Ranger Accuracy Trait

[Spider-Dan]

Originally posted by Apple Pie
Well, I should have written something like this.

RNG10: +10 Acc/R-Acc
RNG30: +22 (10+12) Acc/R-Acc
RNG50: +35 (10+12+13) Acc/R-Acc
RNG70: +48 (10+12+13+13) Acc/R-Acc

This looks much more valid. The difference in hit rate when you hit LV30 could not have been just 2 more accuracy.

[poweryoga]

rangers are powerful because we spent a shitload of money for ammos.

Also, I don't think that's the right forumla for Racc because I don't notice a whole lot of accuracy difference from 30-50, and from 50-70. I hit a tiny bit more often without all my new R.acc equipment but not so much to warrant a +13 accuracy increase.

[fastcart]

Originally posted by Apple Pie
Well, I should have written something like this.

RNG10: +10 Acc/R-Acc
RNG30: +22 (10+12) Acc/R-Acc
RNG50: +35 (10+12+13) Acc/R-Acc
RNG70: +48 (10+12+13+13) Acc/R-Acc

Can you provide a link to where this official book is available? Like I said, Brady only lists melee Accurracy Bonus, and notRange Accuracy Bonus in their fall and spring guides. And, I still find it difficult to believe that I have +22 Accuracy Bonus as Sam/Rng. This would mean I have a total of +47 Accuracy and +44 Range Accuracy with my gear. And, if I do, that just blows my mind because I miss so much.

Btw, who is Apple Pie? The way he stated this is like he's the one who wrote it in the first place.

I'm not calling anyone a liar. I just want verification because the NA guide as well as my experience doesn't fit these stats.

You can see my equipment list here:
http://ffxi.allakhazam.com/profile.xml?26364

[Apple Pie]

Unfortunately, there's no way we can verify RAcc bonus mathmatically and it might be different from Acc although we already have firm conclusion on Acc.

Well, think of our gears for example. As we grow up, we're able to have access to those with a lot of bonuses. However, is our accuracy tremendously improved from those? I'm afraid not. DRK30 with the +4 Acc (excluding those from DEX) has 55 - 60% accuracy rate against ITs and so does DRK60 with +40 Acc.

What is more, as we go higher, we have to beat those with higher LV.

e.g) The PT of LV30 gets 200 XP from LV38 (+8) ITs
The PT of LV60 gets 200 XP from LV71 (+11) ITs

So, we cannot always reproduce the same background at these LV. I don't know how the book I refer to verify that but it is authorized by S-E in fact

[Apple Pie]

You can get it at Amazon.com (Amazon.co.jp).

http://www.amazon.co.jp/exec/obidos/...855409-8973847

The book is published by Enterbrain, the biggest company issuing a lot of gaming guides.
http://www.enterbrain.co.jp/jp/p_cat...77-1691-5.html

And myself? Well, I'm just one of JPN red mages who has been playing this game for two years.

[Apple Pie]

Sorry about my tripple posts.

BTW fastcart, I saw your gears but aren't you familiar with "gear swapping?" That's what all red mages regularly do from LV10 but how about setup the macro like this for your bow shooting and WS.

/equip l.ring Merman's Ring
/equip r.ring Merman's Ring
/range <t>
/wait [total delay]
/equip l.ring Sniper's Ring
/equip r.ring Ruby Ring

/equip l.ring Merman's Ring
/equip r.ring Merman's Ring
/ws Sidewinder <t>
/wait 4
/equip l.ring Sniper's Ring
/equip r.ring Ruby Ring

As a result, you're able to get total +37 RAcc instead of +22 from your gears. I'm not sure how it's improved though

[Spider-Dan]

Originally posted by fastcart
Btw, who is Apple Pie? The way he stated this is like he's the one who wrote it in the first place.

That's because he is.

http://www.ffxionline.com/forums/sho...546#post413546

The original post mentioned that the info was from an RDM Archery thread. It took me all of 2 minutes to verify that he was the original poster cited.

[fastcart]

Originally posted by Apple Pie
Sorry about my tripple posts.

BTW fastcart, I saw your gears but aren't you familiar with "gear swapping?" That's what all red mages regularly do from LV10 but how about setup the macro like this for your bow shooting and WS.

/equip l.ring Merman's Ring
/equip r.ring Merman's Ring
/range <t>
/wait [total delay]
/equip l.ring Sniper's Ring
/equip r.ring Ruby Ring

/equip l.ring Merman's Ring
/equip r.ring Merman's Ring
/ws Sidewinder <t>
/wait 4
/equip l.ring Sniper's Ring
/equip r.ring Ruby Ring

As a result, you're able to get total +37 RAcc instead of +22 from your gears. I'm not sure how it's improved though

Yeah, I am familiar. Lol. I actually use it a lot. It's just that I'm only able to post 1 piece of equipment per slot. You make a good recommendation, but I'm normally walking around with 39-42/50 inventory. Since, I'm Sam rather than Rng, I try to focus slightly more on physical accuracy or be balanced at all times. I'm more likely to get another Sniper's Ring than a Merman's Ring. But, I think I manage do to a good job balancing the two accuracy bonuses rather than go overboard on one or the other. I'd much rather miss a few Sidewinders here and there (I tend to only use Sidewinders on Even Matches or lower) than miss a Kasha or Gekko (VT/IT mobs) because I either screwed up or forgot a weapon change macro in the heat of battle or the game screwed it up because of lag.

As far as your "e.g) The PT of LV30 gets 200 XP from LV38 (+8) ITs. The PT of LV60 gets 200 XP from LV71 (+11) ITs" post goes, again, another good point. I wish that SE put as much effort into the NA part of the game as they do the JP. JPs seem to get more information, more accurate information, and quicker inforrmation than NA. Rather than calling anyone a liar in this thread, my posts were more disbelief that NA got screwed again. "What?? Are you telling me that even our strategy guides are gimped??!!" So, sorry if I came off the wrong way. Heh.

Originally posted by Spider-Dan
That's because he is.

http://www.ffxionline.com/forums/sho...546#post413546

The original post mentioned that the info was from an RDM Archery thread. It took me all of 2 minutes to verify that he was the original poster cited.

Ahh... I don't normally check other Job forums other than Sam and Rng, so it didn't occur to me to check. It just looked like Apple Pie appeared from outta no where on this thread. ^^ Thanks. Please consider me thoroughly embarrased and put into my place. ^^

[Timoham]

ya Ruic told me about the post so I went to check it out. Thought I was correcting someone, but then I got schooled. :O Sorry I didn't link to the thread originally. Wasn't quite thinking about it

[neighbortaru]

I don't think SE is deliberately holding back information from the EN players. It's just that the JP community does a buttload of experiments to figure all this stuff out.

[Spider-Dan]

Originally posted by neighbortaru
I don't think SE is deliberately holding back information from the EN players. It's just that the JP community does a buttload of experiments to figure all this stuff out.

Doubtful. I don't think you can determine exact accuracy bonuses through any amount of experimentation.

It is not uncommon for Japanese companies to provide extremely detailed information to Japanese gaming media. Capcom does this a lot with the Street Fighter games; you can find out all sort of super-detailed frame data in the Japanese guides, while the US guides are little more than movelists.

[Apple Pie]

I don't think you can determine exact accuracy bonuses through any amount of experimentation.

Well, we can. By the time the book was issued, there had already been some people found Acc bonus of RNG here.

http://pamama.hp.infoseek.co.jp/FF11...3-10-18-3.html (Japanese though)

Basically, acuracy is calculated in this way.

- Skill<201
X = [Skill] + Int[DEX/2] + Acc. Bonus(from gears and etc.)

Int = Integer

So, those guys compared RDM60/BLM30 to RDM60/RNG30 and check when they started to see "low evasion" on Robber Crabs in Kuftal Tunnel.

To summarize, when X of RDM/BLM was 219, EM crabs were with "low evasion." On the other hand, when X of RDM/RNG was 197, they were. As a result, they found RNG had +22 Acc. bonus at LV30. In the same way, they found RNG70 had +48 Bonus.

We have a community reserching this kind of mysteries and what we've done can be found here.

http://pamama.hp.infoseek.co.jp/FF11kensyou/

[Spider-Dan]

Here's the thing, though; how can you determine (for example) the Int[DEX/2] part of that equation? You have to assume that mobs have integer numbers for their evasion, which is not verifiable. And based on what we can visibly see about some other factors (e.g. TP generation) we know that the game does calculate fractions of numbers, at least in certain instances.

Another thing that has to be assumed is that the ranged accuracy bonus is equal to the accuracy bonus from the job trait. It's not possible to even use mob checking to verify this, as the /check reports based on your melee weapon.

You (and others) have certainly done an admirable job figuring out workable equations that match up well to real world results. But there are a lot of aspects of the game that are not verifiable without looking at the code itself, or getting the word from Squenix.

[Apple Pie]

> Int[DEX/2]
This is what S-E officially says. Haven't you seen the interview with S-E staff? I lost the URL but there's English one as well.

2 DEX -> 1 Acc.
2 STR -> 1 Att.
2 AGI -> 1 Evasion
2 VIT -> 1 Def.

As for RAcc., true. We have no way to verify this.

[Spider-Dan]

Originally posted by Apple Pie
> Int[DEX/2]
This is what S-E officially says. Haven't you seen the interview with S-E staff? I lost the URL but there's English one as well.

2 DEX -> 1 Acc.
2 STR -> 1 Att.
2 AGI -> 1 Evasion
2 VIT -> 1 Def.

As for RAcc., true. We have no way to verify this.

URL here:
http://ffxi.crgaming.com/interviews/...iew.asp?Id=209

What many others have pointed out is that while Squenix does specifically say 2 STR = 1 ATK and 2 VIT = 1 DEF (which we could figure out anyway, because we can see ATK and DEF rating), they don't say the same for DEX and AGI. They only say that DEX and ACC's values are "not equivalent" and that if you want to raise your accuracy, you should do it directly with ACC.

Anyway, this is kind of tangential, because my whole point was that unless Squenix tells us specifically, we can't know for sure. Supposing that there is JP documentation where Squenix does directly say 2 DEX = 1 ACC, well, we wouldn't be able to know that for sure if they hadn't told us.