Laevateinn is Garbage

[Malacite]

Was over on BG for a bit when I stumbled up on this;

Kanican - Laevateinn and Tupsimati



Long story short, even a poorly geared BLM will outparse the Mythic with HQ staves. That's very depressing and as Kanican points out, SE needs to get a better grip of the mage metahame.

After reading his post I doubt that even with Lv 2 AM and the -Magic def from Vidohunir that the mythic will be worth it, especially considering how often a BLM will have TP to begin with.

It all makes me very sad after seeing this =/

[Icemage]

Re: Laevateinn is Garbage

The problem isn't that Laeveteinn is bad. The problem is that HQ elemental staves are too good. If you had a weapon with similar stats for any other job, it'd be considered borderline overpowered.


Icemage

[Mhurron]

Re: Laevateinn is Garbage

Long story short, even a poorly geared BLM will outparse the Mythic with HQ staves

So don't get it and stop whining about it.

[ruffrydasean]

Re: Laevateinn is Garbage

The problem isn't that Laeveteinn is bad. The problem is that HQ elemental staves are too good...

This.

[Armando]

Re: Laevateinn is Garbage

The problem isn't that Laeveteinn is bad. The problem is that HQ elemental staves are too good. If you had a weapon with similar stats for any other job, it'd be considered borderline overpowered.

While I won't debate that that's certainly a really big problem that's been left untackled for years, it doesn't really prevent them from making a Mythic more broken than the HQ staves. Since the staves are "standard" gear, the Mythic should outperform them.

On the bright side at least this being on Kanican's blog increases the chances that it'll get ninjapatched.

[Ziero]

Re: Laevateinn is Garbage

Should've had a Mythic Spell

[Mhurron]

Re: Laevateinn is Garbage

the Mythic should outperform them.

Why? The choice to get it is more to wave it around then for performance. Claustrum sucks donkey balls for BLM and SMN but I haven't seen anyone whine about it yet. They're both e-peen extenders and simply having them fill that use.

On top of that, the whole thing is focused on the assumption that the Mythic (and other staves) were intended to replace the Elemental staves. I'm really supposed to believe that SE can't pull up the stats on their own gear and add stuff to it to make it better? Do you really think they have to stab blindly in the dark with the hopes that they'll make a piece of gear that is better when they create a new weapon.

They added some weapons for BLM. I see no effort to replace the Elemental Staves.

[Vyuru]

Re: Laevateinn is Garbage

And yet, that's the finding you get when comparing it to HQ staffs, which are not cheap and any Blm who has one I would not call "Poorly equipped" If all he had were a HQ staff and nekkid though that's gimped, but the point stands. So what are the findings when you compare the NQ staffs to the mythic?

Just skimmed it before I dash to class, but here's a thought. Varies by the amount of damage it gives sure, but could the benefit be simply from having one staff to do what it took you several staffs in order to do before?

And echoing Icemage's and Mhurron's comments.

[Armando]

Re: Laevateinn is Garbage

Why? The choice to get it is more to wave it around then for performance. Claustrum sucks donkey balls for BLM and SMN but I haven't seen anyone whine about it yet. They're both e-peen extenders and simply having them fill that use.

On top of that, the whole thing is focused on the assumption that the Mythic (and other staves) were intended to replace the Elemental staves. I'm really supposed to believe that SE can't pull up the stats on their own gear and add stuff to it to make it better? Do you really think they have to stab blindly in the dark with the hopes that they'll make a piece of gear that is better when they create a new weapon.

They added some weapons for BLM. I see no effort to replace the Elemental Staves.

Long story short because of Kanican's post.

You can say it's e-peen all you want but Burgang is pretty damned nice and apparently there's no real use for Laevateinn besides lolBLMmelee. There's a big difference between "not supposed to replace the HQ staves" and "not supposed to be useful at all."

The least they can do is have some consistency. It's stupid that Mythics are more useful than non-Relic weapons for a bunch of jobs but useless for others. Either make them all useful in some way or make them all e-peen status items.

[Ziero]

Re: Laevateinn is Garbage

Why? The choice to get it is more to wave it around then for performance. Claustrum sucks donkey balls for BLM and SMN but I haven't seen anyone whine about it yet.

Seriously? A lot of people consider the Claustrum garbage because it's so weak. But at least it gives Refresh after a WS.

On top of that, the whole thing is focused on the assumption that the Mythic (and other staves) were intended to replace the Elemental staves. I'm really supposed to believe that SE can't pull up the stats on their own gear and add stuff to it to make it better? Do you really think they have to stab blindly in the dark with the hopes that they'll make a piece of gear that is better when they create a new weapon.

They added some weapons for BLM. I see no effort to replace the Elemental Staves.

Mythics and Relics are supposed to be the strongest weapons in the game. Mythics are supposed to be the best Job Specific weapon and Relics are supposed to be the strongest of each weapon type. So why shouldn't they be more useful and powerful then easily crafted, fairly common, AH gear.

Replace? No. They should surpass Elemental Staves, even HQs. The fact they don't is pretty much ridiculous.

And yet, that's the finding you get when comparing it to HQ staffs, which are not cheap and any Blm who has one I would not call "Poorly equipped" If all he had were a HQ staff and nekkid though that's gimped, but the point stands. So what are the findings when you compare the NQ staffs to the mythic?

You can easily have 1-2 HQ staves and still be a gimped BLM gear wise.

Just skimmed it before I dash to class, but here's a thought. Varies by the amount of damage it gives sure, but could the benefit be simply from having one staff to do what it took you several staffs in order to do before?

Anyone who would prefer to spend millions upon millions to do less damage but save 3-4 inven space has their priorities mixed up.

[Mhurron]

Re: Laevateinn is Garbage

They should surpass Elemental Staves, even HQs. The fact they don't is pretty much ridiculous.

As a single weapon, it does. Its just that if you want to you can get specific weapons that out perform it for specific spells.

For the elemental Staves to be better then this weapon for every occasion, you need all 8.

Mythic Staff is good for everything.
Pluto's staff is better for Dark elemental magic, does nothing for anything that isn't light, and hinders light spells.
Aquillo's is better for Ice, does nothing for anything that isn't Wind, and hinders wind.
And so on.

X sucks because if I get A, B and C I get better stats.

Mythic has no negative effects, it's a better physical weapon, it gives you 7 inventory slots if you choose to go with just it. Or you can choose to get the 8 that it requires to actually get better.

Most BLM will not choose to go the one staff route with the mythic, but that doesn't change the fact that as a single weapon it does surpass the Elemental staves. If you think that makes it useless then don't get the mythic but damnit quit whining.

[Omgwtfbbqkitten]

Re: Laevateinn is Garbage

Hate to point this fact out, but these are practically melee weapons for mages.

If SE had any intention of creating something that was better than Elemental Staves, they would have done it well before mythic.

This isn't a matter of SE failing to understand mage jobs, its a matter of players thinking they know better than SE does and being very wrong about that.

[Armando]

Re: Laevateinn is Garbage

Mhurron, even if you were right, SE said the Mythics are supposed to enhance the jobs in some way (thus not necessarily replacing or being on equal terms with Relics, just doing something different) and Laevateinn's +10 to +15 MAB during Elemental Seal is nothing more than a bad joke.

Also, again I point to Burtgang. It's very clearly a tanking sword and a useful one at that (it has good DPS but all Mythics do; its stats are still tailored around tanking.) It exceeds Macuahuitl's Enmity bonus, Hauteclaire's Damage reduction, wraps them up in a single package so you can have both things at the same time, and adds that nifty reduced enmity loss when taking physical damage for uniqueness. If you argue that mage Mythics are basically meleeing weapons then you have that big inconsistency there. They're supposed to be useful for the mage's primary function in some way that isn't giving you a better paddle to hit things with, even if they're not the end-all weapon and you don't end up using it full time.

[Ziero]

Re: Laevateinn is Garbage

As a single weapon, it does. Its just that if you want to you can get specific weapons that out perform it for specific spells.

For the elemental Staves to be better then this weapon for every occasion, you need all 8.

Mythic Staff is good for everything.
Pluto's staff is better for Dark elemental magic, does nothing for anything that isn't light, and hinders light spells.
Aquillo's is better for Ice, does nothing for anything that isn't Wind, and hinders wind.
And so on.

X sucks because if I get A, B and C I get better stats.

Mythic has no negative effects, it's a better physical weapon, it gives you 7 inventory slots if you choose to go with just it. Or you can choose to get the 8 that it requires to actually get better.

You're still going to carry around a Dark Staff, HQ or not, wherever you go. Always. Has nothing to do with nuking. And if a Blm is carrying a Light Staff, again HQ or not, it has nothing to do with nuking. So right there, you're already carrying 3 staves if you get the Mythic. Ice and Thunder are a Blm's bread and butter, on the vast majority of mobs in this game, you will be nuking with those two elements. So of course a Blm would want to boost them as much as possible, via Thunder and Ice staves. Earth Staff still has that 20% Dmg redux, which is always helpful in a pinch, regardless of if you use it for nukes or not. So in the end, you'll at most replace 3-4 staves because the rest still have uses for more then just nukes.

At the very least, the Mythic should let you nuke harder then a common, every day AH item.

If you think that makes it useless then don't get the mythic but damnit quit whining.

I don't have to want it or get it to say why it's not all that impressive. It's a shame that mages in this game are tied down to 8 different weapons they obtain at 51 where other jobs are able to upgrade to better as they level and play. The best weapons for a job in the entire game shouldn't be obtained before you can even where your freaking AF.

Hate to point this fact out, but these are practically melee weapons for mages.

If SE had any intention of creating something that was better than Elemental Staves, they would have done it well before mythic.

This isn't a matter of SE failing to understand mage jobs, its a matter of players thinking they know better than SE does and being very wrong about that.

And the fact that the rarest, hardest to obtain weapons for mages all focus on melee abilities points out that no, SE does not have a good grasp on how people play mages.

[Omgwtfbbqkitten]

Re: Laevateinn is Garbage

And the fact that the rarest, hardest to obtain weapons for mages all focus on melee abilities points out that no, SE does not have a good grasp on how people play mages.

What other mage weapons focus on melee stats as immensely as these?

Think hard.

Right, there aren't really any other than mythic.