Xbox 360 gets soft start in Japan

Well Jarre, your info is partly correct on both sides.

PS3 is backwards compatible with PS and PS2 games. Also unlike the PS2 its running in a full emulation were it's capable of supporting all of the PS and PS2 games. The Xbox 360 is backward compatible too, but it is limited to select few (Of course Halo and Halo2 will be, M$ not dumb enough to ignore those two).

Yes the XBox is crushed in almost every aspect vs. the PS3. Even in the processor design the XBox is going with Multi-Processor in which relies heavily on the coding to properly take advantage of the processors. The PS3 however has 1 PowerPC Processor that dishes out data to be processed to the 1 up to nth Synergetic Core (Yes, the number of Synergetic Cores in each system is expandable by either devices build or by access to other devices with the same processor via network). Forget the exact name think it was called stream processing, but the Cell processor is the software version turned hardware (Means it'll function faster then Software would but less flexible then software, if something is wrong with it's design it can become useless).

I've got my fingers crossed that the guys at Sony are taking great care in what they are doing with this processor. So far it looks on track and that dinky little chip has had claims to of matching processing power to that of many of the top 500 Super Computers. If true then that's something XBox can't even boast about.

Cell Processors are actually even planned to go into the next gen Super Computers. IBM looking into using them with their Blades because of the potentialy enormous power it could produce.

[kuu]

Re: Xbox 360 gets soft start in Japan

Well Jarre, your info is partly correct on both sides.

PS3 is backwards compatible with PS and PS2 games. Also unlike the PS2 its running in a full emulation were it's capable of supporting all of the PS and PS2 games. The Xbox 360 is backward compatible too, but it is limited to select few (Of course Halo and Halo2 will be, M$ not dumb enough to ignore those two).

Yes the XBox is crushed in almost every aspect vs. the PS3. Even in the processor design the XBox is going with Multi-Processor in which relies heavily on the coding to properly take advantage of the processors. The PS3 however has 1 PowerPC Processor that dishes out data to be processed to the 1 up to nth Synergetic Core (Yes, the number of Synergetic Cores in each system is expandable by either devices build or by access to other devices with the same processor via network). Forget the exact name think it was called stream processing, but the Cell processor is the software version turned hardware (Means it'll function faster then Software would but less flexible then software, if something is wrong with it's design it can become useless).

Sorta sorta...there is more meat on Cell that just cropped up(just a heads up).

PS2 is bascially a PS1+ many many stuff...some can call it hack, other's will call it a co-processor. The emotion engine is a very complex peice of engineering...and why developers had a headache. It really was a bigger bad-er PS1 chip, with a lot of...forgot the exact term, but very simpler to SPEs ideal...

So in laymen's terms, PS2 is a "Cell" too...well a distant ancestor.

Now this kinda works for PS3 on backward compatibility. Their thinking isn't that far different, even if the silicon is. The SPE system drasitically makes it easier to mimic PS2 and thus PS1. It's like everything is nicely split up. That and they don't have to deal with the edian problem.

360...well what can you say, it's like PC and Mac, only it's intel x86 ->PPC. The "edian" mess is not only a humungus problem(like counting backwards for everything), but their chips are completely different (P3->computer style, SPE-> cellphone like style).

if xbox didn't have such a small library of games, compatiblity would of been worse...(as we can see from JP release) Did they even "try" to make it compatible with any JP games??

On Cell engineering. It seems Cell isn't a complete "stream" as we first thought Macht. There is actually tiny 256k cache I think on each SPE which most likely gives it to do OooE. This is interesting, because we thought programers would have to "metal gear2" it to make it run smoothly...but with some stuff jumping around it makes it lot easier to "Compile" their way through it.

[Jei]

Re: Xbox 360 gets soft start in Japan

Talking to my classmates, most of them who bought xbox, their reason were "it is a powerful console" and not even taking into consideration what games it offers. Very different view than what I have. I think the same way as bside, I'll buy the game I want to play, and the console pretty much follow the game. Not the way around.

[Nodachi]

Re: Xbox 360 gets soft start in Japan

Most Xbox games aren't appealed to me too. Having lots of FPS and eye candy action games are very american market favour imo...

buying GC for zelda > xbox360 for me.

It's good for initial buy here but most arn't pleased with launch titles. DoA4 and Ridge Racer remain the only two that interest me.

Double Post Edited:

my impression of Xbox and Xbox 360, as a Japanese myself, is more of the action games and less of RPG, which many ppl would agree that it's more suited for US market.

While this statement is generally true. Especially with the Xbox. The Xbox360 actually has quite a few RPGs that I wasn't aware of coming out next year. Two of which are done by the same team who did FF6 and Chrono Trigger, looks to be pretty promising. Before the only "RPG"s they had were like...boulder's gate? gauntlet? lol.... But yeah this time around they realize they need more varied RPGs, and with SquareEnix signing on with them I'm sure we'll see more variaty there.

[Balfree]

Re: Xbox 360 gets soft start in Japan

Simply put japanese people can come up with things like Katamari Damacy and Final Fantasy, and american people can come up with things like GTA and Halo, its your choice really.

Fun and Interesting, or Loud and Obnoxious? I say it's a good way to split out the Men from the Boys.

[Macht]

Re: Xbox 360 gets soft start in Japan

Never played GTA, it looked like a waste of time to me

Katamari looked intresting but I seem to have this fault of needing the right graphic or art quality for it to intrest me more. Katamari just didn't have that but I would agree it's play looked fun.

As for the "Cell" and PS2 yes, I've read that was just trying to sum it up quickly guess it wasn't good enough. As for the "Cell" yes how it works isn't exactly like stream processing it's taking the goods from both ends of the spectrum and making a sort of hybrid out of it. How it handles the data and with the SPEs are still controlled by the PowerPC processor, so if something shouldn't be done in OooE the PowerPC can control that.

At least thats how I was seeing the picture when I looked at the info on it's design. Bascially the PowerPC Processor is like the boss/supervisor and the SPEs are the workers.

[WishMaster3K]

Re: Xbox 360 gets soft start in Japan

Point, my friends in college arent nearly as well-versed in gaming as I am, bless their hearts, though. One of my friends is a Die-hard GC fan, and he's pretty much leet at all 1st party nintendo games -.-

But the point is, they all think Katamari is a stupid game, while I have insane fun with it. They think that Harvest Moon is a stupid game, whle I can sit down and plick away the hours simply by farming and stuff. . .

Different strokes, I guess, but American Gamers, in general, and believe me, it's the VAST majority, are perfect targets for Microsoft. Just because we have other tastes that extend beyond the scopes of our FPSs, doesnt mean the rest of the world follows suit. As evident from the reaction to XB in Japan, it's evident that Japanese culture weighs heavily on our gaming tastes.

Curse you SE and your RPGs!!!!!!!

[Caspian]

Re: Xbox 360 gets soft start in Japan

Simply put japanese people can come up with things like Katamari Damacy and Final Fantasy, and american people can come up with things like GTA and Halo, its your choice really.

Fun and Interesting, or Loud and Obnoxious? I say it's a good way to split out the Men from the Boys.

Thats kind of a biased and stereotyping statement isn't it? A lot of first person shooters require a lot of hand eye coordination and strategy. If you don't believe me try Halo2 out online and get high enough to play the really good players. If you're not a fan of FPS's and such, then I can understand and respect your opinion. If the majority of Japan isn't a fan of FPS's, then again, I can understand and respect the decision. However, saying all FPS's are loud, obnoxious, and not fun is a bit much. I don't know if you intended it, but your post made it sound like that these games also don't require skill. Something I disagree with greatly.
Again, I'm fine with people not liking certain types of games or whatnot. God knows there's types of games I can't get into. But please don't make blanket statements inferring that Americans are all loud and obnoxious and that all FPS are boring and stupid simply because you don't care for them.

[Jei]

Re: Xbox 360 gets soft start in Japan

But the point is, they all think Katamari is a stupid game, while I have insane fun with it. They think that Harvest Moon is a stupid game, whle I can sit down and plick away the hours simply by farming and stuff. . .

Different strokes, I guess, but American Gamers, in general, and believe me, it's the VAST majority, are perfect targets for Microsoft. Just because we have other tastes that extend beyond the scopes of our FPSs, doesnt mean the rest of the world follows suit. As evident from the reaction to XB in Japan, it's evident that Japanese culture weighs heavily on our gaming tastes.

add thailand to this, we grew up with japanese games ^^b

[Auron517]

Re: Xbox 360 gets soft start in Japan

Thats kind of a biased and stereotyping statement isn't it? A lot of first person shooters require a lot of hand eye coordination and strategy. If you don't believe me try Halo2 out online and get high enough to play the really good players. If you're not a fan of FPS's and such, then I can understand and respect your opinion. If the majority of Japan isn't a fan of FPS's, then again, I can understand and respect the decision. However, saying all FPS's are loud, obnoxious, and not fun is a bit much. I don't know if you intended it, but your post made it sound like that these games also don't require skill. Something I disagree with greatly.
Again, I'm fine with people not liking certain types of games or whatnot. God knows there's types of games I can't get into. But please don't make blanket statements inferring that Americans are all loud and obnoxious and that all FPS are boring and stupid simply because you don't care for them.

Halo2 online is ridiculously easy. I remember signing unto Xbox Live for kicks one night, and on my first night playing in 4 months, I never got below 3rd place in a game. Not saying that I would go out and own Team 3D or anything, but generally, compared to other FPS that I've played, Halo's a pretty easy pick up.

Bottom line, if Microsoft expects to succeed in Japan, they're going to need better games. All they had this time around were an abundance of subpar shoot-em-ups, and other mediocre titles. For Microsoft to get any of my money, they're going to have to step it up.

[Caspian]

Re: Xbox 360 gets soft start in Japan

Halo2 online is ridiculously easy. I remember signing unto Xbox Live for kicks one night, and on my first night playing in 4 months, I never got below 3rd place in a game. Not saying that I would go out and own Team 3D or anything, but generally, compared to other FPS that I've played, Halo's a pretty easy pick up.

Bottom line, if Microsoft expects to succeed in Japan, they're going to need better games. All they had this time around were an abundance of subpar shoot-em-ups, and other mediocre titles. For Microsoft to get any of my money, they're going to have to step it up.

Out of curiosity, when was this and what rank were you? I know the majority of the good players are around rank 40 now I think. I'm by no means good, but about 6 months ago I played a cpl hours on free for all for rank. Never came in behind 2nd and got to rank 9 or 10 easily. That was when the best were only around rank 16 or 17. I also used Halo b/c it is a MS game. If you want to get really hardcore, then you'd have to go with something like UT, or Quake, or whatever the new pc fps is now. Those people border on ungodly good.

I also agree with you about getting some variation for release in Japan. I was never denying that a particular game type dominates the US and another dominates Japan. My problem was with the blanket statement that all FPS suck/are stupid etc., when its presented as a fact rather than just a person's opinion. One of my best friend's hates all video games b/c he feels that they're loud, obnoxious, and a waste of time. Yet, if he is going to play he would much rather play a FPS b/c its less annoying than rpg's.

Also, who made the MYST games? Was it Eidos? As I understood, they were more popular here in the states than in Japan. Was I mistaken?

[WishMaster3K]

Re: Xbox 360 gets soft start in Japan

MYST is a good counter argument, but the thing is, the PC market is full of niche games. Anything the Sims creator (I want to say Peter Molynux or something like that, i'm not sure of his name. . .) creates is seen as innovative, and that's because we know that him and Miyamoto shroom it up together to create bizzarly fun games like Pikmin and Black and White.

So yeah, Caspian, good argument, but as I stated, niche games are popular because fans will buy regardless. Similar to the Harvest moon fans and the Sims fans who continue to get more versions, despite the game being fundamentally the same, lol.

Now, in markets where there is competition, i.e. Quake, UT, CS, essentially, FPSs in general, sure, there are die-hard fans, but all FPSs are fundamentally the same, but unlike a niche, they are a genre, so while fans may be dedicated to their Counter Strike Source, they fawn over Half-Life 2 cause it had better graphics than Fallout.

Not saying you're wrong, just stating that using Niche games is unfair. Saying Final Fantasy is popular among RPG players when there are a kagillion others, that's a fair argument if someone was saying FFs suck as RPGs.

No other game is an Epic puzzle game that'll test the very mettle of your psyche while giving you gorgeous backdrops and beautifully articulated scenery. Make a game like that and you have a competitor to Myst ;o

[Caspian]

Re: Xbox 360 gets soft start in Japan

So yeah, Caspian, good argument, but as I stated, niche games are popular because fans will buy regardless. Similar to the Harvest moon fans and the Sims fans who continue to get more versions, despite the game being fundamentally the same, lol.

I'll buy that. I was really trying to point out that not all Americans are FPS crazy and do have other types, or in this case niches, of games that they enjoy. As well as that you can enjoy an FPS and still like other more psychologically stimulating types of games just as much.

[Balfree]

Re: Xbox 360 gets soft start in Japan

Thats kind of a biased and stereotyping statement isn't it? A lot of first person shooters require a lot of hand eye coordination and strategy. If you don't believe me try Halo2 out online and get high enough to play the really good players. If you're not a fan of FPS's and such, then I can understand and respect your opinion. If the majority of Japan isn't a fan of FPS's, then again, I can understand and respect the decision. However, saying all FPS's are loud, obnoxious, and not fun is a bit much. I don't know if you intended it, but your post made it sound like that these games also don't require skill. Something I disagree with greatly.
Again, I'm fine with people not liking certain types of games or whatnot. God knows there's types of games I can't get into. But please don't make blanket statements inferring that Americans are all loud and obnoxious and that all FPS are boring and stupid simply because you don't care for them.

Yes i am biased, i admit it and i don't care, everyone is to some extent.

You're right, generalising is bad, but that's not my intent at all, truth is, my shelves have hardly any 'american' games, by american games i mean done by american companies (i think), so in my little universe, american games (and yes i mainly mean FPS type of games) are loud and obnoxious, but then theres things like metroid and perfect dark games that i love inconditionally, go figure... yea i am biased towards japanese game companies i guess... i don't have trouble admiting it, however i think these 2 i mentioned have plenty more style and enjoyment factor than most of the popular FPSs out there... Halo, Doom, Half Life, etc...

Maybe i'm just another fanboi D: Hurray for fanboidom!