So... Starcraft 2?

[Ufgt]

Re: So... Starcraft 2?

As a protoss player, I never had a problem with reapers. Getting that zealot/sentry/stalker mix at the beginning of the game was enough to hold off whatever early push terran could do.

Reapers are now over nerfed and almost no one uses them.

[DakAttack]

Re: So... Starcraft 2?

stir the pot

In YOUR endo.

Anyways, an increase in cost is all I want to see for Reactor attachments. Increasing mineral cost to 100 and gas cost to 75 would do enough without going completely overboard. I like that it sort of balances things out a bit, as in Tech lab has a low cost for high cost units and Reactor would have a high cost for low cost units. It's long build time makes it a slight gamble, but it's not that difficult to make a few marines while you raise the gas to pay for the Reactor, which will sit behind a wall while it completes and defend pretty effectively.

Sensor towers used to be a great tool in dealing with Void Rays, since you'd get some advance notice on any air movement before they could move in and charge on a building. Now, it's not that important, but it's still nice to have. With the proper placement, you can monitor nearby expansions, as well.

Zerg could still use some anti-air in their tier one units. And it would be neat if there were more of a benefit to burrow than just being undetectable. Even if it's something extremely small it would go a long way to making Zerg feel more Zerg-like. Perhaps a small leap from their hiding spots to help bridge a the gap a little more quickly, or a small boost to attack speed for their next two attacks.

[Malacite]

Re: So... Starcraft 2?

The biggest, most annoying issue I believe was when someone did a Reaper + SCV rush and built a bunker near your mineral line. Since reapers are so fast and deal ridiculous building damage for a freaking light infantry unit, it was a little imba. But I still say increasing the gas cost would have been more sensible since it slows the rush down while not destroying the strategy altogether.

I mean if you're gonna waste the money on a factory you may as well just transition into 3 M, Mech or 1 1 1 since the 200 minerals and 100 gas you just blew on the stupid factory could have gone towards more Barracks or reapers. Really all they are good for is early mineral line harassment but not even that now since the factory requirement pretty much means that a protoss player will have time to get out Stalkers or Zerg will have metabolic boost negating whatever advantage the nitro packs may have given.

Besides that's what scouting is for. It's your own fault if you don't keep tabs on what your opponent is doing. Terran even gets that ridiculous freaking sensor tower which no one ever seems to build and I don't get why lol. It doesn't tell you what is coming your way exactly but it's sure as hell nice to know in advance that something is in fact coming to stir the pot.

[DakAttack]

Re: So... Starcraft 2?

Yea, the Reaper nerf was a little overdone. They weren't impossible to defend against, you just needed to build a few heavy units to keep in your mineral line.

[Malacite]

Re: So... Starcraft 2?

I like my gateway units.

No kidding, pretty hard to say no to near-instant reinforcements. Psi Storm alone isn't enough to deal with MMM though, especially if the Terran player starts bringing in Ghosts. A couple of Colossi + well-placed storms should get the job done just fine.

As far as Terran being imba goes, I'd like to see Blizzard undo the Factory requirement on Nitro packs and just increase the gas cost another 25~50. It still slows it down a bit that way but without being a huge drain on the Terran player. Reapers really don't need any nerfing far as I'm concerned except for their building damage. What the helll do they ever drop buildings hella fast, and that's the real problem with them. You don't usually see units in RTS with that kind of mobility & damage and for good reason (Hi2u C&C2 Prism Tanks, holy crap talk about an imba unit)


Other than that, really the only nerfing Terran should be hit with is Marauder HP. 125 is a little insane.

[Ufgt]

Re: So... Starcraft 2?

That's why unit comp is equally as important as unit numbers.

For Toss, Storm destroys the shit out of anything bio, and is decent against armor as well. Forcefield also splits armies. Vikings suck balls lol, but that's because I very rarely go air. Or Collosus for that matter. I like my gateway units.

[DakAttack]

Re: So... Starcraft 2?

I think Terran Reactor is necessary for T to keep up with the other races' macro in the mid to late game. Zerg has larva inject and Toss has warpgates. Without reactor, there's no way T can make enough units to fight the speed at which the other races can rebuild armies.

DT rushing is sometimes legit. It shouldn't outright win you the game, but it is a nice little gimmick that puts you ahead in economy. Especially if your opponent likes to fast expand or turtle up. Yah, it loses to timing push, but hopefully you can scout the timing push and tech switch. /shrug. I've tech rushed to DTs and shuttles and manage to win games with stupid DT warp-in drop lol.

It's fine, mid to late game, but the reactor shouldn't be accessible off the bat or it needs to cost a little more to prevent a player from spamming them on Barracks and busting out huge armies once they're finished. All it takes to obtain Stim is a single tech lab, which is favorable to produce Marauders as well.

Of course there are a few counters for the bioball, but the reactor allows the player to quickly tech switch and field a new army. Attempting to counter the bioball with Collossi? Oh, now there's Vikings to counter your Collossi. Banelings? They've got Hellions to chase and burn them down before they reach a single Marine. It's going to take an insane amount of micro to keep Collossi and Banelings useful in the face of such quickly and easily produced hard/soft counters.

Protoss can't produce units equally or any faster, and, while Zerg pocesses that ability, their units are typically expensive, or inexpensive and woefully inadequate. Zergling can easily range from cost effective to cost ineffective, the former against late-game unit compositions.

Arguably, the bioball is the composition of units that most easily and most quickly reaches a critical mass. Once that point is reached, melee units are useless against them, and ranged units are easily overcome by Stim. Collossi can put a dent in their numbers with a first strike, but they're glass cannons and are also easily overwhelmed by Stim.

[Taskmage]

Re: So... Starcraft 2?

Maybe he was awesome at BW, but some of the stuff he said/did in that video was just dumb. Like setting different rallies for workers - Blizzard fixed the AI so they're much more intelligent about it. You can click once & forget, even the micro-crazy Koreans don't do that.

And really? DT rushing? With just ONE stalker to defend yourself, without walling your ramp? Ok then. SC2 is a different animal from BW. And seriously Dak stop crying over Terran already.

If you watched actual replays instead of just commentaries you'd see that rallying workers individually is extremely common even among NA and EU players.

And really? The same person that was saying a few pages ago how playing Halo Wars and C&C made him more qualified to comment on the state of SC2 than people who had actually played the game thinks that playing BW at a high enough level to get paid for it doesn't carry over at all?

[Ufgt]

Re: So... Starcraft 2?

I think Terran Reactor is necessary for T to keep up with the other races' macro in the mid to late game. Zerg has larva inject and Toss has warpgates. Without reactor, there's no way T can make enough units to fight the speed at which the other races can rebuild armies.

DT rushing is sometimes legit. It shouldn't outright win you the game, but it is a nice little gimmick that puts you ahead in economy. Especially if your opponent likes to fast expand or turtle up. Yah, it loses to timing push, but hopefully you can scout the timing push and tech switch. /shrug. I've tech rushed to DTs and shuttles and manage to win games with stupid DT warp-in drop lol.

[Malacite]

Re: So... Starcraft 2?

Fanboy wtf? How about putting up some credible critique instead of just crying that everything is imba?

I can't beat <insert strategy here> because it's imba, waaaaaaaaaah. That's all I've seen in the last few pages.

[DakAttack]

Re: So... Starcraft 2?

Maybe he was awesome at BW, but some of the stuff he said/did in that video was just dumb. Like setting different rallies for workers - Blizzard fixed the AI so they're much more intelligent about it. You can click once & forget, even the micro-crazy Koreans don't do that.


And really? DT rushing? With just ONE stalker to defend yourself, without walling your ramp? Ok then. SC2 is a different animal from BW. And seriously Dak stop crying over Terran already.

Stop being a fanboy, already. Attempt a critical thought, already. Haters gonna hate, already.

[Malacite]

Re: So... Starcraft 2?

Maybe he was awesome at BW, but some of the stuff he said/did in that video was just dumb. Like setting different rallies for workers - Blizzard fixed the AI so they're much more intelligent about it. You can click once & forget, even the micro-crazy Koreans don't do that.


And really? DT rushing? With just ONE stalker to defend yourself, without walling your ramp? Ok then. SC2 is a different animal from BW. And seriously Dak stop crying over Terran already.

[Aeni]

Re: So... Starcraft 2?

I'm raging at the Terran Reactor, now. That and the Medivac. The Reactor should cost so much more, because it's not just halving the build time or Marines, but it's halving the time it takes to obtain a critical mass of them much earlier in the game. On top of that, it halves the building time for Hellions, Vikings, and Medivacs. If they need to tech switch to AA, it's way too easy for them to field a sizable counter.

Medivacs just shouldn't heal as well as they do.

Is this TvT, Dak? TvT right now is arguably the toughest challenge (for Terran ... *snicker*) Either way, Terran always win this matchup. Always. Sheesh. Talk about OP.

[Ufgt]

Re: So... Starcraft 2?

Day9 was a former BW pro player, so he definitely knows his stuff. I watch his show whenever I get the chance, there's always good information in there.

I don't think Terran is imba at all. Once you learn the matchup, it's defnitely more managable. Early bio timing push is still annoying, but Protoss can definitely fight it. Just have to use your sentries intelligently and you'll get there. Force field + being light armor really helps you fend off early mauraders.

[Taskmage]

Re: So... Starcraft 2?

HuK watches Day[9] and even participates in his silly weekly challenges. He's plugged the show in interviews and says he always learns something from it. Would you say that the #1 Protoss player on the NA server must not be very good then or did the grad student who couldn't afford to fix his glasses for nearly two months pay him off?

Btw, I haven't been tracking the thread. Do you play the game now?