sub job questions

[myndreach]

okay i love whm, i dont really even want to sub anything...

is it necessary? i know for most jobs it is, but as a whm, won't finding a group always be easy even if don't have a sub?

i want a sub only for mp, int and mnd as i won't really be using the abilities of the other job to PT with.

[cavill]

Go ahead but i dont see what u actually GAIN from NOT having a subjob, wouldnt u prefer to have more MP/HP/stats than no bonus at all?

[Issaac]

And as a blackmage dont forget

bind - sleep (i dunno how often these two safed me
warp - i love this spell, never was traveling easier
escape - safe your group (dont have it right now)

[myndreach]

Originally posted by cavill
Go ahead but i dont see what u actually GAIN from NOT having a subjob, wouldnt u prefer to have more MP/HP/stats than no bonus at all?

yes this is true and that is why i will probably sub...

but...wouldn't i level faster as a WHM if i'm not spending time leveling my sub?

[Issaac]

Not realy.

Im 49 for about 2 weeks now or is it only one week, i lvled like hell, one, two sometimes three lvl a day. Now i have to break and make some money to get my spells equipment etc etc. I want a holy shild (200k) missing spells (70k) changing equipment (100k).

So yes, you will lvl a bit slower but in the end you have to take a lvl break anyway because you need money.and btw, to lvl a black mage with white subbed to lvl 30 is a matter of a weekend if you are lucky with groups.

[Dux]

Yep unfortunatly it is not possible to just level one class non-stop unless you want to be constantly behind in owning spells / up to date armour. (Not an option with WHM)

At some point (for me it was lvls 20 and lvls 27) you simply MUST stop leveling your main job because you have no money at all. So getting a sub job and leveling that killing thing to make some cash is the best idea.

I forsee another stink of leveling my sub job at level 30 and 35 for money / equipment before I start getting into the Missions for the WHM Teleport spells etc.

Quite looking forward to it.

Must work on my BLM subjob soon!

[Claritin]

Sub-jobs

I have leveled all 4 of the sub-jobs WHM usually take

1.) BLM -17 (max is 36/18)
2.) RDM - 20 (max is 36/18)
3.) SMN - 10
4.) BRD - 10

I can tell you for a fact that SMN without avatars is worthless... so after 20/10 you will have a VERY hard time leveling SMN as a subjob.. and since you don't get SMN until lvl 30 you will not be able to consider it a sub-job for quite sometime anyway. At the end game lvls WHM/SMN or SMN/WHM are very powerful due to huge mana pools... but that is a long ways off.. and you will never get SMN to 35 without some decent avatars.. which you need a job at lvl 60 to obtain.

BRD doesn't add to your mana pool... but it doesn't use mana either.... it isn't the greatest of sub jobs.

That leaves you with RDM and BLM... both excellent choices.

RDM :
1.) has better enfeeble skill which is a secondary job of the WHM so you are strengthening something you use.
2.) Will help boost MND stat for better heals
3.) Will add some HP and Parry skill
4.) Adds some Mana.. and minor black magic.
5.) Solo's pretty decent.

BLM :
1.) Has MP Conservation skill... sometimes your spells will take less mana
2.) Has a better boost to your mana than RDM has as sub
3.) Has better nuking power (but you will rarely get to nuke anyway)
4.) Has WARP spell... and this alone is good enough to justify it.

I was very happy with RDM until I started watching people warp. It cuts down travel big time.. svaes you needless deaths on the way back to town... and helps you make money by teleporting people from a city to a crag and then warping back to grab more passengers.

Warping will help you tremendously when questing.

So I'd say WHM/BLM unless maybe you are a Taru... then consider WHM/RDM to help boost your HP a little.... but warp is just so damn handy I think even a taru wouldn't want to pass that up.

Like I said it's when you hit 36/18 when you have teleports and WARP as WHM/BLM that you regret going down the road of WHM/RDM.

I'd steer away from any melee jobs... I saw a Tarutaru WHM/THF once but although her evasion was handy and the sneak attacks were funny as hell... it just wasn't what the group wanted.

[Claritin]

Well...

Well I just double checked.. you are a taru.

So there is one other option.. the road less traveled.

WHM/PLD.

This would give a little mana.. but a bit of HP and lots of DEF...

This is not a great or desired choice... but I have met someone who is a Taru WHM/PLD and he likes it. (/wave to Huggles on Bismarck) it is not the worst choice you can make.

With WHM/PLD you normally have to lvl a WAR to 18 also because to group you need PLD/WAR or you won't have provoke which is mandatory as a tank.

Your goals would be :
75 WHM (75 WHM/36 PLD)
37 PLD (37 PLD/18 WAR)
18 WAR (18 WAR/9 MNK)
9 MNK (9 MNK/WAR)

It would work... but it's alot of extra leveling... no major benefits in the right areas (you shouldn't tank anyways so you don't need +20% DEF at lvl 60/30) you would be better off WHM/BLK or WHM/RDM in most people's eyes... including my own.

[Sabastion]

^^ I'm confused why you would need to lvl war and mnk to get Pld?! Couldnt you just go whm right to 30 or whm/whatever to 30 then just lvl pld and whm? Why do you have to lvl the other classes?

[Anya]

Because it's unpossible to level PLD past 10 without war sub.

I believe he's suggesting mnk for sub for war.

Although, I might suggest doing THF to 15 for war sub instead. It's not as nice for War, but you'll want 15THF for farming later anyhow, might as well get it out of the way when you can use it.

[meeyutu]

What I have/am doing is this:

Leveled WHM to 18
Leveled BLM to 17 (to get warp and use as a sub til WHM34)

Leveled WHM to 30

Got Summoner Job and leveled it a little bit solo just for fun

Leveled WHM to 36 (now I have Teleport so I don't really need Warp that I get from the BLM sub)

Leveling Summoner to 25 so I get auto MP regen and MP boosts. Summoner can make a decent healer (I'm SMN19 now in Valk and have mainly been the primary healer for my parties) and really non of the avatars are useful until level 25.

Once I have Summoner to level 25 I am going to level my Whitemage until 50 then get all of the Avatars and go back to leveling my SMN.


Now if you want to stay WHM I would suggest leveling your Summoner to 37 then continue leveling your WHM toward 75. The Summon abilities like Blinkga,etc can definately help your party out and the MP and MND boosts you get with a summoner sub are just unreal.

[meeyutu]

Oh and on another note you asked about being able to level faster without a sub? Firstly leveling fast as a WHM isn't an option. You need to do quests so you can get enough fame for high level quest items (teleport scrolls) and money to by scrolls that aren't available in quests. Also having a sub makes your character better/stronger. In the NA Beta I was a Monk and I decided not to level a sub until I hit 30 when I was doing my advanced job. It made my character weak in comparision to others since when you hit level 20 everyone has a subjob. Trust me this isn't a road you want to go down because nothing sucks worse than being replaced in a party because there is someone better looking for a party. I've had it done to me and I've had to do it to others :/

[Calianeri]

Leveled WHM to 36 (now I have Teleport so I don't really need Warp that I get from the BLM sub)

Nah... need both! WHM38/BLM17 and up has the best single-person transport abilities in the game. With teleport alone, you only have half of your round-trip. Incredibly useful together -- save time, save money, help your friends out, do teleports for gil if you see shouts in Jeuno, etc.

At WHM40, you are doing yourself a disservice by not having BLM20 sub for Conserve MP. It helps more than having a higher max MP of /SMN, especially because you will rarely find yourself at full MP in good leveling parties.

There's no good reason to sub SMN until you are level 50+ and have the avatars. With the exception of Elvaan and Galka WHMs, who may decide they need the MP. You are giving up too many useful spells and abilities in return for just 30-40 MP and Carbuncle.

[meeyutu]

I can always sub BLM for taxiing in Jueno and the MP boost is far more than 30-40 MP. I will post a comparision with BLM vs SMN sub later tonight.

Also there is the cost of leveling a BLM to 25 v.s. SMN - with SMN you only need to buy level 20 equip and no spells

[Jei]

Originally posted by myndreach


yes this is true and that is why i will probably sub...

but...wouldn't i level faster as a WHM if i'm not spending time leveling my sub?

No, you won't. I tried to level Whm to 25 without sub before and at level 22, I was stuck in jeuno for 4 days without any PT invitation. Simply because I was "not" the only Whm, there are tons of them competing me to get into groups. And most of them have high ranks with fully levelled sub jobs.

As for subbing Smn, I'd say as Whm your main job alone can attract PT leaders to invite you already. So why not sub /blm for the most convenient spell in the game: Warp? ; /

Teleport teleports you and your party to the crags far, far away from town.
Warp warps you back to your homepoint, which is in the town normally.

Having more MP and more spells also help boost up your entire group. More MP means more spells to be casted and a longer chain the party can do, /15Blm you get elemental seal which will help your spell become very hard to resist, you can land silence or any debuff very easily in case of emergancy.