Why People say Dragoon suck???

[DrkElement01]

DRG is very unloved and Ive never really been to sure why either...we arent a very appriciated DD
I hate how it can take me hours and hours to get a pt, even at my mid level >< I have been worried about this cus..I love DRG but some people say they stop playing it at higher levels because its just to hard to get invites.

[Yokai]

I don't think I've had a PT yet where I wasn't complimented on my Dmg output.

I get PT invites on reputation.

[Funguwari]

This is why I &quot;think&quot; (&gt;_&gt DRGs get a bad name

I was going to say that Polearm is a shitty weapon and a lot of mobs are resistant to it, the mobs that you fight most often, like... Crabs. Later levels there are much better Light SC starters and much better Light SC closers. Jumps miss 90% of the time, period. DRGs lack in STR so they don't do a lot of DMG per hit. They can't tank. Wyverns get owned by AoEs easily and Spirit Link makes your HP go down, making mages, get angry. Your wyvern never really MBs, it misses often and it only does 1/2 your damage... which... isn't much to begin with. Even if it does MB (wyvern breath) it dosen't do all that much. Anyone can be a fuidama partner... you don't need a ability to get out of the hate. MNKs, 60+ are perfect fuidama partners. They get SATA'd off of all the time. And they're not tanks either. But you don't seem them yelling: SE! PLEASE GIVE ME A ABILITY TO SHEAD THE HATE!

Also, your two hour is a wyvern. He dosen't do much. You guys never steal hate so a Super (or whatever it's called) Jump isn't nessacary. Once in a PT config. We were forced to fuidama off a RDM and a RNG/WAR, yes, no Utsusemi here. And the tank was able to pull hate off him or the mob was dead before anything got rough.

You guys also don't get any abilities 30+. The job just halts from there. Of course you might say...: I got my sub's stuff! Yes... good Dragoon. You were right! However, the DRK get his own abilties and traits stacked with his subs.

Also, you guys aren't versatile. You guys can only use polearms. Wait, I know you can use Swords... but you can't use anything good 60+. You're stuck using a already flawed weapon forever.

DRK: Sword, Great Sword, Shield, Scythe
WAR: Pretty much everything
MNK: H2H and Staffs (even though Staff is never used for EXP), H2H is a rocking weapon especially 65. IMO, one of the best weapons.

Can I think of more? Sure. But I wanna play FFXI. Not chat right now.

EDIT: Also, you have a lot of gimp n00bs in your class. I don't know why this job may attract them... You guys got a rough time because people choose it for the cool factor because they're well... "cool". Because they can't waste IRL time to farm because they got to chill, or smoke weed with their friends. It's either EXP @ Lv. 57 with their AF1 lance and their home town ring or logout... and in the end... that fool gets a invite because some group of mofos are desperate.

And DRGs aren't very good for HNM. I don't know why, but other classes do better.

I don't hate DRG but they lose their edge 60+ definitley. If you guys get some buffs 60+ then you'll be in the same place as every other DD.

[Kailea]

Funguwari, you are mostly right, but what most people do not relize is that DRG CAN sub any job and adapt to useing it to their best ability witch IMNO makes DRG a very good job, I became a Dragoon because I loved Kain from FFIV and that is what keeps me a Dragoon!

DRG/PLD emergency tank
DRG/DRK DD
DRG/WAR hate control
DRG/WHM backup healer
DRG/BLM MB caster (only use spells durring MB)
DRG/RDM Read this
DRG/MNK DD
DRG/SAM DD
DRG/NIN Blink tank
DRG/BRD an extra song doesnt hurt :p
DRG/SMN .......ok well not all jobs
DRG/RNG dito

now before you respond....dont give me any of that statistical crap, or any of that "you cant sub that" jazz....I dont want to hear that BS because that is all it is...BS
now useing these subs does not make DRG "leet" or anything but it makes them usefull in any condition, and that is what I realy think SE had in mind for DRG, it is just once the cookie cutter crap set in, it ruined that vision.......

*places Flame barrier in place and gets ready*

Ok go ahead and let he have it, and remember, dont flame it untill you have tried it yourself! stop being lazzy and try checking this info out foryourself for once..........

[Genuine]

omg jou guyz er so stupid. every1 no that dragun subs bard. were ja hell jou been. jou fa'cking maricons!





-Al Pacino a.k.a Genuine

[Kailea]

omg jou guyz er so stupid. every1 no that dragun subs bard. were ja hell jou been. jou fa'cking maricons!

*her flame shield shimmers and blocks the flame*

Genuine, if you are going to post.....use your brain first.........

[Kibagami]

LOL LOL LOL

Ok to the idiot up there that made a really long post about some really stupid shit.

DRG doesn't lack in strenght...if anything DRG does most of it's damage from the hits. Pretty nice DoT. Also DRG get super jump at 50....DRK and SAM are the ones that stop getting anything after 30.

THE ONLY and lemme repeat this... ONLY real problem DRG has is wheeling trhust. DRG is an SC opener not an ender. I always get invited to open up distortion for a THF. Later on i will get invited to open up Light. Now b4 66 the jobs i compete against are SAM and DRK to open that up. Thank god most DRK are retards and sub THF pre 60 and cause of that they don't get picked to open up SC. SAM is pretty weak compared to DRG at least from 1-50 . Even with kote, snips and all that shit thier enpi is not going to surpase double trhust of a well equiped DRG. Also DRG gets tp fast enough to catch up to a THF/NIN. Heck if you SAM sucks in the gear department you can even catch up to them even with meditate.

Once lvl 3 SC starts rolling in we compete against WAR and RNG. I already said this b4 but i'll say it again. RNG owns us in the dmg department plus he is THE puller of the party. WAR is probably the tank. We are only DD. We are not used for anything else. Therefore guess who get's picked last?

About being a SATA bitch. Yes everyone can do it. But it's not that good actually. I really prefer a WAR or a RNG/NIN to be it cause i do get hit hard. Heck if i wait too long for SATA to land i usually die. And so will MNKs and anything else cuase we don't gear ourself for defense, and sometimes we got berserk on, etc etc...

And no we don't need anything else besides polearms. We are SC openers...we don't need to be flexible about our weapons at all. And no one excells against crabs....only BLM you dumbass. Even your beloved MNK or the master RNG hates those. Geeeez dude.

Only bones give us problems....can you tell me how often you fight those? in almost a year of playin ived only xped of bones once....

And kailea i really love your suport and all but plz don't claim things we are not. We cannot sub everything. I would say that for xp purposes WAR and THF only...and THF only on certain parties. The rest of subs CAN have a use but not for xp matters.

[Kafeen]

Re: This is why I &quot;think&quot; (&gt;_&gt DRGs get a bad name

Originally posted by Funguwari
I was going to say that Polearm is a shitty weapon and a lot of mobs are resistant to it, the mobs that you fight most often, like... Crabs. Later levels there are much better Light SC starters and much better Light SC closers. Jumps miss 90% of the time, period. DRGs lack in STR so they don't do a lot of DMG per hit. They can't tank. Wyverns get owned by AoEs easily and Spirit Link makes your HP go down, making mages, get angry. Your wyvern never really MBs, it misses often and it only does 1/2 your damage... which... isn't much to begin with.

You see this is the sort of stuff that gives us a bad name. I had a parser running recently while fighting Robber Crabs. Something that according to Funguwari is something that we're weak against.

(THF/NIN)
Total Fights: 21
Average Damage: 736.71
Average Percent: 22.17
Average Accuracy: 72.83
Estimated DPS:

(SAM/WAR)
Total Fights: 21
Average Damage: 1015.48
Average Percent: 30.5
Average Accuracy: 71.97
Estimated DPS:

(PLD/WAR)
Total Fights: 21
Average Damage: 345.76
Average Percent: 10.4
Average Accuracy: 56.23
Estimated DPS:

(DRG/THF)
Total Fights: 21
Average Damage: 851.33
Average Percent: 25.55
Average Accuracy: 69.15
Estimated DPS:

(WYVERN)
Total Fights: 21
Average Damage: 288.38
Average Percent: 8.67
Average Accuracy: 73.49
Estimated DPS:

(WHM/BLM)
Total Fights: 0
Average Damage: 0.00
Average Percent: 0.00
Average Accuracy: 0.00
Estimated DPS:

(RDM/BLM)
Total Fights: 15
Average Damage: 12.4
Average Percent: 0.37
Average Accuracy: 0
Estimated DPS:

SC: Distortion
Total Fights: 18
Average Damage: 95
Average Percent: 2.85
Average Accuracy: 100
Estimated DPS:

As you can see we're not weak at all. My base damge was lower the the SAM/WAR. With his WAR sub he was using Beserk alot and his Ochi's Kote gave him a big attack boost in addition to his other equipment. But even with all that with my + my wyvern's damage we still managed to out damage him. There's some new equipment I'll be getting soon that should boost my attack even more. Oh, and about the wyvern taking alot of damege. I only needed to use spirit link two or three times, every time used after a fight and the HP I lost could be gotten back with a single Cure III. And jumps deffinatly do not miss 90% of the time.

[Kailea]

And kailea i really love your suport and all but plz don't claim things we are not. We cannot sub everything. I would say that for xp purposes WAR and THF only...and THF only on certain parties. The rest of subs CAN have a use but not for xp matters.

yes I know...but this is my point, NO ONE has every really tried messing with these in dept, all we have done is taken the advice of others and made that law.

[Rogan]

Originally posted by kuu

Defense matters, not the most important, but you need a decent amount depending on your pt.

Id hate to be in your pts

[Rogan]

Originally posted by Kailea-D
Funguwari, you are mostly right, but what most people do not relize is that DRG CAN sub any job and adapt to useing it to their best ability witch IMNO makes DRG a very good job, I became a Dragoon because I loved Kain from FFIV and that is what keeps me a Dragoon!

DRG/PLD emergency tank
DRG/DRK DD
DRG/WAR hate control
DRG/WHM backup healer
DRG/BLM MB caster (only use spells durring MB)
DRG/RDM Read this
DRG/MNK another backup tank
DRG/SAM DD
DRG/NIN Blink tank
DRG/BRD an extra song doesnt hurt :p
DRG/SMN .......ok well not all jobs
DRG/RNG dito

now before you respond....dont give me any of that statistical crap, or any of that "you cant sub that" jazz....I dont want to hear that BS because that is all it is...BS
now useing these subs does not make DRG "leet" or anything but it makes them usefull in any condition, and that is what I realy think SE had in mind for DRG, it is just once the cookie cutter crap set in, it ruined that vision.......

*places Flame barrier in place and gets ready*

Ok go ahead and let he have it, and remember, dont flame it untill you have tried it yourself! stop being lazzy and try checking this info out foryourself for once..........

ok here it is.. that was one of the stupidest things I have ever heard, none of those subs would get invites ever other than /war, /sam 60+ and /thf.

[Funguwari]

Originally posted by Kibagami
LOL LOL LOL

Ok to the idiot up there that made a really long post about some really stupid shit.

DRG doesn't lack in strenght...if anything DRG does most of it's damage from the hits. Pretty nice DoT. Also DRG get super jump at 50....DRK and SAM are the ones that stop getting anything after 30.

THE ONLY and lemme repeat this... ONLY real problem DRG has is wheeling trhust. DRG is an SC opener not an ender. I always get invited to open up distortion for a THF. Later on i will get invited to open up Light. Now b4 66 the jobs i compete against are SAM and DRK to open that up. Thank god most DRK are retards and sub THF pre 60 and cause of that they don't get picked to open up SC. SAM is pretty weak compared to DRG at least from 1-50 . Even with kote, snips and all that shit thier enpi is not going to surpase double trhust of a well equiped DRG. Also DRG gets tp fast enough to catch up to a THF/NIN. Heck if you SAM sucks in the gear department you can even catch up to them even with meditate.

Once lvl 3 SC starts rolling in we compete against WAR and RNG. I already said this b4 but i'll say it again. RNG owns us in the dmg department plus he is THE puller of the party. WAR is probably the tank. We are only DD. We are not used for anything else. Therefore guess who get's picked last?

About being a SATA bitch. Yes everyone can do it. But it's not that good actually. I really prefer a WAR or a RNG/NIN to be it cause i do get hit hard. Heck if i wait too long for SATA to land i usually die. And so will MNKs and anything else cuase we don't gear ourself for defense, and sometimes we got berserk on, etc etc...

And no we don't need anything else besides polearms. We are SC openers...we don't need to be flexible about our weapons at all. And no one excells against crabs....only BLM you dumbass. Even your beloved MNK or the master RNG hates those. Geeeez dude.

Only bones give us problems....can you tell me how often you fight those? in almost a year of playin ived only xped of bones once....

And kailea i really love your suport and all but plz don't claim things we are not. We cannot sub everything. I would say that for xp purposes WAR and THF only...and THF only on certain parties. The rest of subs CAN have a use but not for xp matters.

Well, you're right except WARs will do more damage than you over time and per swing. Except for WS. Wheeling Thrust is better than Mistral Axe from what I've seen. And WAR can be Tricked off of easy, as well as DRG because of your Super Jump. It really depends on situation. If we were fighting agianst crabs and whatnot, WAR defintiley. Bones, WAR definitley. But if it was for something like flies or anything along those lines... I'd pick the DRG. Sadly, there are more Crab or "hard" type, Polearm resistance monsters. And DRG stops developing via job TRAITS, not ABILITIES. DRK stops developing via job ABILTIES and continues to develop via job TRAITS. Therefore, giving DRK the advantage here. I'd rather have no abilties and all traits, it works out better in the long run (see: MNK).

[Balodoth]

Yeah? So?

Actually, Rogan. The reason they don't get an invite is because of the main job, not the sub job. Really, the "required" sub is like putting salt on the wound. Does it hurt us? Yeah. Is it the main factor? No.

For instance, I was trying to prove in my linkshell that there is no "right" sub, that subbing WHM for levels 1-10 to solo is no better than subbing RDM or WAR. Their argument was that it reduced downtime where RDM means no cure till lvl 6 & WAR means no cure at all. My point was that WAR & RDM gave more boosts to melee, which is pretty much all you can do (except BLM when you get Bind). That in turn made the fights shorter, allowed for chains--which are easier at that low level--and got more exp over time. By way of example, I made chain 3 at level 11 as DRG/WAR. I couldn't have done that as /WHM. I simply don't have enough MP or my wyvern enough HP for Heal Breath to make it work.

Now let's take DRG/BRD. Will it get a lot of invites? After 50, it can if the party members are thinking straight. While no job w/ BRD subbed can use instruments, there is little to no effect on Paeon or Ballad becuase of that. The ATK boost from Minuet doesn't quite make up for loss from WAR subjob, but adds up over the course of other melee. Also, the wyvern can do Heal Breath on red HP members from any song. I can sing an endless line of threnodies to trigger that. Did I mention there's no MP involved? That means no resting and losing TP. To recap, I refresh MP, I regen HP, I help everyone do more damage, I heal party members when things go bad, I can WS as normal and still get element breaths. In addition, I can madrigal or march (closer to level 60) if it helps the situation. I can solo/farm decently, and can use madrigal for skill points (I did the math and Jupiter Staff can outdamage spear on bones until, like, level. . . 62(?) I don't have the info with me right now).

You're right, /BRD won't get a lot of invites. But I feel it has a lot to offer a party once you get to level 50 and become mage-friendly. Sure it's not quite as powerful as BRD at that half-level with instruments, and the damage I cause may be through other people, but I can lower downtime, do all the jumps any other DRG can, and come through in a pinch. Now tell me that's not useful.

[Genuine]

jou kno i was joking bout bard....

[Kailea]

ok here it is.. that was one of the stupidest things I have ever heard, none of those subs would get invites ever other than /war, /sam 60+ and /thf.

ok look....I said nothing about invites, I was talking about what each combo can be used for, and yes these combos would get invites if it was not for the BS going around about this game and how it works, and it is all due to one group of lazy arss people that got togeather and said "Hey lets say this and this go togeather and not test it and say we did"