The Version Update Has Arrived! (06/21/2010)

[Chromemage]

Re: The Version Update Has Arrived! (06/21/2010)

I hate to derail any current convos about the update for my personal needs...

but

1) OF COURSE THE RELEASE THE $#*@'in update when I'm out of town.
2) How long did it take you guys to get the full update on PS2?
<s>3) How is the limit break quest?</s>

Super, super excited to get Knights Minne V.

[MrMageo]

Re: The Version Update Has Arrived! (06/21/2010)

Red mage is still one of the more wanted jobs wether it be in endgame or an exp party, red mage lost only a little aspect of the job it wasn't designed to do anyway.

You know in that AV video, ya that RDM/NIN is tanking AV.

I don't get all the QQ though. All SE has done is put us on par with NIN tanks, and slightly behind PLD tanks. Instead of focusing on spell rotations, we will have to cheat cure and crap like PLD's do. Or spam en2's to build CE. Its not like we can't tank, we just got brought back down, because well we were the fastest to cap hate, and took the least damage. Tht on top of all of RDM's other quirks, is a liitle much. That is why the Nerf becaue a good RDM tank outclassed PLD on nearly every mob of interest, and that ain't right. But then again it ain't right RD outclasses WHM, or SCH out classes BLM, or PUP outclasses us all.

[Omgwtfbbqkitten]

Re: The Version Update Has Arrived! (06/21/2010)

RDMs act like this is the biggest nerf to ever hit the game.

No nerf tops 2005's Ranger nerf - where the main job was crippled and left crippled for the better part of a year and a half. It was a nerf where the central purpose of the job was destroyed, completely and utterly. This job was not just nerfed, it was punished and left broken so other melee jobs could benefit.

RDMs want to cry to me about changes to enmity on spells? Try food and gear not factoring into your job's specialization for a year and a half, try investing gil in a job like that. RNG was supposed to be THE most accurate job and the game and food and gear bonuses were not being factored, our best weapon skill and even two hour was missing the target.

And you know what? RDMs aren't even complaining about the underutlization of their MAIN FUNCTION - enfeebling.

No, you are not a jack of all trades. Back when RDM truly was a jack of all trades, they weren't worth inviting. They could only do what WHM and BLM could do and not do it as well as those jobs did.

RDM was specialized in enfeebling and enhancing to address this and given spells and skill ratings to compliment those functions. But want do RDMs use those enhancements for?

To play a fucking White Mage and then they have the gall to complain about something they willingly accept invites to do. This is why no one respects RDMs when they come out to raise an issue. You guys get invited to parties to perform this function. You painted yourselves into that corner.

You took the colibri PT invites knowing full and well that enfeebling magic wasn't doing any good on them.

And then you fueled so many other jobs with merits that now other mobs aren't worth enfeebling and we can just burn through those, too.

The RDM community took their specialization and sacrificed it, and now you want to cry to the rest of us about some little fringe element of the job few RDMs embranced and endgame LSes exploited at the expense of PLDs? You're complaining about tanking when you've changed the community so drastically with your healing skills that they're now too powerful to need your specialization.

That's not what happened to RNG. We just had some scorpion arrow bandwagon RNGs exploiting the fact Sidewinder was totally ignoring mob defense. In other words, people who were doing the job poorly could outdamage any melee job and the good RNGs got that put effort into their gear and used the best ammo got punished right along with them.

And then they were left broken for a very long time.

Last I checked, RDM enfeebling and enhancing still actually works, you've just powered up other jobs so much your specialization as waned in EXP parties. Maybe if SE ramped up mob defense again and brought back SC/MB parties you could do your job and raise your skills with ease.

But people are likely to complain about anything they can't burn now so good luck with that.

[BurningPanther]

Re: The Version Update Has Arrived! (06/21/2010)

Only the people who are upset are bothering to post about it, so everyone who posts about it is upset. That doesn't say jack about the actual community, only about the community of whiners. Same thing happens with every update.

So what are you trying to say?

"The only players that ever have a problem with anything are forum goers."

"If you are not expressing discontent on a forum, you must therefore be indifferent to or pleased with the progression of events."

Is that how it works?

I've met plenty who play the game without ever having set eyes on related forums, and have across-the-board opinions about every update. It's not simply the few who frequent forums that can be or are discontent, they're simply the ones you're aware of.

Conversely, there is an equal, perhaps greater number of people, on forums, expressing contentment. Using the Black Magic spells enmity nerf as an example, there are forum goers pouring from the cracks expressing spiteful glee to see RDM lose anything. Is it the case that people expressing said contentment are a vocal minority as well?

[Omgwtfbbqkitten]

Re: The Version Update Has Arrived! (06/21/2010)

Some of us have a life you know. Owning a relic doesn't have to contradict that.

I'd wager owning a relic has a high correlation with being unemployed.

That or who has fewer scruples than other players, just look at the correlation between relic owners and the Jan. 22 2009 bannings. Quite a few got caught.

To be honest I think I'll wait until FFXIV. I can forsee another population hit to FFXI as people go to FFXIV and WoW (Honestly I can see Blizzard releasing Cataclysm at around the time FFXIV comes out regardless), maybe Aion if we ever get the 2.0 patch since the US/EU version of the game is badly outdated and needs the new 2.0 content. How long before the population goes back to FFXI depends on the content of those games really.

Personally, I think Cataclysm is going to be where WoW loses people, because they're castrating the world and its lore in its entirety to rebuild it around new content. In fact we could consider this week the Cataclysm update, but for CoP. Just because that sounds ambitious doesn't mean its a good idea.

Really, its going to be strange to people that play FFXI in the future that there are level 75 mobs in a zone that has a level 30 BC fight. I think they're going to feel cheated of what were some interesting battles, just like how new WoW players are going to feel cheated of lore and quests based around the original world rather than the Cataclysm world.

[Karinya]

Re: The Version Update Has Arrived! (06/21/2010)

This change had nothing to do with the community (as you can tell, they're pretty upset by the nerf)

Only the people who are upset are bothering to post about it, so everyone who posts about it is upset. That doesn't say jack about the actual community, only about the community of whiners. Same thing happens with every update.

But there are tons of mobs people don't actually melee against, and in those situations, Rdm/Nin, Nin/Rdm, Nin/Drk and Pld/Rdm were great tanking jobs.

For every player who tried to tank with any of those combinations, there are 4-5 BLMs, SCHs, or RDMs not trying to tank who got their faces ripped off every time they slept an add. You do know that people actually cast those spells for their effects, right? They're not purely Provoke substitutes?

While I can understand wanting to keep Pld as *the* best tanks, there was absolutely no reason at all to nerf the hate on Black Magic spells used for tanking.

Except that they are also used for crowd control, and BLMs' biggest beef since forever has been getting their face ripped off every time they crowd control mobs because those spells have *too damn much* enmity.

You know who else wasn't meant to be a tank? Nin. But they're still pretty good at tanking. You know who was meant to be a tank? War. And they suck at tanking. You know who made a great tank? Rdms. But they got nerfed in their ability to tank. You know who did get an ability to help with tanking? War. But they still suck at tanking.

And you know this because of your day and a half of extensive testing with post-update WAR tanks? WARs who don't come to the party prepared to tank suck at tanking. And right now, that is most WARs. But asking most RDMs to tank (pre-patch) would have at least as horrible an outcome, even if there are a few who are good at it.

SE has been trying to bring back WAR tanking for a while now. Players are very hostile to the idea (while simultaneously whining about a tank shortage!), but I'd suggest getting used to it.

[Firewind]

Re: The Version Update Has Arrived! (06/21/2010)

To be honest I think I'll wait until FFXIV. I can forsee another population hit to FFXI as people go to FFXIV and WoW (Honestly I can see Blizzard releasing Cataclysm at around the time FFXIV comes out regardless), maybe Aion if we ever get the 2.0 patch since the US/EU version of the game is badly outdated and needs the new 2.0 content. How long before the population goes back to FFXI depends on the content of those games really.

I for one have no intention of going back to FFXI or giving Cataclysm more than a token trial upgrade peak to see if they finally un-nerfed Rogues (unlikely and since Rogues are the only thing about WoW that interests me I'll probably just wait for Diablo 3). FFXIV interests me as something NEW, a fresh game with a fresh start and not something that has been stagnant for the last 5 years. If FFXIV took Aion's approach towards levelling (Solo very possible and doable in a reasonable time and encouraged if you can't get a group. Group much better and more encouraged since you can really rake in the XP if you know the good camps and how to farm instances) so it's actually possible to consistently achieve things and have a life I don't think I would see a reason to to back to FFXIV. That would be especially so if they keep international servers so there are always people to group with no matter when I'm working or when my lectures fall (Australian, German, Polish and mature US and UK players tend to be the nicest people you can play with too).

[Malacite]

Re: The Version Update Has Arrived! (06/21/2010)

They're relic owners. They live on doing repetitive shit to an absurd extent.

Eh, I don't see that as a valid excuse for SE's bullshit relic trials. I would think that they've put in enough fucking hours on the damn things.

Some of us have a life you know. Owning a relic doesn't have to contradict that.

I'm semi pissed about how you get the Empyreans, but at the same time relieved; I just had to cancel my trail for Kurodachi and am now working towards Radenotachi (which becomes Masamune, as do the rest of the +DMG weapons)


Did some playing around with the new stuff, can't say for sure what the exact bonus is but holy crap Magic Burst Bonus is just pure win. So is the XI update, as our COR tonight in Limbus popped an XI Wizard's Roll. 10 mintues of MAB +16? BOOYA! Dude on BG said he manged Burst II (I think on birds in Lufaise?) for 1.6k normally, but a massive 2.7k on MB - that's just pyschotic. Can't wait to see what it does to Tier V.

Sengikori is reportedly 35% SC damage and 25% MB damage, with SC Bonus being 8% SC damage. That last one's a bit weak but oh well.

Lastly, oh man I can not wait to get my hands on those Elemental Staves for BLM. SE actually fucking listens; they all have unique names (thus can be macrod) and have a whopping <element> Affinity: Magic Damage +4 Magic Acc +1.


HQ staves are 2/2. This means these new staves give a 1.25% MAB modifier! Coupled with Tier V nukes and that's some sick damage...

[Feba]

Re: The Version Update Has Arrived! (06/21/2010)

loooooooooool

Honestly, that's par for the course.

They're relic owners. They live on doing repetitive shit to an absurd extent.

[ShadowHolyFlyingDragon]

Re: The Version Update Has Arrived! (06/21/2010)

Well, Relic Weapon owners did not get passed up on the Trial of Magians.

Yoichinoyumi can go as far as 96 base damage +25 Racc +15 Ratt. It takes about 2 trials to get there. The final one is: 2000 aquan type creatures with Namas Arrow on the finishing blow.

loooooooooool

Yeah, the trial I want to do requires me to kill fukkin mobs during fire weather. My final bow will be called Bateleur and can come in at 80 damage +6 STR +16 Ratt. So, for a free bow I just simply have to work for, that's ok in my book.

Something tells me though, the new weapons are hinting at Dynamis-esque style of upgrading; with, I'm sure, a few little nasty twists to make you possibly /wrists.

I've never talked to the weather check more in all my life on here in 8 years...... /facepalm.

Back to smashing crawlers~~~~

[Shirai]

Re: The Version Update Has Arrived! (06/21/2010)

selective reading

Red mage is still one of the more wanted jobs wether it be in endgame or an exp party, red mage lost only a little aspect of the job it wasn't designed to do anyway.
You keep whining that SE ruined red mage and the game mechanics.
I got some news for you;
You're not the 2005 Ranger, you're not the 2003 Dragoon, Red mage isn't the new Puppetmaster, so get over your hissy fit and eat it or level another job.

Come back when SE really puts a nerf on the job so much it makes worthy of calling lolrdm.

There is no need to change my main argument, we're done talking.

[Omgwtfbbqkitten]

Re: The Version Update Has Arrived! (06/21/2010)

I'm just more intersted in seeing what comes of FFXIV and DCU Online, as they have writers behind them that I very much love getting stories from and teams with ideas that interest me.

I totally appreciate what EVE tries to do, but I've sworn off MMOs til FFXIV and DCUO arrive.

[Feba]

Re: The Version Update Has Arrived! (06/21/2010)

BBQ, have you looked at EVE online? It can be taken very seriously or completely laid back. Someone who plays 15 minutes a day can progress as much as someone who plays six hours a day in terms of skills, so there's no pressure to constantly get on and improve your character's stats. The primary mechanism of moving your character forward after the first few months is cash, but you can be very laid back about that too. Some of the people that have the most fun in the game are the ones who get together in cheap frigates and pirate random passersby and other similar shenanigans. If you're really dying for an item, they have a form of RMT that keeps things legal, reasonable (both in terms of cost for someone who just wants a quick boost and in terms of keeping people from going to it to get huge amounts), and also can be used to save some money. Basically, you buy your time in game with real dollars, but you can sell ingame time for ISK too. If you need some extra money in real life, but still want to play, you can pay for your resub with ingame currency; if you need some extra money in game and have some extra real life dollars, you can sell a time card. Keeps RMT from running all over the place too. EVE doesn't place nearly as large an emphasis on Alliances taking over space, which is basically their equivalent of endgame. Plenty of Corps for people that just want to chillax and mine some space rocks, who want to pirate from aforementioned endgame assholes, and other various fields. The assholes in EVE aren't any more prevalent than in FFXI. I mean, not joking, EVE has some of the kindest space pirates you will ever meet.

[Omgwtfbbqkitten]

Re: The Version Update Has Arrived! (06/21/2010)

Like I said before and Callisto reiterated - I am one of those people that would try to max out a character in gear if I allowed myself to. If I had played FFXI at all this year, I would have already gotten all my subjobs to 49 and started setting out to work on this new gear and to EXP, probably without even taking a look back at the existing endgame ever again.

And that's why I didn't come back to work on subjobs, I intentionally put myself behind so I wouldn't resub. I don't really care about grouping solely with other people who have awesome gear, but it its something I expect of myself and would burn too much valuble time doing knowing I might start a new MMO later this year.

If FFXIV and DCUO pan out to be more relaxed, that might work out with my life and my gaming. People who are really "successful" in MMORPGs tend to gain that success at the expense of more important things. That's not working for me anymore - and I like to think I actually held back with FFXI, because I know I totally let myself go on Everquest and that wasn't good for me at all.

These last six months have been a bit nicer, I've gotten to catch up on so many games and so many other things that FFXI likely kept me from.

[Grizzlebeard]

Re: The Version Update Has Arrived! (06/21/2010)

with no wait and no competition.

You must do different MMMs to every other player on FFXI.