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  • BLU Tanking @ Lv.60+

    Last night I put my flag up and went farming, figuring it would take another 4 hours to get an invite as DRK as it did the night before. To my surprise, in about 20 minutes I get a /tell asking if I wanted to join a party this guy was building. I accepted and started heading to Whitegate.

    When I got there, and was finally invited, I checked to see what we had so far. We had a BRD, RDM, MNK, myself as DRK, and the BLU/NIN that was starting the party. He mentioned somebody else was on the way, but didn't lead onto what job they were. Once the person got to Whitegate, we found out the current set up was BLU, MNK, DRK, RDM, BRD, and BLM. We all hit the realization of "Where's the tank" at about the same time. The MNK beat me to it, and asked what we were doing about a tank, and the BLU said they were going to tank.

    Immediately a number of us expressed our skepticism, but the BLU assured us that with spells, gear and food, he could reach PLD like DEF. Then the issue came up of could a BLU keep hate from a Chronic Big Hitter (DRK), and a DoT King (MNK). I volunteered to sub /THF for SATA to take Berserk out of my equation, and help with hate issues, and we all aggreed to give it a try.

    We get the the camp, and I pull our first Puk, and hate is all over the place! Turns out the RDM he found only knew how to use two spells. Refresh and Cure IV. So the BLU takes a scratch and the RDM drops Cure IVs. We survived the first fight, MP seemed a tad low, but with a BRD and a RDM, MP shouldn't be a problem. Next fight we start out with the skillchain. RDM didn't stop their Cure Bombing, but hate was pretty well secured after a good Sickle Moon, and a rather impressive Distortion. (I actually felt like a THF at times. Distortions doing 300 to 490dmg at the highest.) Next fight, basically the same thing. Even if the MNK couldn't turn the Puk with Howling Fists, I still managed a decent enough Sickle Moon to secure hate.

    We kept this up for about an hour and half, at which point the MNK had to leave. We maintained Chain #5s the entire time, BLM was blasting with AMs near the end of the fights, and even thought the RDM never learned to hold off with Cure IV, I managed to help keep the BLU at the top of the hate list.

    After about 15 minutes a BST came to replace the MNK. Since there weren't any favorable Skillchain options with the BST, I switched to Scythe, the BST used an HQ Tiger Pet and DW'd Axes for Rampage. (I really wish I was on PC to have had a parser. BST was doing a consistant 400dmg+ Rampage, and I'm curious how he and his pet really measured up in overall damage.) Absorb-TP made sure I had TP at the start of every fight so I could drop a 500~900 TA Guillotine at the start. (I'd say Guillotine average was in the low to mid 700s. I had a few where the Puk would pop Zephyr Mantle or Flash on me so Acc was impaired on those lower ones.)

    Hate was set and we continued to Chain #5 all the way up to the end of the party. We never came close to breaking into Chain #6, but we only stopped pulling like 3 times for quick breaks, and replacing the MNK. (Wish I remembered that MNKs name. Would have liked to have given him credit. Was doing good damage, usually turned the mob with only Howling Fists, and had me on my toes trying to catch his TP. Double Attack & Kick Attacks really helped him jump ahead in TP.)

    The BLU's name was Saeval I ~believe~, and he did volunteer to tank, so I don't know if he already had "tanking gear." He had a Scorp. Harness at times, wore the Lv.55 Jaridah Peti at other times, I never paid attention to what sword he was using, and had no shield. So I have no idea if any BLU could do this, or would you have to be specifically geared toward it, but I'm now considering adding BLU to the list of possible tanks when I'm building parties. They'll need more help than a NIN to keep hate, but they can take the beating and put out some decent damage as well.
    Odude
    PS2 Beta tester - Cactaur - Rank 4
    RDM32 - BLM17 - DRK11 - RNG11 - BRD9 - BST7 - WAR6 - MNK4

    Lakshmi: Windurst Rank 10 - Zilart, CoP, ToAU COMPLETE - WotG
    SAM90 - DRK90 - MNK90 - WAR90 - RNG90 - BST90 - RDM83 - NIN50 - THF46 - DRG42 - BLM40 - PUP23 - WHM20 - PLD13 - BRD13 - BLU10 - SCH10 - DNC7 - COR5 - SMN1

  • #2
    Re: BLU Tanking @ Lv.60+

    Wow nice... as a thf I've know BLU's to take my SATAVB and then the tank to regain hate straight after but never seen a BLU tank.... Might have to suggest that and keep it in mind when I'm next building a party.

    Which Final Fantasy Character Are You?
    Final Fantasy

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    • #3
      Re: BLU Tanking @ Lv.60+

      Of course the obvious question is, if he wanted to tank, why didn't he sub WAR? He could have held much better hate that way... at level 74 I can see why you might want /NIN, but below that /NIN isn't really helpful to a full-time tank trying to keep hate most of the time (as opposed to someone that occasionally gets a SATA on them).

      A shield wouldn't have done him much good though as BLU has no native shield skill. BLU/WAR has only a subjob's shield skill which would not have blocked very many attacks. You still get the DEF of the shield itself but for the most part, in FFXI, a shield doesn't do you much good unless you know how to use it.

      A BLU can also heal himself or others for hate like a PLD, but has more MP to do it with. With the addition of Wild Carrot, BLU have a reasonably effective heal at most levels; at 60+ they should have Magic Fruit.
      Defeated: Maat, Divine Might, Fenrir, Kirin, Cactrot Rapido, Xolotl, Diabolos Prime, Kurrea, 9/10 Dynamis Bosses (missing Tav), Promathia, Proto-Ultima, Proto-Omega, 4 Jailers, Apocalypse Nigh, 6/6 Nyzul Bosses
      RDM90, PLD90, DRG90, COR90, SCH90, BLU54
      All Nations Rank 10, ZMs & PMs Complete, AUMs Complete, Captain, Nyzul Floor 100 (5 Weapons, 4 WS), Medal of Altana, WotG Mission 15, 1/3 Addons Complete, 9/9 Abyssea Main Quests, 6/6 Caturae

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      • #4
        Re: BLU Tanking @ Lv.60+

        Not to mention, a BLU around that level should be using Feather Barrier for the Evasion Boost, Magic Fruit for healing and hate holding, and gear/spells that promote VIT, Evasion and AGI (AF pants have VIT and AGI +3, and the AF feet have +10 Evasion skill. The AF hands have +10 to parry skill, but one may opt for a different item in that slot, especially if the BLU's parry skill isn't really up to snuff.)

        Really, a BLU in a tank position needs to meld the PLD side and the NIN side of tanking in order to do a good job. With Regards to a Shield, BLU has access to maybe 2 or 3 at that level, and It's better off used for stats and the numerical defense than anything. Furthermore, many are quite expensive (i.e. Astral Shield) and are thus kinda beyond most people's means.

        Still, this is just another reason BLU is so versatile. We can play DD, Main Heal, Tank, or solo. Might be a bit gear intensive, but it's well worth it.

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        • #5
          Re: BLU Tanking @ Lv.60+

          He did sub WAR. Sorry if I didn't included that, they were originally /NIN but once they decided they were going to be tanking, they did sub WAR.

          He did use his various healing spells to help him keep hate, but he didn't have anything like Cure IV with Light Staff right at the start of the fight to help secure hate. It really came down to the RDM not working well with the BLU. The MNK or I didn't get a chance to pull hate early on because the RDM was already working on it.
          Odude
          PS2 Beta tester - Cactaur - Rank 4
          RDM32 - BLM17 - DRK11 - RNG11 - BRD9 - BST7 - WAR6 - MNK4

          Lakshmi: Windurst Rank 10 - Zilart, CoP, ToAU COMPLETE - WotG
          SAM90 - DRK90 - MNK90 - WAR90 - RNG90 - BST90 - RDM83 - NIN50 - THF46 - DRG42 - BLM40 - PUP23 - WHM20 - PLD13 - BRD13 - BLU10 - SCH10 - DNC7 - COR5 - SMN1

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          • #6
            Re: BLU Tanking @ Lv.60+

            BLU can tank but inferior to PLD and NIN, period. I tried tanking for several parties, you can maintain chain #5 but PLD or NIN are better. You can achieve only 4000-6000 exp / hour with BLU tanking but I bet PLD or NIN tanking could do even further.

            See my thread below,

            http://www.ffxionline.com/forums/blu...r-tanking.html

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            • #7
              Re: BLU Tanking @ Lv.60+

              Originally posted by eva00r View Post
              BLU can tank but inferior to PLD and NIN, period. I tried tanking for several parties, you can maintain chain #5 but PLD or NIN are better. You can achieve only 4000-6000 exp / hour with BLU tanking but I bet PLD or NIN tanking could do even further.

              See my thread below,

              http://www.ffxionline.com/forums/blu...r-tanking.html
              Given how big a pain it is to find a tank anymore (3 tanks online, 2 in a party, one AFK. Meanwhile, a bajillion DD seeking.), I think people will take what they can get.

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              • #8
                Re: BLU Tanking @ Lv.60+

                I am wondering would spamming Head Butt (stun) helps BLU tanking at level 60? How often HEad Butt is resisted, and how long is the stun effect lasted?
                Server: Quetzalcoatl
                Race: Hume Rank 7
                75 PLD, 75 SAM, 75 WAR, 75 NIN, 75 MNK, 65 BLU

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                • #9
                  Re: BLU Tanking @ Lv.60+

                  Originally posted by eva00r View Post
                  BLU can tank but inferior to PLD and NIN, period. I tried tanking for several parties, you can maintain chain #5 but PLD or NIN are better. You can achieve only 4000-6000 exp / hour with BLU tanking but I bet PLD or NIN tanking could do even further.
                  You do know that almost all exp (as opposed to merit) parties make less than this, right?

                  4k/hr is amazingly good for any party under 65. 65-70ish it's still really good. 2k/hr is still typical for PLD and NIN parties.

                  Some people's parsers just don't know what an hour is, I think. Or they're not subtracting out empress band exp. Because claims of insanely inflated exp are all over the place and it just doesn't happen in real parties.
                  Defeated: Maat, Divine Might, Fenrir, Kirin, Cactrot Rapido, Xolotl, Diabolos Prime, Kurrea, 9/10 Dynamis Bosses (missing Tav), Promathia, Proto-Ultima, Proto-Omega, 4 Jailers, Apocalypse Nigh, 6/6 Nyzul Bosses
                  RDM90, PLD90, DRG90, COR90, SCH90, BLU54
                  All Nations Rank 10, ZMs & PMs Complete, AUMs Complete, Captain, Nyzul Floor 100 (5 Weapons, 4 WS), Medal of Altana, WotG Mission 15, 1/3 Addons Complete, 9/9 Abyssea Main Quests, 6/6 Caturae

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                  • #10
                    Re: BLU Tanking @ Lv.60+

                    Originally posted by Celeal View Post
                    I am wondering would spamming Head Butt (stun) helps BLU tanking at level 60? How often HEad Butt is resisted, and how long is the stun effect lasted?
                    The stun effect lasts a second or so, in my experience, unless I hit for really weak damage, in which case not even that. It'd be good for BLU on the sole fact that that one second can be spent casting Magic Fruit or reapplying a buff. I'd say the same goes for other stuns, but other stuns tend to have lengthy recasts. (I'm not sure about Frypan, but BlitzStrahl and Jettatura are horribly slow casting.

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                    • #11
                      Re: BLU Tanking @ Lv.60+

                      BLU/PLD can also tank, BUT that's a lv 75 story. Spamming Flash, Actinic Burst, Zephyr Mantle helps.

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                      • #12
                        Re: BLU Tanking @ Lv.60+

                        Originally posted by Karinya View Post
                        4k/hr is amazingly good for any party under 65. 65-70ish it's still really good. 2k/hr is still typical for PLD and NIN parties.
                        2K/hr hasn't been the gold standard since about 3 years ago Karinya...

                        I'd say the true average pre-55 is about 3K per hour (assuming you're not in one of those totally dysfunctional parties that can't kill anything). Good parties can push 4-5K per hour if everything clicks.

                        At 55-70 for some jobs, XP per hour in a good party can climb up to about 7K per hour, but the average party still remains around 4K.

                        70+ even traditional parties can make 5K per hour, and the various burn-style parties at this point are pulling in 9K++.

                        Some people's parsers just don't know what an hour is, I think. Or they're not subtracting out empress band exp. Because claims of insanely inflated exp are all over the place and it just doesn't happen in real parties.
                        Not all the claims are inflated. I just got out of a merit party that clocked in just a shade under 50,000 limit points in about 2.5 hours (I know the time is right because I ate a Marron Glace while we were waiting for people to arrive at camp, and it wore off about 15 minutes after I got back to town). Granted, we had the spot all to ourselves and were pulling chain #50+, but that doesn't change the numbers.


                        Icemage

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                        • #13
                          Re: BLU Tanking @ Lv.60+

                          Originally posted by Icemage View Post
                          Not all the claims are inflated. I just got out of a merit party that clocked in just a shade under 50,000 limit points in about 2.5 hours (I know the time is right because I ate a Marron Glace while we were waiting for people to arrive at camp, and it wore off about 15 minutes after I got back to town). Granted, we had the spot all to ourselves and were pulling chain #50+, but that doesn't change the numbers.

                          Icemage
                          That's how I calculate my EXP/hr as well. How much EXP I gained in the party, and how much food I ate. As RDM it's always pretty easy. How much EXP did I gain before my Glace wore off? So if I gained 3 Merit Points before my Glace wears off, we gained roughly 10k an hour. As Melee, if I gained a total of 10k EXP and only ate 4 Sushi then that's 5k an hour.

                          But I do believe some people have a some inflated notions of EXP/hr. I've been in a party with a group that says they always gain 10k an hour and then after 3 hours I hadn't gained a total of 10k with them.

                          Though I find if I can gain positive EXP, and get Chain #5 I'm fairly happy with EXP. I set goals for EXP I would like to gain each night I EXP, but I'm not going to expect 10k/hr like I've heard some people do.
                          Odude
                          PS2 Beta tester - Cactaur - Rank 4
                          RDM32 - BLM17 - DRK11 - RNG11 - BRD9 - BST7 - WAR6 - MNK4

                          Lakshmi: Windurst Rank 10 - Zilart, CoP, ToAU COMPLETE - WotG
                          SAM90 - DRK90 - MNK90 - WAR90 - RNG90 - BST90 - RDM83 - NIN50 - THF46 - DRG42 - BLM40 - PUP23 - WHM20 - PLD13 - BRD13 - BLU10 - SCH10 - DNC7 - COR5 - SMN1

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                          • #14
                            Re: BLU Tanking @ Lv.60+

                            I never "expect" to gain anything from an XP party. If a party sucks I'll say so (and leave if it doesn't improve), but anything over 3K/hour is gravy and makes me happy.

                            Incidentally, that party I mentioned above was by far the most efficient party I've ever had. It was made exclusively with members from my LS (who are so pimped out I'm embarassed to party with them sometimes, and my gear isn't "that" bad ). I logged back in after I posted that and realized that I still had my Marron Glace active - I thought it had worn off before I logged out, but that's not the case - it still took another 15 minutes for it to wear. Realistic estimate for the time I spent actually earning XP in that party is closer to 2.25 hours, and looking at my merits, I went from 3 merit points + ~7000 limits to 8 merits + ~6000 limits, with no XP ring available. Roughly 21K/hr (!).

                            ---

                            Coming back to the original topic of BLU/NIN tanking, one of my friends in-game is pushing level 70 BLU now as BLU/NIN. He can still tank, but it's impossible to hold hate without a THF to plant a Trick Attack.


                            Icemage

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                            • #15
                              Re: BLU Tanking @ Lv.60+

                              Originally posted by Icemage View Post
                              2K/hr hasn't been the gold standard since about 3 years ago Karinya...
                              I'd say the true average pre-55 is about 3K per hour (assuming you're not in one of those totally dysfunctional parties that can't kill anything). Good parties can push 4-5K per hour if everything clicks.
                              I think this is a bit optimistic. I didn't say 2k was a good party, but rather an average one; some are better, some are worse. (The worse ones are rather irritating to contemplate and even more irritating to actually be in, but they do exist. If you exclude the marginal parties from the "average" it's not a real average.) Few pickups break 3k/hr before 51, though. The Dark Staff is the real revolution in XP rate IMO. Before that parties are frequently limited in pulling rate by MP concerns. After, rarely.

                              If you haven't partied below 70 in a while you can easily think that because you're gaining levels in 3 hours you must be making 10k+ per hour, but you're not. It's just the lower TNL.
                              At 55-70 for some jobs, XP per hour in a good party can climb up to about 7K per hour, but the average party still remains around 4K.
                              70+ even traditional parties can make 5K per hour, and the various burn-style parties at this point are pulling in 9K++.
                              Again, I think those are a bit high; it's certainly possible to pull in those numbers, but it is by no means average. Maybe your average party is above average. Do you often party with at least one or two friends or LS members that you already know are highly skilled and equipped, or a partial static?
                              Defeated: Maat, Divine Might, Fenrir, Kirin, Cactrot Rapido, Xolotl, Diabolos Prime, Kurrea, 9/10 Dynamis Bosses (missing Tav), Promathia, Proto-Ultima, Proto-Omega, 4 Jailers, Apocalypse Nigh, 6/6 Nyzul Bosses
                              RDM90, PLD90, DRG90, COR90, SCH90, BLU54
                              All Nations Rank 10, ZMs & PMs Complete, AUMs Complete, Captain, Nyzul Floor 100 (5 Weapons, 4 WS), Medal of Altana, WotG Mission 15, 1/3 Addons Complete, 9/9 Abyssea Main Quests, 6/6 Caturae

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