Which Job Should I Play?

[ItazuraNhomango]

Re: Which Job Should I Play?

Bautier,

I mentioned RDM can (slowly) soloing to help differentiate it from other jobs. I don't understand why you harp on that so much; it's a distinguishing feature of RDM, and it's not /NIN only at all by any stretch of the imagination.

And, yes, the "endgame" bit is somewhat contradictory; I'm attempting to satisfy you while making sure there's a better reason to include /NIN than just soloing on RDM, a job which doesn't need to solo to advance to Lv.75.

Looking back, BLM/NIN wouldn't have made it if not for the conditions which made BLM soloing such a necessity. Even then, I probably wouldn't have included it if it didn't turn out to be useful in endgame, since BLM/WHMs have been solo'ing for the longest time now.

The bottom line is that while endgame use is a small factor, it may push /NIN over the threshold--I don't have the experience or the time to research RDM endgame use, so figured you can contribute your expertise to settle that aspect of the issue, if you cared so much that /NIN is included.

* * *

I have used RDM/NIN, BTW, and looking forward to testing /BLU37 soon. This is not a guide for what you like to do as a solo RDM, nor what I use--it's about serving players new to RDM or some other job.

For these Lv.1 RDM people, do they, or do they not not need to get /NIN37 for their RDM? That, is the question.

My perspective? I've seen my sister's Elvaan RDM do some pretty nifty things for years--she didn't have /NIN37 until just a few months ago. She still haven't used RDM/NIN in practice, to my knowledge, since she's so comfortable with RDM/BLM and RDM/WHM, and brings out the /DRK when Stun is needed.

[hongman]

Re: Which Job Should I Play?

lol.

Ok, first things first. If you consider what RDM can do for others more than themselves, then I am fighting a losing battle. Soloing is just that - soloing. For your OWN pleasure and challenge.

In your guide, it matters not as you have already put it, so why continue? Why hint at RDM endgame tanking? That is not a way of primarily gaining exp.

I thought this guide was supposed to cover all (most) aspects of a job if you are going to level it, not just exp based information.

And yet you still mention soloing in the RDM part.

So much conflicting information, and so much resistance to adding a popular and already well established support job to this guide?!

And for your information, you will quickly find the majority of RDM solo /NIN is not for duel wielding. In fact, the majority of RDM solo you wont even have a weapon out (by solo I mean stuff you cant just beat to death holding 1 or 2 weapons regardless. Any job can do that.)

I'm not interested in putting forth arguement after arguement. The information on RDM is not complete in my eyes, until you acknowledge the true potential of the job. Hell, if you arent going to stick /NIN in there on solo basis alone, you may as well remove soloing from the reptoire.

EDIT: Ok, had a thought for your justification of adding /NIN in there. It follows the same principle that you have adding /DRK in there for Chain Stun. If this doesnt do it, I dont know what will.

In endgame, you will find RDM's are called upon a lot to kite /NIN. Reasons? An RDM has all the tools to be self sufficient in claiming and maintaining themselves, and keeping hate with their own natural line of spells.

You will find this probably more than you will find RDM/NIN tanking in endgame, as you already mentioned that yourself...

Although if you dont add something pertaining to RDM solo in there subbing /NIN I will personally still consider this guide innacurate and incomplete. I wont be able to sleep at night!

[ItazuraNhomango]

Re: Which Job Should I Play?

Frankly, I'm more interested in whether S-E mean to keep two-handed weapon's output as is then one person repeating the " /NIN for RDM" mantra. That said, the two-handed and PUP updates makes this guide outdated; it's in need of a substantial overhaul. I can revise the RDM section while I'm at it, but I'm not going to be moved by an one-liner "I think ..." or an "I feel ...".

Put forth a real argument--and remember that I consider what RDM can do for others more important than what they can do for themselves. (Same goes for any job.)

Ability to solo is a perk, and if you want to solo on /NIN or /PUP or whatever is just fine by me. Your time to use, your exp to risk, your support job to choose--in my guide, it matters not, unless it's the primary way of gaining exp on a job.

Or, write your own guide. =b

p.s. Hint: "RDM/NIN endgame tanking"

[hongman]

Re: Which Job Should I Play?

I still think /NIN ought to be there for RDM.

If you are going to even mention soloing for RDM, /NIN has its place.

[Malacite]

Re: Which Job Should I Play?

Was just replying to BBQ's comment. Relax. Generally when I read something like that and it puts an idea in my head, my first reaction on here is to get it out there.


de-railment over. ^^b

[ItazuraNhomango]

Re: Which Job Should I Play?

Malacite, this is not a job design or wishlist thread. Kindly keep to the topic and the reality of the jobs as they are today, please.

[Malacite]

Re: Which Job Should I Play?

>. > personally on the subject of BST I think it would have been a lot better on SE's part to have stuck with the killer traits of FFIX.

At least that way, even without /WAR or even a pet BST would still be a respectable (even feared ~.^) DD on the battlefield. Maybe 1.5 damage modifier? automatic double damage would be a bit much. Maybe increased crits... something other than the intimidation effect.

While intimidation is neat, it just doesn't compare IMO to what those traits did for the melee characters in IX. Having the different pets scare/be scared is enough, and these guys are supposed to know all about these creatures right? So it makes even more sense to go with increased damage (knowledge of their anatomies for surgical strikes, etc)

Somehow, I just can't see a Malboro being intimidated by some random shmuck... the same goes for the other jobs with these traits too. Since when do the undead feel fear?!

[Omgwtfbbqkitten]

Re: Which Job Should I Play?

On the contrary, the changes make the job much easier to endure pre-leave since they no longer have to endure an EXP penalty for charming EM pets. Basically, back when I and other BSTs levelled pre-35, we had to live with the EXP penalty and getting to 35 was a long, long road solo. Post-Leave we were forced to discard our pets like tissues to avoid the EXP penalty.

So the change made the job a little easier and more welcoming to play, getting to 35 is no longer the steep challenge it once was.

The duration of various jugs got extended and pets got an additional way to Regen HP outside of reward.

The description of BST makes absolutely no mention of Leave whatsoever.

I actually find much of the guide steers far too conservative the more I go back to it. The section on expense especially bugs me since it makes NIN, COR and RNG sound more expensive than they actually are, making them unattractive by labeling a consumable job as an "annoyance." Its not that hard to fund these jobs. I'm not a rich player, I've mananged RNG and COR to 75 just fine.

In fact, there's a lot of things that offset the ammo expenses, particularly since Ranged Accuracy Rings are cheap as dirt, Xbow ammo is insanely good and cheap and most of the best weapons and armor are quested, NM or BS/KS/ENM drops.

[ItazuraNhomango]

Re: Which Job Should I Play?

Thanks for the reminder. I'll get to it by this weekend; planning to devote the next big chunk of free time to the Japanese-English Bard Song List from Skiewalker.

[Silent Howler]

Re: Which Job Should I Play?

/scratches head

What did beastmasters get?

A few things. http://www.playonline.com/pcd/topics...12/detail.html But not really anything that should make the description on the first page be changed.

[Vyuru]

Re: Which Job Should I Play?

BST info to reflect the August changes as well.

/scratches head

What did beastmasters get?

[Omgwtfbbqkitten]

Re: Which Job Should I Play?

COR's buffs now can generally match or exceed those of a BRD's, even the common ones between them, so BRD's only real edge is March and Horde Lullaby. Might be good to update PUP and BST info to reflect the August changes as well.

[ItazuraNhomango]

Re: Which Job Should I Play?

Changed my mind about WAR/SAM and BLM/NIN; credits/blames to Amele and Mosh.

Also clarified that SMN can get Avatar without Prime fights, and BRD can pull at earlier levels, based on Mosh's suggestion.

p.s. BBQ's info was incorporated a while back; thank you.

[Omgwtfbbqkitten]

Re: Which Job Should I Play?

COR - Enhances allies performance via random percentage bonuses based on job traits, Uses Quick Draw as a mild damage nuke which enhances enfeebles and debuffs to the matching element

I know I said this in the past, but the "debuffs to the matching element" has been proven wrong. I adjusted this error in my guide, so I thought I'd just pass it on. The elemental Quick Draws do enhance enfeebles, bringing them to a higher tier of that same enfeeble, but they do not debuff to an element like Threnody or Elemental Ninjutsu can.

[Amele]

Re: Which Job Should I Play?

I guess its just something to keep the COR + BRD combo from being too potent and to counterbalance both jobs. Though I think it fails miserably in that intention, since having both jobs in PT is still a very potent combination.

I imagine this is it - since it makes cor + brd not particularly above the curve of cor + cor or brd + brd

with additional potency to bard debuffs, cor + brd would be the only way to fly.