race for sam?

[Jaggywaggy]

Crowly by your same logic, acc if absolutely everything, dex advantage means nothing since acc is so much more importent. At least that's what your str vs attk arguement comment implies. Take your post and replace attk with acc, and dex with str, and then you got an elvaan fanboy. You're clearly trying to put down one noticable disadvantage mithras have, and giving the dex advantage too much credit. Although you were right, attk is more importent, but the same can definitely be said for acc over dex.

Go to the monk forums, many elvaans would claim they were the be all, end all kind of mnk because of about 4 more str, and about 6 dex less. To them, they thought str was the world and everything revolved around it. You're just doing the same thing but with mithras and dex. The differences in the stats aren't big enough to have huge impacts on the job itself unless equipment was an issue for X person. One is going to hit slightly more, one is going to hit slightly harder. And crit rate isn't a big issue either. From experience in adding dex, you probably won't see a very noticable effect until at least +20 dex, and especially with more than +25 around my level.

[kujo412]

crowly, seriously.. what level are you? are you even PAST valkurm dunes? that's all i hear you ranting on about.

you'll notice a huge difference in damage at later levels with +str stacked on. attack raises your average damage, str raises max damage. with +11 str i swing for 80-110, with +31 i swing for 90-140, with +52 i swing for 90-150. (this was with thief sub, so i didn't have the benefits of berserk or warcry)

those were figures exp'ing off decorative weapons 72-75. the higher you go, the more benefits you'll see from +str.

you can call bullshit on me, or whatever, but then ask yourself, why the hell are all these high level samurai stacking +str? yeah, it's because it doesn't do shit.


oh, and you'll notice +str on weaponskills even more as a 60+ samurai. the damage modifier on yukikaze, gekko, and kasha is 75%STR. which is why a samurai with no +str sa/ws for 900 compared to a samurai with +50 str sa/ws for 1400 -_-;

[Jaggywaggy]

So your trying to say 7-8 str will increase damage by 10-15 points? Lot of shit spewing outa your mouth.

This is exactly what I said, I've outdamaged every DD I competed against so far except blms that didn't pace themselves, never got to go toe to toe against a well equipped ranger though. This is WITHOUT SJ so far.

Bastok knuckles
2 courage rings
white belt
battle gloves
Power Gi
No earrings

Purple belt and SJ waiting at 18 when I have time to continue it, and some headpiece with +1 str at 20. I'm busy getting a second sniper for thief right now before I start putting gil and time into other stuff.

The rest is just plain armor that's not related to the claim. And I was using mithkabobs, that's where 5 of the 11 str came from. If I had just +11str, but not the attack % bonus I would've easily averaged 10-15 per fist. Compared to the 1-5s of the newb monks because they lacked str gear, it's a clear advantage.

Lot of shit spewing outa your mouth

Maybe present an arguement with clear reasons and not insults, and I'll consider to actually take you seriously. You offer no reasoning " Yo u outa try mithra, because they're better noob". I'm convinced now I'd much rather invite a trying galka or elvaan DD with average acc than a mithra with almost no acc gear because "dex means everything."

[Kayoto]

End-game:

Elvaan > Galka > Hume > Mithra > Taru

Leveling? Really.. depends on how rich you are. =p You could probably spend a tiny bit less money on Acc+ gear if you're Mithra, but still.. most of the races keep approximately equal with up-to-date gear (nothing extraordinary, I mean.. Haubergeon, Sniper'sx2.. the standard SAM requirements, hehe) except Tarutaru.

[Ashtyr]

Mithras suck. We all know the only reason they're there is fanservice anyway.

Lot of shit spewing outa your mouth.

Grow up. Or better yet, kill yourself. Remember, slit your wrist ALONG the vein, not perpendicular to it.

[DrSerpico]

Mithras suck. We all know the only reason they're there is fanservice anyway.

Oh crap. That's to bad, now I'll have to delete my char and go play WoW instead....

Couldn't you have told me this 75 levels ago, ashtyr? Keeping stuff like that to yourself is just mean.

Ontopic, I have a mithra sam of level 58. I'm guessing that most people see their own strengths and others weaknesses.... I've looked down upon many other a bladewielder, and deemed them lesser.

The truth however is that the strength's outweigh eachother. I've never seen it mentioned that whereas the elvaan or galka will perform 200-300 dmg higher sataWS, the mithra will eventually catch up through hitting more often and being able to WS faster. Say on average 11 seconds, faster, after 10 renkeis they're over 2 minutes ahead of the rest on the "renkei schedule". This is assuming normal eq.

With unlimited gil and full merits, you'll land around +70 str... that's insane. +you'd need at least 2 full macros to switch all the eq XD. What were we talking about? Oh, right, me deleting my fanservice toon and doing something else instead. Thanks for clearing that up.

[kujo412]

Originally posted by DrSerpico
The truth however is that the strength's outweigh eachother. I've never seen it mentioned that whereas the elvaan or galka will perform 200-300 dmg higher sataWS, the mithra will eventually catch up through hitting more often and being able to WS faster. Say on average 11 seconds, faster, after 10 renkeis they're over 2 minutes ahead of the rest on the "renkei schedule". This is assuming normal eq.

The reason you've never seen it mentioned is because it isn't true, the whole "mithran dex bonus = more hits" is a myth. Once acc gear becomes available that is null and void. Then elvaan and galka pull away. So yeah, mithra make the best melee pre-40, then they gradually get beaten out by elvaan and galka at everything except thief, where the dex/agi bonus actually has a direct impact (sa/ta).

This is why topics like this are stupid.. everyone is a fanboy/girl of the race they play and will defend it to the death -_- play what's fun, not to be the best, because the truth is that you will never be the best -_-

if you want it in a nutshell:
galka make the best tanks,
elvaans make the best dds,
mithras make the best thieves,
tarus make the best mages.

this is assuming everyone has the same blinged out gear, whatever it may be.

happy? good.

[Nodachi]

Originally posted by kujo412
The reason you've never seen it mentioned is because it isn't true, the whole "mithran dex bonus = more hits" is a myth. Once acc gear becomes available that is null and void. Then elvaan and galka pull away. So yeah, mithra make the best melee pre-40, then they gradually get beaten out by elvaan and galka at everything except thief, where the dex/agi bonus actually has a direct impact (sa/ta).

This is why topics like this are stupid.. everyone is a fanboy/girl of the race they play and will defend it to the death -_- play what's fun, not to be the best, because the truth is that you will never be the best -_-

if you want it in a nutshell:
galka make the best tanks,
elvaans make the best dds,
mithras make the best thieves,
tarus make the best mages.

this is assuming everyone has the same blinged out gear, whatever it may be.

happy? good.

In my opinion i don't think Mithra's dex is going to help them hit a tremendous amount more as i've PTd with another Mithra Sam before and it was quite the oposite (he/she didn't have snipers though, rest was on par). What i DO think that Dex is gona help is in end game with criticals. If you were to stack Osode, Byakko's Haidate, Lightning earrings and other petty dex items, along with natural dex of a mithra, i'm thinking you could crank out a ton more criticals than normal, and we all know how nice those great katana criticals are

[kujo412]

Originally posted by Nodachi
In my opinion i don't think Mithra's dex is going to help them hit a tremendous amount more as i've PTd with another Mithra Sam before and it was quite the oposite (he/she didn't have snipers though, rest was on par). What i DO think that Dex is gona help is in end game with criticals. If you were to stack Osode, Byakko's Haidate, Lightning earrings and other petty dex items, along with natural dex of a mithra, i'm thinking you could crank out a ton more criticals than normal, and we all know how nice those great katana criticals are

haha, if you want crits end-game equip a kamewari in sky XD i crit 1/4-1/2 swings :3

[Kayoto]

Originally posted by kujo412
haha, if you want crits end-game equip a kamewari in sky XD i crit 1/4-1/2 swings :3

(Samurai)(Mighty Strikes)(All right!)

<.< I agree.. Kamewari in sky, hehe.

But yeah.. Mithra DEX is pretty insane.. with Kamewari in sky, Kirin's Osode, Byakko's Haidate, Pixie Earring, Spinel Ringx2.. you could probably crit a large percentage of your swings on arcana mobs. It'd be neat to try out, at least.

[Nodachi]

Originally posted by Kayoto
(Samurai)(Mighty Strikes)(All right!)

<.< I agree.. Kamewari in sky, hehe.

But yeah.. Mithra DEX is pretty insane.. with Kamewari in sky, Kirin's Osode, Byakko's Haidate, Pixie Earring, Spinel Ringx2.. you could probably crit a large percentage of your swings on arcana mobs. It'd be neat to try out, at least.

Don't forget the +2 % Crit up Rate from merits

[ganhosi]

You guys are all out of your minds.. by far the best is da Taru
If you want proof I have tons of screenshots of me outdamaging every job and every race in the game. The only downside is that I am usually the first to die. ; ;

[MAK]

me outdamaging every job

lol

[ClydeArrowny]

Originally posted by quigebo
I'm thinking about starting this game again because im getting bored of all the other games, and i was thinking about starting over and going for a SAM again. but i was wondering which race fits best for a sam.
also back in the first months this game came out, sam/war seemed to be the favored jobs but i see that some people use sam/thf, can somebody tell me why?

First of all, be whatever race you like best. Imo, galka and elvaan make the best sams, however if you don't like those races feel free to go hume, mithra or even taru if you wish. In the grand scheme of things race really means a small deal. For example, I've seen well equiped taru sams do more damage /per hit/ than elvaan drks.
People sub thf in the 30s to boost enpi, though imo war sub does better overall dmg. 60+ thf sub can be used to control hate, and 65+ with Tachi:Gekko and later Tachi:Kasha thf sub is the most popular sub. Sneak ensures Gekko and Kasha to hit 100% when used correctly(along with all other physical WSs), and also, for these 2 WSs specifically, amplifies the power of the WS.

Originally posted by dreadlord
Take what you like. It's all about the equipment.

This line basically sums it all up, however I'd like to add something. No matter your race you can be great at your job with good equipment. However, even with the "best" race, whatever you may think it is, and the best equipment, to truly shine you must play the job with skill. Skill=Equipment>Race

Originally posted by pooq
/thf is for the dex as well as the SA, but mostly for elvaans to make up for their lousy dex. remember that post 30 you have meditate so hitting to get your TP isnt an issue anymore but it is nice to toss out a WS for damage then med for the chain

A sam is supposed to do 2 renkeis in a PT. It's called a 2X2 renkei. Renkei with one person, then med and @100% TP renkei with the second. This can easily work with a 3 melee 3 mage PT, just renkei with the tank.

Originally posted by crowly
Equip 2x courage rings and a bravos belt on any job in valkurm dunes. Hit a mob then unequip them and hit the mob.

Check the results on how much damage is increased, then tell me why you believe that str will do more at 60.

Uhh, because only raising STR doesnt do much of anything to help out regular attacks. You need to raise /attack/ as well, which is very lacking in the dunes. At 60 you get a much larger array of attack+ equipment. plus the ability berserk with war sub.
However, no matter what your attack, you will always notice a difference in your G.Katana physical WSs with increased STR. This is due to besides the fact that STR raises the main multiplier under the STR/VIT difference for any WS, G.Katana is the only weapon in which /every physical WS/ has a large(I believe 50%+) secondary factor that relies /solely/ on STR. (For comparison of other secondary factors, dancing edge is a mix of DEX and CHR, all bow WS mix of STR and AGI, all xbow/gun WS pure AGI, most mnk WS mix of VIT and STR, etc.)

Originally posted by crowly
So your trying to say 7-8 str will increase damage by 10-15 points? Lot of shit spewing outa your mouth.


Anyone that actually believes him should grab 2x courage rings, linen cuffs+1, and a purple belt ^^ and play monk in the dunes.

The other mnks probably didnt eat kabobs which add both 5str and 22% attack, the attack being what made the STR do extra damage. Theoretically, if you have 1 STR and 1,000,000 attack, your damage is going to be crap. At the same time, if the attack was 1 and STR 1,000,000(assuming it didnt add to attack or the attack was so low with this it added to 1) the damage is also going to be crap. You need a balance of both to do damage.

Originally posted by Ashtyr
Mithras suck. We all know the only reason they're there is fanservice anyway.

Mithra make the best thfs hand down. Also arguably they are the best gun/xbow rng. However, like I've stated before, race pales in importance to skill and equipment.

Originally posted by DrSerpico
that's insane. +you'd need at least 2 full macros to switch all the eq XD.

One of the best RDMs I've PTd with has literally over 30 macros for that job alone mostly due to equipment changes specified to be the best per spell. Also, for my thf, I have 4 full macros to switch all of my equips back and forth for PT circumstances. TP set(2 macros) and fuido set(2 macros)

Originally posted by kujo412
if you want it in a nutshell:
galka make the best tanks,
elvaans make the best dds,
mithras make the best thieves,
tarus make the best mages.

First of all, like I've stated before; race means very little compared to player skill and equipment.
Galkas make the best no MP/spell tanks hands down.
Tanks with MP and nins its debatable anything from Galka to Taru is best as they both have many up sides and down sides.
DDs, I dont really want to get into this, so many factors.
Mithra are the best thieves hands down.
Tarus make the best smns, blms, nuke/int enfeeble/cure tank rdms and cure tank whms.
Elvaans make the best mnd enfeeble whms and mnd enfeeble rdms.

Originally posted by ganhosi2
You guys are all out of your minds.. by far the best is da Taru
If you want proof I have tons of screenshots of me outdamaging every job and every race in the game. The only downside is that I am usually the first to die. ; ;

Well, although technically taru is the worst sam race, the best sam playing FFXI could happen to be a taru, just as the best smn or whm playing FFXI could be a galka. For bad/inexperinced players, race can be used as a crutch like taru whm's big MP pool. However, a galka whm with less MP could actually do a better job due to more skill and/or better use of equipment sets for specific purposes(mp isnt the only thing a whm uses you know.)

[Halato]

I prefer Galka for all mana-less melee jobs because they can handle hate *much* better than any other race in the game regardless of job during your exp career. End product to that is that you get to be a little braver but you don't bankrupt your mage's MP in the process.

Everything changes at level 75 though. How? Well... I got my Biakko's Haidate (+15 dex) maybe 2 months ago... guess how much it increased my ACC? Hardly at all, if any. Got my Osode last week... Guess how much it increased my damage? Hardly at all (given, I can see it a little, but +10 str for a monk is massive).

Why? Because the top end of my damage is capped on most mobs, and the random number portion of damage equations means I'll never consistently hit cap on mobs that grant any EXP. Given, I can land 150 damage a fist on EP mobs, but bump me up to Aura Statues and I still have a huge damage variance.

So what am I saying here?

Well, I'm saying that in the endgame, if you are geared WELL and INTELLIGENTLY, random variances will hide most of your race's shortcomings no matter what you chose. Unless you are an idiot wearing all +ACC and no +STR, or all +STR and no +ACC... You'll do fine when you hit 75.