Merit Question

[Aldion]

Re: Merit Question

Be sure to check what skills your job actually has before you give up the idea. A lot of jobs have unexpected skills, for example I merited my THF's dagger skill 1 point using my BLM before I started leveling it so I'd get WS's one level early.

This is available to you because you are able to equip some daggers and BLM actually has a D rating in Dagger (ya know, for their stabby stabby feelings). Looks like the only useful things to merit for me are stats and HP/MP.

Reference: http://www.ausystem.org/~aushacho/gbox/ff/skill-e.html

[Davitron3000]

Re: Merit Question

and was hoping I could improve other jobs that I enjoy playing instead of meritting a job which I rarely use any more.

You can do this. Just see what things "crossover". Example: If you have 75 Paladin and
decide you want to level Ninja, you can merit enmity, evasion, etc, on your Paladin and
they will be useful on your Ninja. I don't know for sure, but I think that your merits are
enabled as you gain levels with your new job. Example: you put 4 MP merits into your
Paladin and begin playing Redmage. You won't get all those mp merits right away.
(if someone knows more about this please elaborate)

The other stuff is a little off topic, but Paladins and Ninjas are both useful at endgame.
Maybe I am just lucky because my LS uses the the talents of both jobs. I have
seen both Paladins and Ninjas tank gods...and both do a great job.

[Fynlar]

Re: Merit Question

Example: you put 4 MP merits into your
Paladin and begin playing Redmage. You won't get all those mp merits right away.
(if someone knows more about this please elaborate)

You regain your first "tier" of merits at level 10, second tier at level 20, and so on. Meaning that if you've gotten 4 HP and 4 MP merits, you would have +40 HP and MP at level 40.

If there's something that can be merited 8 times and you merited it all 8 times, you need to get all the way to 75 before you get the full effect of those merits.

[Cookietovar]

Re: Merit Question

PLD, unfortunately, has been a broken job ever since NIN (more specifically, Utsusemi) was released, and I really don't see this changing anytime soon. Auto Refresh and Shield Mastery, while useful for the PLD trying to reach endgame level, does not come close to solving their problems AT endgame. More MP and TP is not what PLD needs at all.

Three things need to happen before PLDs can start to reclaim spots in meripo and various endgame activities:

1) PLD needs a boost in their DDing capability. Yes, I know they can sacrifice Provoke, Defender, and their tanking gear and whatnot in order to DD a little better, and if they're 74+ and go /NIN they can still survive to a degree. However, they still do not compare to the standard DD. People will invite DRGs to their meripo parties before they'll invite a PLD DD.

2) PLD needs a boost in damage mitigation. Stuff that swings devastating blows at PLD still only hit NINs for zero damage. Various CoP HNMs can Fast Cast an ancient magic spell at a PLD and they'll drop in one hit, sometimes taking more damage than they have max HP; NIN just laughs and throws up a single shadow to deflect it. Nobody can convince me this isn't broken.

3) Utsusemi: Ni NEEDS to be pushed to a 38+ level. There is absolutely no reason why a NIN's one practically defining spell can be subbed; why the hell can't I sub RDM and use Convert/Refresh? If /NINs could only cast Ichi this would put a hamper on randommelee/NIN's ability to be able to "tank" endgame stuff. The way it is now, you can just slap /NIN on everyone, trade hate carefully, and short of AoEs (which also hurt PLDs just as much) they aren't gonna get touched. Who needs a tank?


I love PLDs; I am 75RDM and there is a PLD I staticed with for most of the way up there. The RDM-PLD relationship is a pretty unique one; PLD actually tends to prefer us over BRDs due to the fact we can actually land Refresh on them on a consistent basis. I actually want to take up PLD next after my WHM. However, now that me and my friend have both reached 75, I am starting to hear more and more from my friend about just how PLDs are getting the shaft in endgame.

If ni was pushed to 38 Soooooo many ppl would be mad, but i do think its nessesary. c'mon ppl have melee jobs tanking over pld basically Ni > All.

[Aldion]

Re: Merit Question

You can do this. Just see what things "crossover". Example: If you have 75 Paladin and
decide you want to level Ninja, you can merit enmity, evasion, etc, on your Paladin and
they will be useful on your Ninja. I don't know for sure, but I think that your merits are
enabled as you gain levels with your new job. Example: you put 4 MP merits into your
Paladin and begin playing Redmage. You won't get all those mp merits right away.
(if someone knows more about this please elaborate)

Yea, but what I mean is, the only two jobs I really had an interest in other than PLD was SAM and BLM, and more recently COR. I will not be able to upgrade the combat skills for SAM or COR (except Sword for COR :/) and I am aware I could Merit MP for BLM. I don't want to tamper with + or - emnity because I do play BLM quite regularly (+emnity could = dead Aldion) and even though I don't need to tank much with my PLD anymore, I still do at some points (-emnity could = dead party ).

Only other decent merit I can think of if I wanted to go Melee is +Crit Rate.

[Tirrock]

Re: Merit Question

I thought it was 10 > 20 > 30 > 40 > 50 > 55 > 60 > 65. I'm not sure though...never finished off my MP merits.

If you're leveling a melee, don't forget about crit hit rate. That's a really good thing to merit.

[Davitron3000]

Re: Merit Question

In addition to + crit rate you could merit some attributes such as STR and DEX.

[Fynlar]

Re: Merit Question

If ni was pushed to 38 Soooooo many ppl would be mad, but i do think its nessesary. c'mon ppl have melee jobs tanking over pld basically Ni > All.

I'm well aware that people would be mad, but seriously, /NIN as it is is plain overpowered at 74+. Something needs to be done... doubt that it will happen though =/

I thought it was 10 > 20 > 30 > 40 > 50 > 55 > 60 > 65. I'm not sure though...never finished off my MP merits.

It might work like that, I don't know. I just heard that it was at every 10th level that another tier of merits kicks in.

[Cookietovar]

Re: Merit Question

if it were meritin pld and blm id forget about the enmity and put them into spell castin inturruption,
idk, thats y i lv jobs that can relate to the merits i do.

Double Post Edited:

I'm well aware that people would be mad, but seriously, /NIN as it is is plain overpowered at 74+. Something needs to be done... doubt that it will happen though =/




It might work like that, I don't know. I just heard that it was at every 10th level that another tier of merits kicks in.

mmm, true

[Paladin X]

Re: Merit Question

I think the reason a lot of PLDs get passed up for Meritpo pts is because they arent willing to adapt to TP burn pts.

A lot of PLDs complain about buying DD gear such as the Hauby or STR Rings or Snipers, when a normal DD has to buy those type of things at lvl 60 or lower.

Some ppl say that PLD just doesnt have the stats to produce dmg, but thats not true at all.

In regards to STR:

-A Hume DRK/THF has a base STR of 71

-A Hume WAR/NIN has a base STR of 73

-A Hume PLD/WAR has a base STR of 72

a difference of 1 STR isnt going to make or break a DD.

In regards to weapons:

- DRKs use an A- weapon (Great Sword) which has a cap of 269 at 75 **

- WARs also use an A- weapon (Axes) which has a cap of again 269 at 75 **

- PLDs use an A+ weapon (Sword) which has a cap of 276 at 75

** DRKs and WARs do have A+ weapons (Scythe and Great Axe respectively), but for the most part uses A- weapons.

So from this view, we have +7 Acc and Atk over a WAR/NIN and a DRK/THF

In regards to equip, yes, there is some gear that DRKs and WARs can wear that we cant, but some of the most commonly used DD gear we can (Hauby, Byrnie, STR rings, Acc Rings, etc.). Get a PLDs with a haste type build (Dusk Gear, Speed belt) and you can have a solid DD.

So what makes use different than DRKs and WARs? Job Abilities and Job Traits? Spells?

DRKs get Last Resort (a weak Berserk) and some Absorb spells, which not too many DRKs use, and Soul Eater, which takes 10% of your HP and adds it to your dmg. For JTs, they get 3 Atk Up traits.

WARs get the almighty Berserk and Warcry, and Agressor which increases Acc. For JTs, they get Double Attack, and one Atk up.

PLDs get squat when it comes to DD JAs and JTs.

So this is where the difference comes in, we dont have any skills to naturally boost our Atk/Acc.

However, this doesnt mean we cant DD, the Atk up traits only add 10-15 Atk each, and a few of those things we can get by subbing WAR (Berserk, Warcry, Double Atk, one Atk up trait).

So why cant we DD? Because we think we cant.

If PLDs were taught at lower lvls to also carry a DD equip set around with them, even if it was just to macro into WSs, i think more ppl would be able to see the potential of a PLD DD. I know when im just goofing around/skilling up with my friends, and im pulling off some high dmg WSs, they are all "O.O", but if more PLDs did that in XP pts, it wouldnt come off as such a surprize, which after comparing base stats, weapons, equip, JAs and JTs, it shouldnt.

[csBahamut]

Re: Merit Question

Yeah, merit parties were few and far between for me. I had family and friends to exp and merit with. I also got to /NIN and DD in some sky deco weapon parties.

With the release of Aht Urghan though, and it's very PLD friendly mobs, more and more PLDs are able to merit. I just finally got my first merit party today in the new zones. It was the at the Mamool Ja staging point. I don't know our exp/hr for the whole thing, but the first hour was 8K exp, and that was with me and someone else dying. The party was WHM, BRD, PLD, MNK, MNK, DRG.

What made it so great for PLD is that the Sea Puks and Mamool Ja hit weak, and had nasty abilities. Even the IT Mamool Ja. The puks had AoE that they spammed (I'd be surprised if a NIN could keep shadows up for long, or hold hate if trying to use Ichi). Mamool Ja have Firespit (ignores shadows, is physical based - highest was 826 on me. ~400 was typical), Vropal Blade (the BLUs), and some other multi-hit WS. I used attack food and sushi (tried both to see how well I would perform), and only saw 130 dmg from the high end from IT Mamool Ja. All the Sea puks were T, and hit for 80 damage at most. My regular shield block dropped hits down as low as 21. Since I had no refresh (not even ballad), hate wasn't on me always. I'd say I had hate at least 60% of the time. The Mamool Ja were hard to hit without sushi. We reached a chain of 25 or 26 before we ran out of mobs to pull because of overcamping.

So, I'd say that PLD meriting is not dead. With the right party setup, a PLD party can do just as good as a NIN party now. PLDs need need to adapt to what is being fought. Gear, food, and playstyle -wise.

[Davitron3000]

Re: Merit Question

PLDs need need to adapt to what is being fought. Gear, food, and playstyle -wise.

QFT.
This has been the hardest thing for me as a Paladin. I wanted to tank the same
way I had always tanked, but it just wasn't working and I was losing faith in the
job. Then I realized it is not necessarily the job, it was that I wasn't adapting
to the needs of my party. The more I play around with a DD style of tanking, the
more I like it. (there is still nothing better than putting on all your defensive
gear and letting something that hits really hard smack you around though)

And I agree that Paladin meriting isn't finished. I am not sure if it is the new
areas or the boosts that Paladin received with the updates, but I have gotten
a ton of invites without lfg this past week. (I actually can't remember the last
time I was sent an invite before this past week O.o)