Elemental Syphon

[MrMageo]

Re: Elemental Syphon

I beleive SMN/SCH gets all -na spells except stona, does not get erase, nor curaga

However Carby has a cruaga, and garuda has whispering wind so, Id say yes it is quite possible to main heal.

[Omniblast]

Re: Elemental Syphon

So I haven't been paying attention...someone break it down for me. SMN/SCH is very workable now, it seems? But not for main-healing?

For me, with YY Robe, Sanction or Sigil, and Auto Refresh, if I had SCH leveled up to use Sublimation, I could technically get 7 mp per tick, which is about 3 ticks better than without.

Every 5 minutes you can get 450 mp. It really negates a lot of the negative effects that you get without subbing it. Regen II works pretty good in place of Cure III if your using that to recover your lost HP from Sublimation. Stone Skin works good too, however you can only get that from Earthen Ward and not from SCH sub.

[Truece]

Re: Elemental Syphon

Regen II works pretty good in place of Cure III if your using that to recover your lost HP from Sublimation.

Just to point it out, Sublimation causes 2HP loss per tick. Regen I is more than sufficient to offset the HP loss, thus even greater returns on Sublimation

[Sabaron]

Re: Elemental Syphon

So I haven't been paying attention...someone break it down for me. SMN/SCH is very workable now, it seems? But not for main-healing?

I beleive SMN/SCH gets all -na spells except stona, does not get erase, nor curaga

SMN/SCH is perfectly viable for main healing with the new Addendum Stratagem. It is only lacking Reraise and Erase. I would like to point out that while SMN does not have Stona proper, that Leviathan's Spring Water will remove Petrification and Garuda's Hastega can remove weaker Slow effects. You can take a chance on Spring Water removing the stronger ones (like Spider Web).

In fact, because of Spring Water and Hastega, SMN/SCH is actually preferable to WHM in some camps b/c WHM can only use Divine Veil every 10 minutes. Spring Water can be used once per minute or less and is also a Curaga effect. I'm envisioning as a very good example, the Caedarva Imp Camps. Spring Water can mass-remove Silence once/minute and if the SMN needs to fix more than that (which is occasionally necessary), Silena will suffice.

FYI: Summoner's Curagas:

Carbuncle's Healing Ruby II: 28+Level*4 = 328HP (@75) for 124MP [2.64hp/mp]
Leviathan's Spring Water: 47+Level*3 = 272HP (@75) for 99MP [2.74hp/mp] AND Status cures
Garuda's Whispering Wind: 16+Level*2.5 = 171HP (@75) for 119MP [1.44hp/mp]

So SMN gets Curaga II equivalent once a minute which is more than adequate.

[Karinya]

Re: Elemental Syphon

Why does whispering wind cost MORE than spring water and almost as much as HR2? That makes no sense.

Lower its cost to about 65-70 MP and maybe it would see some use... I guess that means it can go on the list of "good concept, bad cost effectiveness" with frost and lightning armors and crimson howl. (Did rolling thunder escape that list recently?)

[MrMageo]

Re: Elemental Syphon

Yes im still curious to know if rolling thunder is affected by this new update to enspells or is it just enspells themselves. (/sch for the Enhancing boost of course).

[Pai Pai Master]

Re: Elemental Syphon

Sweet. I'm gonna level SCH right away then. Thanks.

[Sabaron]

Re: Elemental Syphon

I have to fix an error I made earlier...

In fact, because of Spring Water and Hastega, SMN/SCH is actually preferable to WHM in some camps b/c WHM can only use Divine Veil every 10 minutes. Spring Water can be used once per minute or less and is also a Curaga effect. I'm envisioning as a very good example, the Caedarva Imp Camps. Spring Water can mass-remove Silence once/minute and if the SMN needs to fix more than that (which is occasionally necessary), Silena will suffice.

Spring Water costs 99MP...

Silena costs 24MP

Therefore, in order for Spring Water to be MP efficient as a mass-cure, you need to have at least 4 people that need to have debuffs removed or a few that need some curing. Since this is usually the case anyway with AoE debuff camps, it shouldn't be an issue but I just wanted to mention it. The efficiency rate also varies depending on which effect you're trying to remove.

Another wonderful thing about SMN is the "He did it." enmity control they have... I didn't just cure 4 people for 380HP, Leviathan did... go kill him... This makes it easier for SMNs to toss around giant -ga cures than other mages.

[Kitalrez]

Re: Elemental Syphon

You're making the assumption that you can find a summoner high enough to do imps who wants to main heal, and a second assumption that this particular summoner hasn't already grabbed 3 of his buddies to steal your imps out from under you. Heck, if you find 5 other SMNs you can kill soulflayers without really breaking a sweat... exp could be better, but the loot is great.

[Gobo]

Re: Elemental Syphon

Not personal testing, but apparently Rolling Thunder is decent now, with hits procing at ~12 damage a swing. Dunno if skill effects damage or if its based off of Ramuh's hidden stats.

[Malacite]

Re: Elemental Syphon

Why does whispering wind cost MORE than spring water and almost as much as HR2? That makes no sense.

And you people question me when I say SMN is broken >_>

[Sabaron]

Re: Elemental Syphon

Why does whispering wind cost MORE than spring water and almost as much as HR2? That makes no sense.

It does make sense if you think about it from the right perspective. Everyone knows that Garuda is the favorite tank pet. Whispering Wind allows Garuda to heal herself, thus extending her tanking ability. She also has mitigation capabilities through Aerial Armor. In this way, Whispering Wind is more of a perk than her discipline and therefore less efficient than her comrades.

[Kitalrez]

Re: Elemental Syphon

To go off of Sabaron here, the healing is scalable in terms of what you use the avatar for. Garuda is to put it simply a damage avatar. She has buffs, but they're limited to Hastega and Aerial Armor. She has no debuffs at all, though silence would probably have been a good fit for her.

Looking at Leviathan, he hits softer than Garuda, and his BPs will do less damage. The upside is that he hits way more often. He also has some good debuffs. He's the only avatar with Gravity and his Slowga is nice, too. He's more of a support avatar. You won't be using Spring Water much to keep him in the game, as you would with Garuda's Whispering Wind. He won't be tanking nearly as much, or doing much outside of building TP for a nice Tail Whip and Slowga combo. You won't really chain Spinning Dive much unless you're going after something that's hard to hit in the first place, like Jormungand.

Now, think instead on Garuda: Pred Claws > Whispering Wind > Pred Claws > Whispering Wind... The best use of Garuda is to DD and keep herself healed up as tanker. If Whispering Wind was cheap enough you could conceivably do this strategy over a length of any time, people would be screaming bloody murder about needing to nerf SMN. Garuda has been balanced so that the costs are just prohibitive enough you won't try using her as a pocket DMG PLD.

[Eiyoko]

Re: Elemental Syphon

Another thing to keep in mind about Blood Pact buffs is that most all of them are AoE, hence the high cost.