A Humble Request for the more experience PLD's

[Teejay]

Hello all, I am going to be set PTing with some of my good friends from Rag, and I will be playing a PLD. Now this is going to a set pt that is going from lvl 10 till we get the AF gear for our members.

The PT consists of the following (not 100% set in stone, yet for now this is what we've decided):

RNG/THF or War (Elvaan) (RANK5 for sure)
DRK/WAR (Elvaan) (RANK5 for sure)
PLD/WAR (Hume) (Rank3)
BLM/WHM (Hume) (Rank2)
WHM/BLM (Mithra) (Rank2)
BRD/WHM (Hume) (Rank2)

Now, what I am humbly asking is advice on how I can play PLD properly. i'm aware of the basic things, (being the MT, provoking every 30 seconds, help maintain hate by casting magic, always having the most updated armor with best +def stats, 1hs and shield, those basic things, etc.)

I'm directing this question to the experienced paladins out there. What other tips can you offer throughout the journey of a level 10-60 PLD? What things can i do to be the best tank that i can possibly be?

I know you guys know me, i'm not new to the FFXI scene, but i'm just looking for ways to always improve my game. I have a 33 Sam/war that i've been leveling, so i'm used to basic tanking, and meleeing. I know SAM's will never be the meatshield that PLD's can be, so i'm sure there is lots for me to learn still. I'm more used to playing a mage class, as i have both whm and rdm past 30.

Thank you guys for your input, and one final note: If you are not going to post something constructive or helpful, please don't post anything at all. I'm just asking for advice on how to better myself for the sake of the PT, and would appreciate it if all flames and rants were kept to a minimum.

And with that... thank you all again!

Teejay

[iron_plate]

Tips those I know are:

1. Do Shield bash when your enemy casting deadly spell like black mage's ancient spell. If you do shiled bash at appropriate time, you can cancell his spell casting.

Early 10%~20% of his spell casting time and last 80%~90%, your shield bashing will be failed. Learn the timing.

2-1, Invincible is not just "invincible" but strong taunt ability to gain great hate from your enemy. Even your white mage did goddess bless, you can undertake enemy's target.

2-2. When you initiate Invincible ability, you need to confirm you are already in your enemy's hate list or you will be ignored especillay from added enemies.
To be listed the hate list, you need to 1). use provoke 2) Use cure spell to the member whom the enemy is attacking. 3) Use WS of circle blade which is area attacking,etc.. (Of course, if you have only one enemy, and if you already attacked him, you are in his hate list... those examples are for mainly added enemirs..)
Be careful not to use invincible right away, when some enemy are aaded to your party. You are not in the hate list and you will be ignored. So it might be better to provoke to added enemy to get prepare for worst case.

Those thing you already Know ? If you think those are useful, rest tips might be added..:spin:

[bside]

ok, since iron_plate has come up w/ shield bush and invincible tips, here's something else.

1. since u don't have rdm for refresh, try to lvl up ur cooking skills. as u go on, u will face situations where u have to deal w/ multiple mobs, and in those cases, ur mp might become party's lifeline. and it's always better to have some insurance, and that's where the juice comes in. drinking juice regens ur mp, so it's good to carry. but buying these off of AH all the time is costly, and they r not stackable. so the best way is to suqueeze juice on ur own. work on cooking skills, bring water crystals and some fruits to a party, and suqueeze a couple before u start fighting. trust me, a lot of pld's do this.

2. about the "cover" ability u'd learn at lvl 35. as the name says, using this covers ur party member, getting damage off of the mob instead of a engaged party member. this ability works only if u r standing between mob and a party member, so tell ur men not to move. this is really important coz for some reason, people do move. this happened to me a lot of times... (probablly coz they don't like to see me right in front of them, but for god's sake pleeeeeeeeeeeese don't move!!!!) anyways, now that u know how this ability works, the important thing is when to use it. there r 2 situations to consider using it; 1. healer is under attack due to too much hate by cure magics, and 2. attacker is drawing too much damage and u can't get the mobs' attention right away. (provoke isn't "re-loaded" and ur mp is running out.) since rng is in a party, u should use it after he goes for ws, especially after lvl 55 when rng learns the very strong ws' "side-winder" and "slug-shots." they r too strong giving like 900 damage or even more than 1k on i-tough mobs (though it misses a lot), so it'll instantly draw mobs' attention. and this is when u wanna use cover. rng's defense is like paper-thin, so without ur help, he'll die quick...


this is about it from me right now. hope it helps.

[Kagi]

This thread is just what I need. ^^ Like Teejay I'm (yet another) aspiring paladin and my one goal = become a good tank. Thank you both for the advice.

EDIT: No more aspiring!

[kanomjeeb]

If you have a thf doing yokodama (side way attack of trick+sneak) planting hate on you (pld), here is what you should know:

- Stand close to the monster as close as you can. Thf can't do yokodama if you stand too far.

- Do NOT move once thf get the position. Its very annoying when the PLD keeps moving and thf has to reposition himself.. especially when its renkei time.

- Before thf starts his first yokodama, try to get hate as fast as possible to prevent the monster running around (i usually throw a couple cure before he start doing yokodama).

[Otaku~gamer]

On the subject with pld and thf in same pt.

What Jeeb said is awesome infomation being a formal Thf he can give a lot of important info about it.

As a formal WHM i can tell you that whm's can also ruin it if they cast cure's before the thf is ready, if you can, ask the whm to hold on the healing at the begining of the round so the pld can cast a few cure's to heal up without wasting them while the thf sets up for their trick. Countless times have I screwed up the thf by casting heals on the tank at the begining and I also see this as a Pld now.

One think i do regret having in the group is a BLM that can't control their casting.. using spells that cause the monster to attack them. Ive had BLM's make it impossible to even keep the monster on me, not only ruining the thf's trick but also managing to pull the monster right back at them RIGHT as soon as I provoke making it impossible to do anything until i can provoke again. Please ask these ppl to control their casting. You might get the ass's that say "shut up" or "I do what I please".

Try not to be the puller.

Its better to stay out of Renkei (Skill-chain) until theres a brd or redmage with some type of MP regeration. But being in renkei without one can make it difficult for the pld to regain his/her MP while maintaining 100% TP.

Vit items are your friend.. Vit food are good also.. Torilla and Fish Mithrakobs are the best.

Invincibility can cancel out the Whm's Benediction "hate" depending on how much they healed the PT for.. Ive really never had a problem getting the monster off a whm after they used it. So if your whm uses their 2hr and theres no place to go or zone for them to get to safety... use your 2hr to save them.

Shield bash although on a long timer than it SHOULD be!!!.. is a great tool to cancel out certain monster attacks. I just use it as a mini provoke since hitting the monster with it acts like small "hate" tool. Good for that xtra "hate" to gain before thf sets up for their yoko or trick.

Probably some of this stuff has probably already been said since I didn't take the time to read all the posts and barely skim through it. But pld is a fun class non the less.. I enjoy it more than I did my whm.

[no_name2]

Got some more Pally questions for those out there.

In a guild where you plan on having 8+ members in your party and hunting higher level mobs (well incredibly tough right now at 20, not sure if the higher level players still fight incredibly tough mobs), is a pally a "necessity?" From all of the research that I've done, it is apparent that the pally is the ultimate tank. Is it safe to assume then that a pally is a "must-have" for a guild?

Also, a side note: Anybody got the Club skill that replenishes MP to the whole group? Is it worth choosing a club over a sword in order to give the casters an extra shot of MP?

Lastly, can pallies still keep the hate without casting cure? As a galka I naturally have the ridiculous MP. However, there is that temporary fix of the RSE armor which is about 96MP...

[Icemage]

Also, a side note: Anybody got the Club skill that replenishes MP to the whole group? Is it worth choosing a club over a sword in order to give the casters an extra shot of MP?

Not worth it. Clubs do minimal damage, which means you'll generate less hate, which is bad.

There are 2 MP regeneration WS for Clubs, Starlight and Moonlight. Neither one is particularly powerful. If I remember correctly, as a WHM50 with 163 or so Club skill in the beta, my Starlight was restoring 16MP per 100TP to myself, and my Moonlight was restoring 14MP per 100TP to all players in range.

Additionally, these moves can not generate renkei, and give you minimal hate as well. This is good for WHM... terrible for PLD.

The higher level club WS actually do nice damage, so I'm told, but even there, PLD are not that accurate with clubs, so I still don't recommend it.


Icemage

[bside]

pld's club skill is A-, so they r actually good at it. but it won't do as much damage as sword does, and those moonlight and starlight suck..., so i wouldn't recommend, either...

btw, the high-lvl club ws Icemage is referring to is Hexa Strike, which is very strong, but unfortunately that is whm's SP ws, meaning only whm as a main can use it.

[kanomjeeb]

I would suggest to up your dagger skill when you are high lv too (let say 50+). Energy drain and Energy steal is REALLY good for SOLOING and farming.

Don't ever use a dagger in a normal exp PT though. What I mean is when you are soloing and run out of mp, put on ur dagger and steal mp from monsters that have mp.

In order to use Energy steal, you need to sub thf though, but if you are soloing for some cash, you will most likely sub thf anyway

I could solo pots non stop as a thf with the energy steal ^^v.

At 100 tp, it gives you back about 70-100 mp which is really nice.

[iron_plate]

Many of you know PLD/WAR is virtualy only combo to play as tank. but you have alternative combo PLD/WHT in following situation.
If you use this combo, you are not tank anymore, but tough healer.

1. In case. your party needs to get preapare mob's range area attack ability like slimes's acid spray..
2. If your party already has a tank ( PLD/WAR. Warrior or Ninja ). and your party is in short of total MP..

Regarding above case1, PLD/WHM can cast curaga with devine seal that is tough for white magician, because curaga generate much hate for the caster. Because of this, White magician hesitates to cast curega spell during combat, but paladin who have great defense can cast.
You can get mob's target just only after casting curega, but you don't have defence ability of warrior and provocation, so, your party need another tank job other than you.

Especially Tarutarus need to consider PLD/WHM combo to make good use of his total mp although the combo is not for tank role.

[bakavic]

wow

I too am an aspiring paladin. Thanks go out to all of you guys for these great info. *bows*

[shock~moredheL]

wow this was a great read! full of information~
Thank you to all of the people who posted here!

- Kenshin

[Genki]

Thanks for the much needed advice from all the experienced Pld on this board! ^^

*bow*

May I also be of some service one day~

[imac2much]

I'd like to add a few comments as a level 50 PLD, especially with regards to the december patch.

First of all, as most of you know, yokodama is gone. Fuidama still exists, but I have YET to see it be used as effectively as yokodama was. Rather, it seems that THF is just a pure nuker now, instead of a hate transfer... they usually stand behind a secondary melee that is on the opposite side of the monster (usually someone who can take the hits, like a SAM or WAR), and it is your job as the PLD to get the hate off that trick victim when the THF fuidama's. Rarely I have seen the situation where : melee A pulls to PLD, PLD holds off provoke until THF gets in position and fuidama, then provoke. This isn't nearly as effective since it takes a while for the THF to get in position, all the while you are not getting much hate (no Provoke), and melee A is getting hit! In my eyes, THF is just pure nuker now... still effective (especially with SA+TA+VB in distortion renkei), but not as effective as before (no effective hate transfer to main tank).

Next, the new magic spell for us PLD: Flash. This spell is superb! It only costs 25 mp and seems to generate JUST AS MUCH HATE as a Cure III on the monster's target. Plus, it doesn't require you to have a lot of damage in order to use it effectively. In many of my parties, my WHM are so good that I rarely fall below 800 HP (my max is around 1030). In these cases, I usually have to resort to Cure II to get hate (which isn't nearly as effective as Cure III), but with this patch, I can just cast Flash in these instances. Flash is incredibly fast to cast, and lowers the monster's accuracy immensely for a few seconds. The only drawback is its long recharge timer.

My normal gameplan is this:
1) Puller brings monster to the PT.
2) I provoke.
3) I use either Shield Bash or Sentinel (I alternate these between battles so that 1 is usually available per battle). Sometimes I save Shield Bash if the monster can cast a powerful skill with a long windup time.
4) I cast Flash to get more hate and to make it miss me a few times.
5) I cure myself or anyone else in need of MP.
6) I re-provoke.
7) If I'm having a hard time getting hate, I'll use berserk (apparently this gets a bit of hate). This also allows me to take more damage, so that I can cure III myself for the full amount. (I'm serious, I'm too often in parties where the WHM just won't let me cure myself :sweat: )
8) I also change my equipment with macros, like using +MP equipment at first, then +DEF equipment after I use some magic.
9) Cast another cure as necessary, then another Flash, then re-provoke. Monster should be dead. ^^

Vit food is good. Def food is better.
For early PLD, stick with Tortillas... they are cheap (300 for 12 in Windurst usually), and add a small amount of defense and HP.
For mid PLD, buy/cook yourself some boiled crayfish. These are like DEF+14% or so, and only cost 1.5k for 12 in AH, or you can make them easily (and raise cooking skill while you're at it!)
For high PLD, you should stick with Boiled Crab and Fish Mithkabob. They both go for 6k for 12 in jeuno AH, but I'm going to start making my own boiled crab just to get the skill up. I think they are DEF+21% and 24% respectively (I could be wrong on these figures).

Originally posted by no_name2
Lastly, can pallies still keep the hate without casting cure? As a galka I naturally have the ridiculous MP. However, there is that temporary fix of the RSE armor which is about 96MP...

I've found absolutely nothing wrong with Galka PLD. Rather, I find them more fun and refreshing than all the Elvaan PLD clones out there. I'll admit that Elvaans may make the "superior" PLD, but honestly in 50 levels I have never found my MP pool to be a hindrance. I use a few +MP items such as Black Earrings, Morion Talthum, Holy Phial, Friar's Rope (which will change soon) and an electrum ring (don't feel like spending 85k more for just 5 more MP ^^ - Astral Ring). The only RSE I use are the gloves: I carry Iron Msk Gauntlets and Elder's Bracers at all times... +32 MP at first, then when that's used up, I switch to the IM for a small DEF boost. None of the other RSE are worth it in terms of DEF sacrifice for MP gain. You sacrifice too much DEF for RSE body and legs, and sandals only give you 12 MP. Likewise, Hairpins are worthless at mid-high levels since you will be sacrificing 15-25 defense... Anyways, with my equipment I have 159 MP: much less than any other race, but totally workable. Plus, I have more defense and HP than any other race as well.

Anyways, to answer your question, YES you need to cast spells as a PLD to keep hate. The most important spells will be Cure II, III and Flash (at least at my level). Be sure to sit immediately after each battle between pulls... don't worry too much about TP, your MP (and gathering hate) is much more important. The reason why this works out so well: surprise surprise, the mages in your PT need to rest as well! Even in the PTs I have with no refresh or BRD, I never run out of MP since I rest whenever the mages need to rest. And yes, I am talking about Taru mages with insane MP pools. Sure, it may get worse later, but at least up til 50 everything has been gravy =)

A note about the rather popular Taru PLD/WHM alternative. You realize that these poor tanks die with 1 hit and WS of some enemies right? Exorays in CN can do 600 damage, as can spiders in QSC with sickle slash. Taru PLD/WHM my level will probably have around 700 HP, possibly less. 1 crit and they're dead o_o So much for tanking...