Macros & In-Game

[Elwynn]

Re: Macros & In-Game

I think we need Vegeta in here to tell us how many lines we're allowed per macro button.

"Over 9"?

You did read the part where it says you can enter as many as you want, but only the first 10 are saved?

[Taskmage]

Re: Macros & In-Game

Well with more RAM available this time they damn well better have more basic and even a few complex phrases.

I mean shit, look how long it took to add "You're Welcome" >_>

That's because "you're welcome" isn't something you customarily say in Japanese. The auto-translator phrase is even a little rude. You can't succinctly express the concept in Japanese any more than you could make a direct catch-all translation of yoroshiku. It's slightly surprising they added it at all.

[Kafeen]

Re: Macros & In-Game

That's because "you're welcome" isn't something you customarily say in Japanese. The auto-translator phrase is even a little rude. You can't succinctly express the concept in Japanese any more than you could make a direct catch-all translation of yoroshiku. It's slightly surprising they added it at all.

どういたしまして？

[Taskmage]

Re: Macros & In-Game

どういたしまして？

Yeah, that's the AT for "You're welcome."

[Kafeen]

Re: Macros & In-Game

And what's wrong with that?

[Taskmage]

Re: Macros & In-Game

It's not characteristically Japanese to accept praise and gratitude so easily. It's not exactly arrogant but not quite polite either. The correct response is to deflect or mitigate the statement.

Copypasta from the wiki: In traditional Japanese society, this is not used often, as it falls out of step with their background of humility; to say "You're welcome" is to acknowledge that you did something good for someone, where generally their traditions will make them more prone to borrow our simple "np" or say いえいえ (ieie) to say it was really nothing to worry about.

[Kafeen]

Re: Macros & In-Game

Yeah, thinking about it, I do hear いえいえ　use more by the Japanese people I know. In fact thinking about, I only usually hear どういたしまして used by my English friends speaking to Japanese people. Its never really something I've thought about.

With the auto-translator though you also need to remember that it isn't just English and Japanese that it needs to take into account. There's also French and German that people may want to translate between where those phrases are more likely to be used. Japanese is a hard language to auto-translate into, directly translating is one thing, but getting the correct context, politeness and interpretation of what someone says is another thing.

I can see why SE went for built in phrases and key words rather than a full on translation. Just don't try to build sentences using it and expect it to make sense in another language.

[Malacite]

Re: Macros & In-Game

Silly Japanese - . -

Here we are trying to be polite and we just end up offending them over nonsense.

[Taskmage]

Re: Macros & In-Game

Well, think of it this way. There are times in English where "you're welcome" is slightly rude. Say you're on a commuter train where all the seats are filled and you're sitting by the door. A woman enters who is clearly late in pregnancy and having a hard time getting around, so you rise and let her take your seat. She thanks you. In this case, "you're welcome" isn't really the right thing to say, because really the woman shouldn't have to thank you. You only did what any decent person should have done in that place. So instead of accepting her thanks you say something like "no, don't mention it" or "no problem." In Japanese culture the bar at which it is okay to acknowledge that you've done something worthy of thanks is set a little higher than in English, so a lot of the time we might use "you're welcome" would be like saying it to the lady on the train. Not rude exactly but a little socially insensitive. So Japanese people don't go around saying どういたしまして all the time; they say いえいえ. "Don't mention it."

[Taskmage]

Re: Macros & In-Game

Anyway, the point isn't so much the properness of the word, but that it's not surprising that a Japanese team sitting around a table making a list of sentiments players would want to express to each other on a regular basis didn't come up with "I'm pleased to trouble myself on your behalf." In their culture it's just an awkward concept for which opportunities rarely present themselves. If it had been an English-speaking team designing the AT, I guarantee that not in 1000 years would someone have tossed out "Please treat me as one of your social in-group." I mean how many times in the life of an English-speaker does that need to get expressed? Maybe once for each job at a new company and when asking for the blessing of your fiance's parents? We might even have to make a short speech to get the point across. But in Japan that phrase is as common as hello, and if it had been the other way around they might be bitching about how it took us 4 years to get something as simple as よろしく into the dictionary.

[Malacite]

Re: Macros & In-Game

In this case, "you're welcome" isn't really the right thing to say, because really the woman shouldn't have to thank you. You only did what any decent person should have done in that place.

Bull crap. To me it's far more impolite not to acknowledge them, at least based on my own personal experiences and that's why I call silliness on the JP

[TheGrandMom]

Re: Macros & In-Game

He didn't say that you don't acknowledge the thank you, he said you acknowledge it in a different manner; such as saying "no problem". Saying "You're welcome" in that instance sounds pompous...full of yourself.

[Aksannyi]

Re: Macros & In-Game

Please treat me as one of your social in-group

Humor me please. What phrase is that in auto-translate on the English side?

[Taskmage]

Re: Macros & In-Game

It's not in there. That's just my hack translation of よろしくおããŒã„します (yoroshiku onegai shimasu).

[Aksannyi]

Re: Macros & In-Game

That still doesn't much help me, but I'm guessing it's the non-gaming version of "Please add me to your friend's list?" Or something like that? Lol. Seems like such a weird concept to grasp, if it is something like that, where you have to ask to be accepted.