The "Red Plague"

[dirtyclown]

ok, before i begin, let me say one thing. i don't mind a red mage who melees in a party, but i do mind when it's at the expense of other party members. today i met up with possibly the worst red mage in history. i have no clue how he got to lvl 48, and i don't know if nobody had ever told him anything before but he sucked. alot. i'm a bit harder on red mages in general when i'm lvling another job (paladin in this case) but this guy just disgusted me.

we were in the quicksand caves killing ants. our puller grabs one that can cast ancient magic and we all told him to keep it silenced. not once did he cast silence during the entire fight, even while it was casting quake on me. he just stood there and hit it with his sword. i guess he was afk during the fight or something, i have no idea. our white mage tried casting on it and got resisted. my shield bash had 45 seconds to reuse, so all i could do was stand there and wait for death. the entire time we partied he never once used a cure unless asked repeatedly and insisted on giving the mobs free TP.

enough ranting. something needs to be done about this. seems to me people get the idea that because they are able to use a sword they think they're melee-caster-mana battery-thingies. sounds like a great idea, but 99.9% of them are half assed and fail to perform their other functions in a party. in my case i'm too lazy to change my play style to include melee. i'd rather just hit my macros and watch the tube than speed read while i give monsters free TP so they can spam AoE attacks and stuff at me.
anybody else feel the same?

[Kerensky]

I found throught he 40s as rdm that if i tried to melee a mob, i was casting so much during the fight it really wasn't worth it. I would end up only getting a couple swings a fight. I guess I'll get my sword skill back up in coffer key parties or something.

[yuna544]

I get this a lot too, RDMs aren't doing what they supossed to ><. I'm a 71 RDM and I like meleeing, but need to cast your spells too >.x

I once had a RDM who would only cast refresh then unload arrows on the mob >.> I mean yeah at least he casted refresh but enfeebling is needed too >.x

[Rogan]

I've said this to 1,000 people on my server, and on these forums, bad rdm think they are meleers gifted with healing and nuking abilities, it's actually the other way around, and their nukes arent the greatest thing:sweat:

[Will95GST]

I used to melee during battle, but my casting came first so I ended up only hitting 2-3 times a fight because I was busy enfeebling, nuking, and healing. Now I don't even bother attacking. I just keep my sword for soloing and keep my Wand equipped to help with spell casting (+3mnd +3int) while partying. I don't see what's so hard about this to other people. If you wanna melee.. be a WAR. lol.

[Patchinko]

Re: The &quot;Red Plague&quot;

Originally posted by dirtyclown
something needs to be done about this.

Drop him from your PT. If you're not leader, ask the leader to drop him. And if the leader won't do it, drop yourself (I know it can be hard to find a PT, but at least as a PLD you hold some clout).

The way he got to level 48 was because even though he's horrible, people are still partying with him, most likely because there isn't a RDM or BRD available at that moment. RDMs are a very valuable part of a PLD party, but unless they are given tough treatment when they go AFK during fights or don't listen to their party members, how are they going to learn? Refresh is invaluable, of course, but so are Silence and Dispel on Anticans. To me, it would be like a SAM who engages the mob but doesn't use weapon skills... would you keep him in your PT?

I know it sounds harsh, but when I'm in a party I have no tolerance for that kind of thing. I'm nice about it, but if you aren't going to at least try to do your job (and the job isn't simply refreshing, engaging and then going afk), you are adversely affecting my play experience and I will have to get rid of you.

[dirtyclown]

i wasn't leader or i would have dropped him in a second. i asked the leader and she said no. i wanted 50 really badly so i stuck around for the next 2k exp and left directly after the white mage went to bed.

[Lightseeker]

Re: Re: The &quot;Red Plague&quot;

Originally posted by Patchinko
The way he got to level 48 was because even though he's horrible, people are still partying with him, most likely because there isn't a RDM or BRD available at that moment.

This is exactly the problem. I've gotten less and less tolerant of RDMs who can't or won't do their job. I had one in a CN party, level 50+, that didn't even use a wand for casting. He melee'd, cast Refresh, Slow, and Para. That was it. I was party leader, so I asked him to stop meleeing and just cast and rest. We had no WHM, so it was him and me doing all the enfeebs, buffs, etc, with a smn/whm curing. He refused. I kicked him and got a bard replacement. Yes, there was downtime while the bard came, but the exp was 10 times better. Some people say "well some exp is better than no exp" and I've used that excuse many times to stay in a cruddy party. I don't buy it anymore, though. I'd rather be lfp or make my own good party than stay with a bad one just b/c 1 person doesn't want to do his job.

Sorry for the tangent/rant. My real point is, RDM = enfeeb, buff, backup heal/nuke, then MAYBE melee. I don't think a good RDM has TIME to melee in an exp party (skillups, coffers, those are different). There is always something more useful he/she could be doing, even if it's resting.

[Hopkins]

I understand what you mean about some exp is better than none but there are times when people are forced into odd parties.

I was in CN, 5 others looking for PT.

RDM, RDM, PAL, THF, WAR and NIN. I asked them if they were willing to put up with slow exp while they found better PT's, they said yes.

They had been sitting around for a while, now they were getting 125 exp a kill. 125 times more than they were before. If they got a better PT, cool i didnt care if they left, i would just get the next person LFG.

But ya, in your position i completly agree it's better to wait than get someone who cannot do their job or is incompatible for the post.

[xcalibur2k]

Originally posted by Hopkins
If they got a better PT, cool i didnt care if they left, i would just get the next person LFG.

How will they get another pt if they don't have their seek flag up? :confused:

Do they all just shout in CN "{Help me out!} <job> LFP. {Please invite me}" ?

[stabby]

Originally posted by Rogan
I've said this to 1,000 people on my server, and on these forums, bad rdm think they are meleers gifted with healing and nuking abilities, it's actually the other way around, and their nukes arent the greatest thing:sweat:

While RDM nukes can't compete with BLM nukes for raw damage, for a properly-equipped RDM (60ish, full AF, ice staff, moldavite earring, wizard's earring, BLM sub (not all of these are required)), you're quite capable of being competitive with and even exceeding BLMs of your level on a damage per MP basis. Efficiency for the win.

[Kafeen]

Reminds me of an RDM in my party the other day. There was a shortage of WHM for healing at the time so initially it was my RDM and a SMN/WHM healing and we were doing fine. After a while the SMN had to leave so we got another RDM to replace them, they were told when they joined that we were both going to need to heal to allow the other to debuff etc. All this other RDM did was cast blink, aquaveil, stone skin, phalanx and enfire on them selves then summon a light elemental (SMN sub) and melee the whole time. When the tanks did run low on hp they couldn't heal because they had no MP left from keeping the element out the whole time.

[tdh]

I meleed my whole way to Lv.30, but after 30 I melee less and less per level. I still draw my weapon, but with all the casting I end up doing, I think I do maybe 15dmg melee. lol

Even then, I'm not even sure why I melee at all. Maybe it's just an issue of I can, or that I've done it for such a long time. I used to start a fight with Regen on tank, Enhancing spell while tank Provoked, then fire off my Enfeebling macros. Now, I can't even remember the last time I used Enfire or any of those spells.

Regen & Stoneskin on the pull, since I'm not afraid to cast CureIII at any time. I haven't done much in the way of nuking in my last few parties. Had a good BLM with me, and a WHM who got the job, but I put them to shame. To the point that even they said I was doing most of their job. So I Magic Bursted, keep them slow, paralyzed, blinded, and my DoT's going, and healed. Every 4th fight I'd Cure Monkey while the WHM rested. Just to keep the chain going. (I'm used to 180-250+ EXP in chains. Suddenly 200 on a #2 chain then resting was annoying me, so I'd "WHM it" on some fights to keep the chain alive.)

But I think we're all guilty of judging other RDMs. We've spent a lot of time as a RDM, and we have set our standards very high because we expect the best for ourselves. Then we level another job, then find a RDM we think should be thrown off the Mhaura/Selbina ferry. lol

Found a RDM/SMN in C.Nest one night. Party was PLD, DRK(me), MNK, RDM, BRD, WHM.

RDM has some really nice gear, and had about 600MP. (Hume RSE, Astral Rings, Holy Phial, other MP+ gear) Did some enfeebling, though I would have done more in that case. They didn't use Dispel until the BRD started using theirs. So they'd waste the MP while the BRD played their song. So all they really did was Enblizzard and melee. As soon as their MP dropped below 400, they'd disengage and /heal. All while the mob was about half dead. More than 50% MP and they're resting, not keeping their debuffs up.

Granted their play didn't slow us down much, it did however annoy most of the party. Most of the party was close to leveling, so once we all leveled, we ditched the RDM, and headed to Gustav Tunnel, where we found another not so stellar party member, but much better EXP.

[Zempten]

Originally posted by tdh


But I think we're all guilty of judging other RDMs. We've spent a lot of time as a RDM, and we have set our standards very high because we expect the best for ourselves. Then we level another job, then find a RDM we think should be thrown off the Mhaura/Selbina ferry. lol

Sweet ^^ I love the "...thrown off the Mhaura/Selbina ferry". Personally I would go for the " leave them out of the teleport <insert name here>"

Completely agree, but I don't feel guilty about judging other players. If they suck...well they just suck but if they are willing to learn how to NOT suck then there's hope for them. If they are down right good I'll give them that credit.

[Deathguise]

^^ Or the "You go pull" and then Escape.