Tanking...

[BrotherRaven]

Remember the rules that apply to spell interruption also apply to ninjitsu:

The first 15% and the last15% of time casting a spell is uninterrutable.

I have gotten lots of practice casting CureIVs so I have had no problem pulling off the Ichi as a NIN tank.

The key is to develop a rhythm and start your Ichi right BEFORE the creature attacks so that its first attack hits you in the first 15% and the next attack hits you in the last 15%. Of course this isn't possible on fast attacking creatures like mandragoras.

Also, is there no other person in your party with main or sub war? When your provoke is ready, have them provoke, do Ichi, then provoke it back.

I really disagree with NOT provoking every 30 seconds. I really dont see this "hate spike" that some people feel. I feel it is more of a 2 teammates being very close to each other in terms of hate and having the provoke or other action tip the balances back and forth.

Also, what kind of weapon are you using? Almost all WAR/NIN tanks go dual swords &/or axes. Every time you attack you apply your emnity, so dual wielding is the best way.

[Viktoria]

Yes Carbon, you're right. I really wish people would stop spreading this "Utsusemi is nerfed when used on a sub" myth. I've seen it lots of places recently - thief boards, ranger boards, warriors boards, even the ninja boards. IT IS NOT TRUE. Normally when someone points this out to the original poster of the myth, they respond with "Oh, well, I didn't know for sure, someone said it was like that. I've never actually tested it myself." This is how rumors get started.

Karinya, Utsusemi cancels as many hits on main as it does sub.

[Meimei]

I dont see you have the problem if you have the most update gear, food, and provoke every 30 secs. I'm Mit and i usually dont have problem on holding hate and taking dmg. The only reason why u feel such pain is because the mages are IDIOTS. Most NA mages just dont hold the nukes or just throw the biggest heal or throw all debuffs at once because they except you to keep the hate for them which is absolutely WRONG. When you tell them please do not create too much hate so you can hold the hate, they are like why should i listen to you, u are the tank, you should hold the hate, if you can not do it that means you suck. This is what i see from most NA mages. Last time i was PT with JPN players in kuftal hunting tigers, i do not have problem holding the hate and taking dmg and i was using samurai sub, "No defensive ability such as counter attack or ninja blink except 1 mins refresh 3rd eye", also i do not even have a thf to sneak + trick for me.
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Warrior 70
Thief 36
Ninja 35
Samurai 35
Monk 15
http://ffxi.allakhazam.com/profile.xml?17309
http://ffxi.allakhazam.com/profile.xml?17313

[Xien]

Originally posted by Viktoria
Yes Carbon, you're right. I really wish people would stop spreading this "Utsusemi is nerfed when used on a sub" myth. I've seen it lots of places recently - thief boards, ranger boards, warriors boards, even the ninja boards. IT IS NOT TRUE. Normally when someone points this out to the original poster of the myth, they respond with "Oh, well, I didn't know for sure, someone said it was like that. I've never actually tested it myself." This is how rumors get started.

Karinya, Utsusemi cancels as many hits on main as it does sub.

They probably meant Blink tanking with just Ichi is gimped. Our Ichi doesn't "last as long" as theirs because we can't dodge or parry like they do. And face it, how much of your gear is geared towards evasion? When we tank, Def+vit > evasion+accuracy. When they tank evasion+accuracy > def+vit.

I've tanked in the 40's with NIN subbed and damn, dodge didn't kick in a whole lot. It was almost certain after 3 hits, bye bye blink. But today I pted with a NIN/war, and damn, did she dodge :D

Dodge dodge parry hit hit hit Utsu:Ni

Xien

[halimj]

But seriously I would say sub /mnk till you 74 (the extra vit is really nice) then change to sub /nin... I myself is a 45 warrior and I was asked to tank most of the time and I have no problem hold hate with war cry, boost, provoke. If you have a thf in pt that will be great for the extra hate with SATA.

The only time when I have problem is when my mages especially black mages, they tend to nuke most of the time. USually if that's the case, I would just let them die (j/k). I mean if this is the case just tell them not to nuke too many times... tell them to help heal in interval. With white mages just tell them to spam a lower cure spell in between a big one. this way you can heal better.

Just my 2 cents

[specular]

Originally posted by BrotherRaven
Remember the rules that apply to spell interruption also apply to ninjitsu:

The first 15% and the last15% of time casting a spell is uninterrutable.

I have gotten lots of practice casting CureIVs so I have had no problem pulling off the Ichi as a NIN tank.

I was about to post the same, but as you stated, some mobs will get you every time in that last stretch. I'm training my NIN at the moment and I've found crabs to be extremely annoying in this department.

Beetles & Spiders are easy for me. The weird thing is that stuff like Sickle Slash will not interrupt your cast, so a regular hit followed by a Slash, will let you cast succesfully if timed as stated above (if you didn't die ).

[sudo]

wow I'm glad to see a taru war/mnk in the 50s. I always wanted to go this route and now I feel semi inspired.

As to the whole hate spike theory. I don't believe a word of it. Nice theory btw but if you ever get any time off to play bst or smn, you would have appreciation of hate down to specific numbers. (go try it! it's a lot of fun ^^)

The only reason people see hate "go down over time" is because they are being hit and not doing enough damage and or other actions to maintain that hate. Others can pull it off you with high damage things too of course. Go try brd, play enough songs w/o doing any damage and you'll get the hate. Even if it's all just status buffs and no requiem or damage over time or even swinging at things.

By the way, just taking a swing at something has hate. Even if you miss, you still get a small amount of hate. (pet attack, pet misses, I attack, I miss, mob turns to me) Weapon might have effect here too.

So go and provoke every 30 sec, boost every 15, spam dodge, use warcry, hit defender, then go "Turn it off" by hitting the + key twice and selecting the icon and hit enter. Use bezerk liberally, then go and turn it off. You are using abilities for hate, not actually as much for effect in these cases.

Also, eating food is hate. Ever get a chance to throw on a mithrakabob in the middle of a fight? there's some hate with that too but can't turn off food though >_<.

Only Provoking when you loose agro is not effective at all. The mages take a hit and you recover, sure... but there's that downward spiral. Mages heal themselves even if they aren't tanking (who wants to be in yellow or red anyway?) they get a lot of hate for curing themselves (almost always see cure 3)

Then by the time they get back to spamming cure on you, you'll be in the yellow or red and they'd have to use another cure 3 or 4 on you. causing you to loose agro and have to wait to use provoke again while mages get beat on some more... vicious circle.

Again, there is no reason for not using provoke every 30 seconds.

Only ppl I excuse from this are ninja or /nin as they are usually in throw delay or busy casting blink (which generates hate) or casting another debuff ninjitsu (gives hate too, more if it lands and does some damage but hate even if resisted) In which case they'd better provoke by 38 seconds if not by 30 :sweat:

[Viktoria]

Originally posted by Xien


They probably meant Blink tanking with just Ichi is gimped. Our Ichi doesn't "last as long" as theirs because we can't dodge or parry like they do.
...
Xien

I wish Xien, but she specifically said "It cancels fewer hits", which is just plain wrong. Anyway, I'm planning on bringing up my warrior into the 30's to be ready to use as a sub for other jobs. I'm strongly considering subbing ninja after 20. Sure, the Utsusemi won't be easy to keep up, but it can stop 6 hits, which is better than nothing. My main motivation is to use dual-wield for some 1-handed axes, though. It's just something I haven't seen a lot of for warrior mains and looks like it'd be fun.