rdm/nin A GOOD COMBO!

[Gman]

Originally posted by Bamce Sylph
Gman, in the first couple days after the ps2 release i got more random tells about helping, powerleveling, money than i had in the whole time i had been playing. yes some good players came with it, yes some bad players came with it, yes there are bad pc players, however every messageboard became flooded with dead horse topics again, people asking the same questions that have been answered time and time again with stickies and faq's on each and every page that could answer they're question.

and yes, i am an asshole, however i am entitled to my opinion just as u are entitled to think i'm an arrogant prick

It's fine if you felt bothered by some of the newbies that came in when the PS2 version released, but to simplify it as "a day of infamy" is going overboard. It's not evil or wrong that the PS2 release happened, it's an adjustment, so deal with it rather than treating it like the worst day in the history of gaming.

I highly doubt people are bugging you now. I know I only get an annoying /tell once in a while, and I'm level 50 RDM, so PL requests are not uncommon.

As a PS2 player myself, I'm sick of the stereotype.

[Kilgraw]

Originally posted by Bamce Sylph
however every messageboard became flooded with dead horse topics again, people asking the same questions that have been answered time and time again with stickies and faq's on each and every page that could answer they're question.

Same thing happened during the NA PC release.

[Bamce Sylph]

popp, yes initally u will get a boost of hate from trick attack, yes however EVERYONE ELSE will be accumulating they're own hate, the reason trick works on tank classes is because they have other things they can use to gather more hate. a redmage has none of those trick except for heals, and have your local pally try to keep hate with only heals, no defender, no eminty gear, no flash, no provoke, no sheild bash, see how well that works.

kil, i wasn't reading a whole lot of boards (was only reading this one at the time, now i cruise about 3-4, and i stay far away from alla's or gamefaq's) during pc release there wasn't nearly as much in english information released as there is now. and on top of that translators are iffy.

gman, congrats on being a competend ps2 player, you know where the message boards are, u know how to read them and if i had to guess i'd say u waited fot ps2 release b/c maybe your comp isn't up to spec to run it? maybe u only have one pc in your house and want to play w/ another in the same house so u got ps2 version, i don't know, what i do know is that my sig was in place at least a month before the ps2 release. however everyone sterotypes everyone else, we have na players and jp players, we have high lvls we have low lvls, we have casual, we have hard core, we have noobs we have elitists, we have pc players we have ps2 players, we have no way of telling from the search pt members screen who or what you are, how you play or anything, u could be a casual 3 hours/day player or u could be an arrogant prick

[Mila]

Imma galka rdm... I do my job just fine! No beter than just fine I do it great! :mad: Another race with a /nin sub will have comparable mp even with all my mp boosting equip. So RDM/NIN will work, just don't think RDM is an easy job to do with limited mp

[Alucath]

I hope this thread gets closed, it's just flame /sigh.

Search button.
Come oN!

[macross_sdf1]

rdm/ninja with kraken club and excalibur would do crazy damage. But not vs super hnms, since club skill id D so you'd miss like mad, plus its bad to whack super hnms with kraken anyways. But for general farming speed it's hard to beat a kraken club.

All in all rdm/ninja is uber for soloing nms, but you wouldn't do it in pts. It would be feasible if you had a kraken and had a bard for +acc, and you fought stuff with crappy specials, and fought stuff that you could drain mp from.

[neosoul]

Nothing wrong with the PS2 release because it brought many quality players to the game.

Haha, many "quality" players indeed

[Beener]

Originally posted by Gman
I will praise the day your computer blows up you arrogant prick.

Nothing wrong with the PS2 release because it brought many quality players to the game.

I'm sorry...but honestly.......i have met 2.

I have not leveled the WHM sub for my BLM yet because of that release, STILL. I simply cannot without bringing my own LS party, or mostly LS members.

For example, a conversation today:

Titon>> HEY WANNA PARTY (yes all caps)
Xer>> what jobs and levels?
Titon>> 13MNK AND 12MNK AND ...
Titon>> ANOTHER 12MNK
Xer>> no thanks
Titon>> Y NOT?
Xer>> 1. caps hurt my eyes 2. i'm looking for party, not barfight.

This is not to say there are not bad PC players, but the PS2 players just can't seem to learn, nor seem to want to learn.

[R1pp3z]

Originally posted by Beener
I'm sorry...but honestly.......i have met 2.

I have not leveled the WHM sub for my BLM yet because of that release, STILL. I simply cannot without bringing my own LS party, or mostly LS members.

For example, a conversation today:

Titon>> HEY WANNA PARTY (yes all caps)
Xer>> what jobs and levels?
Titon>> 13MNK AND 12MNK AND ...
Titon>> ANOTHER 12MNK
Xer>> no thanks
Titon>> Y NOT?
Xer>> 1. caps hurt my eyes 2. i'm looking for party, not barfight.

This is not to say there are not bad PC players, but the PS2 players just can't seem to learn, nor seem to want to learn.

Yeah but how do you expect them to learn when everyone goes around treating them with that elitist attitude... You could just try being nice once in a while.. (note I said nice...not polite..they are two different things)

[poppipo]

srry guys

srry i was wrong i looked at the other rdm/nin forums or whatever and im totally wrong

[Beener]

I'm probably one of the nicest people to new players i know. I save everyone i can when i'm in lower level areas, i raise for free whenever i can, i try my best to nudge ppl in the direction of doing their jobs correctly...

Hell, look at that situation...i taught him that he was not making a good party.

Here's a fun new example from my WHM days in the dunes:

I got blind invite in dunes by Fyee, a 15 redmage. i accept

once we get to the camp, i am a little dismayed to find the redmage pulling. The rest of the group and i said that the warrior with the crossbow should pull, and that "Mages generally don't pull." Her response: "But i'm a rdm" me: "that stands for red mage, and you need to get your MP back after a fight"

"WELL I'M LEADER SO I SAY I'M PULLING"

Like i said, some are just not willing to learn ...

[Zalius]

Don't even get me started on the idiot rdms who REFUSE to enfeeble when asked. Seriously I run thru SO many of these people in dunes and up its sad. I am a 52 rdm myself. Bascally when i am lfp in dunes and i see a rdm in party with no sub I think think *oh joy another idiot who dunno how to play their damn class* Which turns out to be true 95% of the time .

[moonyaco]

Its efficiency that counts

Reasons for having the red mage pull,

1.The melee puller sucks
2.The melee puller isn't highest lvl in pt to con the suitable monsters to kill
3.The melee puller is a noobie ( note:sucking and being a noob are 2 different catagories even though they pertain to the same conclusion)
4.There hasnt been any exp chain happening
5.The red mage is a kickass puller who brings the group great exp chains like for eg. even - even - VT/IT
6.The whm mage is doing his/her job well enough and could use supprt heals during IT/VT mobs or only occasionaly.
7.The rdm could melee/para/dia for every mob untill the whm calls for a meditation break. (not if he spends mana foolishly)
8.The rdm is the leader, highest rank, wants to get exp asap, knows which mobs are easiest for the pt config to kill and chain on.
9.The rdm knows the situation of his pt best, when not to pull and whether the pt can take another even/V/VT or IT, hence pushing the party to its limit and making exp time efficient at its best.
10.The current melee puller is too tired from continuous pulling for the past 4-5 hours and would like a break. If there is no other good puller for the party, the red mage is actually the only versatile mage job that can pull with dia/para, get voked off, debuff with dia/para having both land and maybe adding gravity if its IT/VT. The only times a red mage should just stay back, cast- rest, cast-rest like those whm/blms is when there is no other whm in the party (meaning the rdm is the only healer).

I think stereotyping red mage as a cast and sit job for maximum efficiency is pure ignorance. Rank B in sword isn't as bad as most would think, well maybe untill 55+ when tons of Accuracy+Atk gears are a must for all melee jobs in orde to hit ITs, thats when Rdms, wearing only mana and hp/mana converting gears would start to show signs of lacking.

just a few side notes, Rdm deal decent melee with/without enhancing spells with melee and skill chains chain followed by magic bursts. If they know how to manage their mana well, they're overall contribution to the party would be a lot higher through melee and casting instead of sitting back and nuking/debuff/heal. That would be an inefficent use of available resource

ps. Don't blame other players for being unable to level. This game is not played by only geniuses. If it is, then almost everyone is a dumbass. You have to work with new players and slow learners in some cases to exp. If you can't, then make a perma exp pt (anti-social pt). It is a failure on your part for not being able to convince a less efficient player a better mean of playing his role in the party. Try to be less demanding and persuade them. They will learn to be a better pt player and you will benefit with faster exps.

[neosoul]

Moonyaco, no offense but you have no idea what you are talking about. RDM/melee doesnt outdamage RDM/caster. You can swing your sword all battle with your dingy damage while a good rdm will be healing during fights and put all your damage to shame with a single spell. RDM/NIN, lol...
Not to mention pulling with a RDM is the dumbest idea i ever heard, when you should be regening mana.

[Karinya]

I've pulled with RDM before, but not with an exp party. The safest way to pull Liches for Genkai 1 is Silence. Any other method of pulling may cause them to respond with immediate ancient magic, and you may not be able to run far enough to get out of its range without drawing an add from something else (obviously this depends on where you are pulling from and to, but if you pull with Silence they don't even get to try).

Utsusemi wouldn't have helped in this case - the only advantage it has over Blink is the shorter casting time, and I didn't even need to bother with Blink - Stoneskin was plenty. On the other hand my whm sub was very useful for blindna, paralyna and occasionally curaga, not to mention divine seal cure4 after each convert. (I normally prefer blm sub, but in Eldieme you need status cures a lot, even with whm in party, and giving up Drain and Aspir is a non-issue.)

Partly we resorted to mage pulling because none of the melees had a ranged weapon , but once we started it worked really well. I don't get to rest much anyway post-Refresh.

In general, though, pulling should be left to rng, thf, or other non-mp-dependent jobs with ranged weapons (war, sam, drk), because a rdm does SOMETIMES get to rest between battles. It's rare that you have a whole party with no competent and prepared non-mage puller.

And rdm, especially after level 30, should sub blm or whm in an exp party, the benefits of doing so far outweigh nin. RDM/NIN may have its place in some quests, missions, or NM hunts (personally I've never seen one that doesn't suck, but it *may* have a place), but it's not a good combo for an exp party in my experience.

BTW - I'm not saying rdm shouldn't melee, only that it isn't the primary focus of the job, and a sj that supports your primary functions (more mp, Conserve MP, seals, more spells) is more useful than one that only supports a secondary function.