21 OCTOBER 2011 Y people panic

[Murphie]

Re: 21 OCTOBER 2011 Y people panic

Stop making arguments I'm not making, BBQ.

edit: Or at least, stop assuming you know what I'm saying. If YOU want to make an argument you are, of course, free to do so. But it has nothing to do with me.

[Taskmage]

Re: 21 OCTOBER 2011 Y people panic

You said "everyone should believe its fiction." What's left to suggest about how you feel toward people that might believe otherwise? Seems that statement has a LOT to do with what you believe.

We already know what to think of people who think professional wrestling or Santa Claus is real. They're not quite in touch, are they? They're a bit dim, which is a nicer way of saying "stupid."

So if someone does believe the Bible, the Qur'an, in Budda, Jesus, Shinto deities or whatever and you say is fiction - what are they?

This suggests that any two people with a mutually exclusive belief system, thus inherently believing that the other believes a fiction, must think that their pair is stupid. I don't think you want to follow through with that.

Personally, I think if it gives someone strength to get through the day, hardships, let's them be good to others, live peacefully and enjoy life - more power to them. The problem with any system of beliefs - even non-belief - is when you start imposing it on others.

And this flies in the face of what this entire thread is about, which is how dangerous and destructive uncritical belief can be even to oneself.

[Omgwtfbbqkitten]

Re: 21 OCTOBER 2011 Y people panic

What you believe has nothing to do with me. And vice-versa. I simply said it was fiction. That's the beginning and end of what I was trying to say.

You said "everyone should believe its fiction." What's left to suggest about how you feel toward people that might believe otherwise? Seems that statement has a LOT to do with what you believe.

We already know what to think of people who think professional wrestling or Santa Claus is real. They're not quite in touch, are they? They're a bit dim, which is a nicer way of saying "stupid."

So if someone does believe the Bible, the Qur'an, in Budda, Jesus, Shinto deities or whatever and you say is fiction - what are they?

Personally, I think if it gives someone strength to get through the day, hardships, let's them be good to others, live peacefully and enjoy life - more power to them. The problem with any system of beliefs - even non-belief - is when you start imposing it on others.

[Taskmage]

Re: 21 OCTOBER 2011 Y people panic

I forgot about this excellent reason to believe in the coming apocalypse.

Hail To The King, Baby! Duke Nukem Forever Gone Gold! - GotGame

[Neverslip]

Re: 21 OCTOBER 2011 Y people panic

Well said, NightShayde.

[NightShayde]

Re: 21 OCTOBER 2011 Y people panic

There's probably a good deal of it that's "based on a true story."

As with the written mythologies of many religions past and present, I'm sure there are bits of truth both small and large woven in with the storytelling. The written mythology of just about every religion is interesting, usually providing a snapshot of sorts of the society for which it was written at the time it was written.

Stories pretty much have to be embellished upon if you're trying to get your society to behave the way you want them to behave. Controlling the minds of hundreds/thousands/millions of people, especially if you're trying to do it without physical force, requires quite a bit of creativity.

I don't claim to know everything but (and I'm sorry if you didn't mean it to come off this way, Murphie) I take offense to the implication that I'm idiotic for believing that there is some truth in the Bible, and beyond that, that there is a spiritual being. I don't hate on those with differing beliefs than me, but I've found it to be increasingly problematic (especially on the internet) to be a believer in God, as though I hold some severe delusions because I choose to have faith.

You aren't an idiot for believing that there is some truth in the Bible, or for believing that there is a spiritual being. You, however, seem to be able to think independently & don't seem the type of person who will believe anything that a preacher/minister/priest tells you to believe just because he/she says you should believe it. Unfortunately, not everyone possesses critical thinking skills & too many people just accept whatever their religious leaders tell them to accept with no questioning whatsoever (compounded in societies with extremely low literacy rates).

I'm an atheist-leaning agnostic. I doubt strongly that there is a divine being, but I acknowledge that there could really be one (or many). If there IS a divine being, I'm pretty sure it's alternately amused at or horrified by the things people do in its name -- and I highly doubt that ANY religion (or the sacred writings of any religion) bears much of a resemblance to "truth." I would think a divine being would be happy to see people helping each other in times of need -- but either sad or angry about people who kill in its name or limit the rights of groups of people in its name. Of course, maybe it doesn't give a rat's ass what people do and is too busy watching divine being reality shows on a big screen in the sky.

For future reference, can you at least put 'IMO' before stating something like the Bible is a "book of fiction"? While you definitely should have an opinion, I do too and it doesn't match yours. Kthxbai.

I wrote the first thought that came into my head, and prefaced my statement with that. If I write a comment & don't pretend the comment is written by someone else, isn't it fairly clear that my comment actually IS my opinion? Most people don't write "IMO" before each and every statement they write.

[Murphie]

Re: 21 OCTOBER 2011 Y people panic

I don't claim to know everything but (and I'm sorry if you didn't mean it to come off this way, Murphie) I take offense to the implication that I'm idiotic for believing that there is some truth in the Bible, and beyond that, that there is a spiritual being. I don't hate on those with differing beliefs than me, but I've found it to be increasingly problematic (especially on the internet) to be a believer in God, as though I hold some severe delusions because I choose to have faith.

It's not just you. I've encountered it a lot lately, and it's a bit disheartening. I have nothing against people who choose not to believe or who believe differently than I, I don't try to pressure anyone into believing, but I have grown weary of being treated like I'm some deluded idiot for believing that something higher exists.

Again, not sure you meant it this way. I've just noticed this trend these days and it really bugs me. I don't insult people for being atheist or tell them they're going to go straight to hell for it. I don't even believe that, though it's beside the point. I don't understand why people who do not believe feel the need to be so vocally against people who do. Most of us aren't hurting anything by believing. You're free to believe that I'm only hurting myself, but again, doesn't affect you, right?

Sorry. /soapbox

What you believe has nothing to do with me. And vice-versa. I simply said it was fiction. That's the beginning and end of what I was trying to say.

[Mhurron]

Re: 21 OCTOBER 2011 Y people panic

[Samson]

Re: 21 OCTOBER 2011 Y people panic

On the news last night, they showed the retired railroad worker who had spent $140,000 (pretty much his life savings) to put up ads warning of the impeding Rapture in the NYC subways. He was in Times Square, waiting for the glorious event on Saturday at 6pm, and looked utterly confused when the time came and went with nothing happening (other than the mocking at the hands of other people gathered in Times Square). It was clear that he couldn't possibly fathom the idea that Camping could have been wrong.

My immediate thought was, "Hmmm - you spent your life savings because of the rantings of a madman whose rantings were based on some odd interpretation of a book of fiction which was written a couple thousand years ago. How could that POSSIBLY go awry?"

I wonder if the guy had kids who just watched their potential inheritance go up in smoke. Then again, if he does have kids but they're all heathens who think their father is a nutcase, the money probably wouldn't have gone to them anyway.

It makes you want to feel sorry for people like the retired railroad worker, but then you try to figure out how someone could get scammed so easily. It's still sad, though people like that bring it upon themselves. 20 years pass, and people forget. How silly.

For future reference, can you at least put 'IMO' before stating something like the Bible is a "book of fiction"? While you definitely should have an opinion, I do too and it doesn't match yours. Kthxbai.

[Aksannyi]

Re: 21 OCTOBER 2011 Y people panic

I don't claim to know everything but (and I'm sorry if you didn't mean it to come off this way, Murphie) I take offense to the implication that I'm idiotic for believing that there is some truth in the Bible, and beyond that, that there is a spiritual being. I don't hate on those with differing beliefs than me, but I've found it to be increasingly problematic (especially on the internet) to be a believer in God, as though I hold some severe delusions because I choose to have faith.

It's not just you. I've encountered it a lot lately, and it's a bit disheartening. I have nothing against people who choose not to believe or who believe differently than I, I don't try to pressure anyone into believing, but I have grown weary of being treated like I'm some deluded idiot for believing that something higher exists.

Again, not sure you meant it this way. I've just noticed this trend these days and it really bugs me. I don't insult people for being atheist or tell them they're going to go straight to hell for it. I don't even believe that, though it's beside the point. I don't understand why people who do not believe feel the need to be so vocally against people who do. Most of us aren't hurting anything by believing. You're free to believe that I'm only hurting myself, but again, doesn't affect you, right?

Sorry. /soapbox

[Murphie]

Re: 21 OCTOBER 2011 Y people panic

True story.

[Taskmage]

Re: 21 OCTOBER 2011 Y people panic

There's probably a good deal of it that's "based on a true story."

[Murphie]

Re: 21 OCTOBER 2011 Y people panic

Everyone should believe it's fiction. Because it's fiction.

[Aksannyi]

Re: 21 OCTOBER 2011 Y people panic

Not everybody believes the Bible is fiction.

The sane among us believe that a whole fucking heap of it is symbolic, however. And there's also this "Man knows not the day, nor the hour" clause in there somewhere, so maybe they need to study that one better.

Either way, homeboy is nuts. If I weren't so sure he actually believed it, I'd say he was laughing all the way to the bank.

[NightShayde]

Re: 21 OCTOBER 2011 Y people panic

On the news last night, they showed the retired railroad worker who had spent $140,000 (pretty much his life savings) to put up ads warning of the impeding Rapture in the NYC subways. He was in Times Square, waiting for the glorious event on Saturday at 6pm, and looked utterly confused when the time came and went with nothing happening (other than the mocking at the hands of other people gathered in Times Square). It was clear that he couldn't possibly fathom the idea that Camping could have been wrong.

My immediate thought was, "Hmmm - you spent your life savings because of the rantings of a madman whose rantings were based on some odd interpretation of a book of fiction which was written a couple thousand years ago. How could that POSSIBLY go awry?"

I wonder if the guy had kids who just watched their potential inheritance go up in smoke. Then again, if he does have kids but they're all heathens who think their father is a nutcase, the money probably wouldn't have gone to them anyway.