RDM/BRD...any good?

[Laynton]

A couple of my ls mates where low-man pting and one of them was rdm/brd and at first i was like wtf?!?!?! I didn't ask him about it and just waved it off and didn't really think about it again until I was reading/posting on the beautiful MND thread.

Anyways is rdm/brd any good in pt situation? Like more meriting can my 1 song song stack with the 2 songs the other brd puts up? if so is it worth losing everything /whm offers?

The one place I can really see this working is burn parties. 5 blm and rdm/brd to add refresh plus ballad! I dont know why this wouldnt work out great or am I missing something?

Please note that my brd is lvl 5, so little knowledge on how brd works/plays, and dont have any plans on lvling it unless this actually proves to be a great benefit.

[TheGrandMom]

Re: RDM/BRD...any good?

I've done rdm/brd but only in parties that had another /whm or whm. Its a busy little subjob, as if you aren't busy enough on rdm. As for a burn pt, that is one of the setups I did it in. It worked well. Of course, one of the blms had to come /whm though and we know how those blms love to sub whm! lol (I'll assume /sch would work too but at the time sch was either not out yet or still quite new.)

[cidbahamut]

Re: RDM/BRD...any good?

I thought songs had really watered down potency when subbed...or maybe I'm thinking of Corsair rolls. I'd think it'd be a niche sub at best. The headache of herding cats along with doing everything else in the party aside from killing the mob would certainly drive me insane.

[Laynton]

Re: RDM/BRD...any good?

Ya the watering down of the song was one thing I was wondering as well. Ya trying to herd headless chickens in merit pts would be a pain in the ass I agree. I was more wondering about the watering down of songs if I /brd and if they stack with another brd's songs?

I'm more intersted in its application in blm or smn burn parties. You wouldnt have a problem with the herding issue as everyone stands in one spot the whole time, specially in xarcabard S. If you have everyone being on top of things and nuking properly you wont need much healing so the lose of mp might not be that big of an issue since you'll have a 5tick refresh. (refresh, sig w/ refresh, song)

[TheGrandMom]

Re: RDM/BRD...any good?

With /brd you really don't use many songs. Ballad is the main one. If you are pulling and get a link, you have sleep spells so Lullaby isn't necessary and often doesn't work either. If you are in a mage burn pt, then Minuet/Madrigal isn't necessary and Minuet is the only one you should worry about in a melee burn (they should be decently equipped for acc so Madrigal shouldn't be necessary). With a burn you also do not want to use Requiem in case you need to sleep and besides that it doesn't often stick and Dia is a better option in that case. Paeon is helpful at times though. Can't really remember, its been a while since I've played either brd or rdm/brd but I know that Ballad is the main concern and enfeebles are better from rdm.

[Laynton]

Re: RDM/BRD...any good?

Ya I agree with you that most the songs wont be needed or I'll have better spells. I was looking into just using ballad as a little refresh bonus in burn parties.

Using it in melee parties was more of a random question b/c I was just curious.

[MrMageo]

Re: RDM/BRD...any good?

Subjob of choice if you happen to be in a BLM(SCH) burn or SMN burn (not astral flow but simply a pet battle against bombs and such which doesn't really ever happen anymore due to stral flow parties).

In melee parties it is decent. (some what.) an extra 5%(roughly half of the bard skill cap) haste, or some ACC (to allow melees to equip more haste or atk gear). Just do not play minuet math wise it actually becomes the least effective song when buffed. (14 ATK or something.)

Outside of ballad the songs are meh. But more haste never hurts a TP burn, and since haste works the way it does 4-5% is still a very very nice bonus. That is basically a 20% increase to the total haste all melee can equip (based off gear haste only.)

Situational but can be useful.

However......

At lvl 99/49 things will change. Songs will get a buff when subbed, because the way they use combined skills to work the levels 37-49 will yield about an additional 50 skill points. Which is about 1% more on haste 5 more ATK and 2.5% hit rate.
Game breaking probably not. But again situational.

As far as the hierarchy of subs go, it will never crack the echelon as a must have sub. But I see its usefulness (as far as march and madrigal, minuet will usually always be lackluster by comparison. Heck even @ 75BRD minuet III and under is less effective than a minuet/mad or march/mad but thats a whole different discussion.)

As far as niche roles, COR will probably become a very very good niche subjob. Since it deals in % bases instead of whole numbers. For example a halved Chaos Role will give a 3-16% (8-20%) ATK bonus an average of 10(15%) will give your melees at the "least" (assuming that they are decently geared and eating food) a 50-75 ATK bonus on average. (which is nearly higher on average than a BRD's minuet 4 with Hard Cap +66 ATK)

At 80/40 you get evokers which will still provide 1 extra refresh (max 2 with a SMN in group)

Again situational but following the update, more useful than /BRD in my opinion if you are going to be sticking ATK on people. (not to mention the other stats for future mage group with m.acc + rolls (lvl 46 cor) or for the SMN's pet acc or pet atk, and much further down the line DA for melee)

[Omgwtfbbqkitten]

Re: RDM/BRD...any good?

Its awesome if you want to look totally desparate to join a manaburn party.

Thing is, I don't see it getting any better once the cap is raised to 99, Ballad II is a level 55 spell, so no dice.

Really though, I'd rather have a COR than a BRD or RDM in manaburn because of Corsair's Roll + Evoker's Roll. Plus Light Shot is waaaaaay more effective against puddings than lullaby. Quick Draw also shits on the Sha'ir BRDs competing against you for claim and /NIN sub swallows those AMs they like to cast.

BLMs don't need MAB buffs when they're dropping down AM2s at the same time, so the EXP buff really moves things along. If there's a SCH in tow, then they can supply the MAB through appropriate Storm spells.

[MrMageo]

Re: RDM/BRD...any good?

agreed bbq but I don't think its "desperation" it is more so coming better equipped to provide what you are there for (which needless to say is mp refresh). Is it going to change much, not really, but as they say every little bit counts.

[Omgwtfbbqkitten]

Re: RDM/BRD...any good?

agreed bbq but I don't think its "desperation" it is more so coming better equipped to provide what you are there for (which needless to say is mp refresh). Is it going to change much, not really, but as they say every little bit counts.

Unless your endgame LS really sucks, you're never going to need a RDM/BRD for events. I know CORs are rare, but LSes are never short of a BRD - even if you have to shame an officer into coming as the BRD they love to hide from everyone. BRDs are only rare because people don't want others to know they've leveled it, but CORs are rare because its a cost prohibitive job.

And if BLMs have a choice for Manaburn, RDM is dead last on their list. Many of them would just prefer to solo or duo if they can't get a BRD or COR to support them.

[MrMageo]

Re: RDM/BRD...any good?

Not disputing that fact, but the question asked was is it acceptable, the answer is yes. You can beat around the bush as much as you like, but when it comes down to it, in niche roles such as a blm burn or smn burn a RDM/BRD is more often than not going to be better than coming RDM/WHM or RDM/BLM. Personally however I much more prefer RDM/SCH when I go to blm burns, while refresh is ticking I am able to help kill mobs a bit faster. But then again you could show up as pretty well RDM/anything, all they want is your refresh.

For all intents an purposes though. Yes RDM/BRD is good, for BLM(SCH)/SMN burns. It is not expected, but it is appreciated.