How do you keep your tanks healed after battle?

[Vaiyo]

I am having so much trouble keeping tanks healed, it's getting ridiculous.

I recently hit 33, and by this time melees have 600+ (and tanks, 700+) hp. If I'm the only healing mage in the party, downtimes are horrendous since I only have 278mp (yea, I gotta start getting mp items); if there's a second healing mage, downtimes are still kinda horrible.

I guess it'd be a lot better if I had a bard in the party with paeon I & II, but most of the time I don't get the privilege of having a bard in the group. Rdms at this point can help probably just as much as I can help myself ... but only with regen or whatever. But the way mobs hit our tanks by this time, I can't cast curaga more than once without having to med up again (not to mention curaga II ... which only heals 180hp max anyway unless I use DS). I can use regen then sit back down, but then tanks voice their discontent because they have to wait for it to heal them up ... only 150hp gain anyway.

I noticed this horrible downtime when I grouped in Garlaige the other day; me a 33whm/rdm, two 35blm/whms, 34mnk/war 36sam/war and 33thf/nin - after every fight I'd just be about out of MP and the blms have 150mp+ (but won't heal, go figure); blms are whining that I don't heal fast enough and tanks are whining because I'm out of MP by the end of the fight and can't heal them up so they can chain pull.

So I'm wondering what everyone else is doing by level 33 to keep tanks healed.

[Issaac]

This will get a lot better when you get Regen which is a very fine spell and even more better when you get a redmage with refresh on your side. With a redmage who is watching that my refresh is always up im mosty full mana after fights. The Mana-refresh rate is incredible.


But with 2 white mages- one resting - one healing, you should be able to chain over and over again.

[Deedlit]

Are you only using curaga? Its pretty inefficient if you only need to cure 2 people at the most. I use Cure 2 and 3, with regen of course, on the main tank, and just keep regen up on the others (if they are getting hit with AoE's or whatnot, and not in danger of dying). I have no problem chaining 2-3 mos at least this way, and with another WHM (or RDM/WHM) chains can be endless.

Also, are you debuffing mobs? This helps, as the monsters die quicker, therefore they deal out less damage to your party.

Edit: She's 33, should have regen by now for a while, no?

[Vaiyo]

I guess I didn't explain my situation well enough. Sorry! ^^

I was in Garlaige Citadel fighting bats and beetles. The way the party was made up was me a 33whm/16rdm, two 35blm/whms, 34mnk/war 36sam/war and 33thf/nin. The two taru BLMs refused to back up heal for the most part, the samurai was tanking and other than myself, nobody seemed to care about controlling aggro so throughout the fight, someone other than the samurai would aggro and I'd end up with a yellow/red party by the end of every fight. Throughout the fight, I'd spam cures and occasional cure II if needed and regen was kept on the samurai at all times; the blms only cured themselves (hmmm, overnuke then Cure II themselves right afterwards ...) or helped out on healing only if they think that I'm letting the tanks die.

By the end of every fight I'd be close to out of MP, pretty much. So I would cast regen on whoever I can, sit, get up and curaga, sit back down ... but since most melees have 600+ hp by now, curaga wasn't really cutting it. Sometimes I'd DS+curaga II, but that's possible only after every other fight.

Basically I had no help healing. The blms would sit there and heal up their MP to full, then wait and wait (even though both had whm subbed) until I manage to 1) heal the samurai back to full and 2) everyone else at least up to 75% or so (so they can live after aggro'ing).

I'm just wondering if it's possible for me to have been more efficient. I tried the regen/sit approach during downtimes, but since regen takes a long(er) time to cast and even longer to recast, I felt it was inefficient; curaga/curaga II wasn't really working out well either, since I only have 278mp. In about 5hrs in Garlaige, I only got 3k exp.

Anyways, hope that helps someone figure out what was wrong with what I was doing. ^^

[Deedlit]

From what you said here, the only thing you need is a much better party =P

I don't think there was much else you could do in the case of this particular party, except maybe start ordering people around. Mention that you plan on leaving, and then see how willing they are to listen to the WHM - sometimes you need to get firm with people, especially when they don't want to contribute.

[Mithrael]

Pick up a BRD for your party. Ballad and paeon will really decrease downtime. But, as they mention, Regen does a lot of healing, and costs very little. Your BLM/WHM party mates should be helping by dropping a cure or cure II at the end of the battle to decrease downtime. They shouldn't be nuking immediately at the beginning of the battle anyway, so they have one or two ticks of extra healing time you can't afford.

Your tanks can go find a mob to pull long before the party is done healing. Usually, our puller waits for a cure2, paeon, and regen and starts looking, even if his hp are in the orange. By the time he finds something and waits for your optimum mp level, he'll be back up to the green. Most pullers will start pulling when you are at 60-75% mp, depending on what you are fighting, and how much mp you have left on average at the end of the battle.

But, most importantly, if you find yourself full-healing after every battle, you are probably fighting the wrong kind of monsters for your level and party configuration. An example may be that a mid-30's group can easy fight crawlers with only a white mage and a red mage... but forget about beetles. They take so long to kill without black mages that you're drained after the fight. Getting 150-exp per battle instead of 160 becomes very acceptable when you can chain 3 or 4 its in a row. Unless you hit a streak of bad luck (like a crawler who does cacoon 7-8 times in a battle or a beetle who does power attack 3 times to the same person) you should never be getting less that exp chain #2. If that starts to happen regularly, question if your party strengths exploit the monster's weaknesses. If not, try to regroup your party so they do, or find new prey.

One giant weakness in your mentioned party config is the lack of an acceptable tank. Your samurai is your best bet, but pretty much anything is going to cut through him like butter, since he undoubtedly has Attack+ and Accuracy+ equipment instead of defense equipment. Don't even think about making your monk tank after lv.30. Even with a warrior sub, there is no armor that is appropriate for a mnk to be taking the majority of the hits. If your mnk is tanking, it is no surprise at all that you are drained at the end of the battle.

Finally, not that you want to hear this... but a taru can easily pull off WHM/RDM because they have copious MP. A hume would be better suited to sub /BLM or /SMN. If you really want to sub RDM, you need to invest in some Convert HP to MP rings or just plain MP+ jewelry. 278mp isn't a terrible weakness though, i know plenty of Elvaan WHM who get by just fine with less mp. This is simply my opinion; it and $1.50 will get you a cup of coffee at Starbucks.

[VB-Shiva]

I had almost the exact same PT setup in Garlaige.

I can think of a couple of points of PT efficiency. First use more mana efficient spells. Use Regens after a fight instead of cures for example. Why are you using Curagas, there are no AE attack mobs in this place. Are you taking full advantage of Divine Seal?

The 2nd pt is spreading mana evenly after a fight. I believe the fault here lies with the BLMs, they're not spending their mana to patch up the tanks after fight. Sometimes, they're not aware of this problem, and they just need a gentle reminder. The BLMs that we had were clueless, but very cooperative, so after fights, I look at who has most mana and bark out orders "BLM2 heal us up". No one complained about the "bitchy WHM" when exp was flowing in like water...

Garlaige is a great place to level, much better than the noob packed crawler's nest.

[Issaac]

With a party like this i would just refuse to heal at end of fight :p

Or cast banish until im oom

[mlwolfinger]

Yeah, I understand your frustrations. I play an Elvaan WHM and, even though I'm only level 27 I sometimes have the same problems due to my small MP pool. What I've found is that if you work out a strategy with your melee people regarding "hate" then you can be more conservative.

If you find that someone is getting hit alot and losing a ton of HP's way too fast (basically a sinkhole for your MP with all the cures you have to cast) then ask the frontliners what their defense score is. Take the characters with the two highest scores and have them share tanking duties. When the fight starts cast regen on both of them. Have them use provoke alternately to constantly switch the monster's attention back and forth. While the monster is attacking one your regen spell is giving 20-30 HP back to the other and vice-versa. Over the course of a battle that really adds up.

Of course, if you have a solid tank with up to date equipment and he's keeping aggro 95% of the time then you should have no trouble with MP either and shouldn't have to resort to this strategy. The problem I find is tank type jobs that keep plenty of aggro but are under-equiped for their level armor-wise and are MP sinkholes for WHM's. Make sure the character with the highest defense in your party is doing the tanking!!

I partied with a WAR a few nights ago who was using a one-handed sword and no shield!! He was trying to tank and I was burning up my MP trying to keep him alive. That was when I decided to ask about everyone's defense scores and we got the other WAR to tank... what a difference! The first WAR stopped provoking (except emergencies) and the other WAR took all the aggro and the party really took off!

Oh, and if they're complaining about you casting regen and resting at the end of the battle then tell them to stop complaining about waiting for you to regain MP at the end of the battle because they can't have it both ways. That should shut them up. Besides, by the time the puller comes back with another monster regen will have done it's job in most cases.

[Mantronic]

i would just like to point out to you something with your cure and cure II maxxed out it is more efficent to cast cureII instead of cures.

8 mp cure = 30 hp recovered
8 mp cure = 30 hp recovered
8 mp cure = 30 hp recovered
total of 24 mp 90 hp recovered

24 mp cure II = 90 hp recovered so it is way more efficent to cast cure II you have to cast less and it gives you a chance to cureII regen (nontank) cure II regen (nontank) i would of never casted a cure on anyone other than the samuria, thf should be doing trick attack meaning he gets hit only when he pulls, mnk would get hit every once and a while but nothing serious regen keep healing the sam/war at these lvls you make your life so much easier by casting the most efficent spell. another example sam/war getting low divine seal cureIII him does well over 380 recovery then you have more than enough time before you gotta cast another spell. dont be scared to use benediciton but be ready to take hits by having stoneskin and blink casted on you try doing this towards the end of a fight if your mp is low benediction and get ready to fight dont run around like a something is wrong.


lvl 38 whm/blm taru at lvl 33 i had 400 mp but i never had more than 180 when the fights began i would rest 1i click into the fight and keep going we were getting exp chains 6 before i we would rest up to full mp hp.



oh one last thing roasted mushrooms are your friends lvl 11 cooking if you dont want to buy them out right

it gives you 20mp +3mnd +2 mp regen its about 3k perstack in my server.

[Calianeri]

I agree with what others have said about your party formation being the primary culprit. Sometimes it doesn't matter how much MP you have, your party still won't work well. I'm a taru WHM/BLM, so I've got lots of MP (around 560 now at level 43). A few levels ago I joined a party in Gustav Tunnel, which can be a fantastic place to level with good xp chains. But the party had a hume MNK who always took aggro, and sometimes soaked up half my MPs in a fight. We were reduced to chain 2s most of the time. You can't beat a PLD or WAR tanking.

The highest level and level difference of your party are also important... that 36 SAM may have been your tank, but he probably wrecking the XP for everyone. And BLMs who won't (or don't know they should) cure the party if the WHM needs to rest are just wasting everyone's time. A BLM dropping a Curaga after a battle is a great way to reduce downtime with minimal impact on the party's MP situation. They may just need a couple nice reminders. Also, hope you don't get a BLM/SMN, BLM/NIN, etc.

[Miriamel]

I agree with what was said. The thing that sucks up most MP is not having a proper tank (WARs and PLDs come to mind). Low defense will suck up a majority of your MP. When I join a party, I usually will insist on having a proper tank or a second healer. Don't worry too much about it, it sounded like you were doing a good job.

Also, Garlaige at levels 31-33 is awfully hard. It'll get easier once you have a PT that averages level 33-34.

Oh and...

Originally posted by Mithrael
Finally, not that you want to hear this... but a taru can easily pull off WHM/RDM because they have copious MP. A hume would be better suited to sub /BLM or /SMN. If you really want to sub RDM, you need to invest in some Convert HP to MP rings or just plain MP+ jewelry. 278mp isn't a terrible weakness though, i know plenty of Elvaan WHM who get by just fine with less mp.

I agree. I have 283 MP at lv32 with MP+ equipment and I usually get by just fine.

[Taurius]

There's nothing worse than ppl who don't want to make a PT efficient. A SAM isn't the best tank for one thing, and I'm sure he/she didn't have the best equipment for tanking. Those 2 BLM weren't being effective nukers and back up healers. I love having 2 BLM. One would be the primary Nuker, and the other one would nuke/heal and MB at a slower pace. They would trade off after each fight since the secondary nuker will have more MP for the next chain, and the other BLM can rest till he/she has enough MP to nuke/heal while others are fighting.

[PetriW]

I noticed this horrible downtime when I grouped in Garlaige the other day; me a 33whm/rdm, two 35blm/whms, 34mnk/war 36sam/war and 33thf/nin - after every fight I'd just be about out of MP and the blms have 150mp+ (but won't heal, go figure); blms are whining that I don't heal fast enough and tanks are whining because I'm out of MP by the end of the fight and can't heal them up so they can chain pull.

I got stuck on the party configuration, a sam/war can tank somwhat sure... but a war/mnk or a pld/war will tank A LOT better. This is especially noticeable starting in garliage then onward, while they can tank they are enormous MP sinks, without a decent tank you'll get the downtime.
Notice, equipment matters too, for example a warrior with 34 semidecent armor wielding a 2h sword will take so much dmg you won't be able to keep him alive unless you are a taru with juice. This from personal experience. Oh and that PT was like "ooh you need to heal better", yeah right, grats me new PT with a real tank and voila problem gone.

Now that you are in Garliage even one person performing bad hurts the party noticeably. Hopefully people will learn but if you go to threadmill areas expect to keep meeting them.


Personal hints:
Do debuffs on inc, they help a lot, even if they cost mp. Paralyze, slow and blind are your best friends. If tanks are taking a lot of damage do Bio instead of Dia (they don't stack).
If people complain about you using regen to heal so you can meditate, ignore it, remember not to PT with them again.
Only use spells such as Curaga if there's a net mp gain by doing so, don't do it cause you feel it's faster to cure two at once.
Get away from Garliage ASAP, this is where the sucky people get stuck and learn (or quit, or tough it out), if you can play good move on to Crawlers or (shock!) make a PT of your own and go to Altepa.

[zaldane]

if you were not having fun and having to heal left and right and not 90% on main puller i would have left the group, not worth the stress. bats are bad news anyway