WHM + PLD 50-65. Constructive advise to a WHM.

[Dux]

Hi guys, looking to hone my skills as a WHM and need some tips from hate holders.

I am looking to optimise my Cures to ensure the PLD has as much hate as possible because as a WHM I have a problem. I will give you a quick desctiption of how I play first then my problem after. Any advice would be appreciated.

Typically I ensure the PLD is cured, in order of importance, by the following rules.

1) Out of Red/Yellow
2) Out of any nasty damage (Dimensional Death / Screwdriver, Jet Stream) range.
3) Haste PLD
4) PLD within 200 HP of full health.

Generally speaking the PLD has very little problems with holding hate under normal circumstances (DRK sometimes steals it but thats not my problem *cough {Penta-Thrust} cough*)

My problem comes when a particualrly nasty IT++ MOB AOE happens and everybody drops to yellow (or even worse Red). My prefered choice of cure is Curaga 2 (maybe with Divine Seal depending on how dire it is). In a DS+Curaga II scenario I am probably signing my own death warrant by casting it (Stoneskin + Blink will help save me alot by its not guaranteed).

So how can I help the PLD keep maximum hate without jeporadising his life or the entire teams?

[neelon]

Keep an eye out for the Paladin's MP count. From my experience, with casting Flash I can prevent more damage than by curing for that amount of MP. Just make sure you don't over-cure your Paladin in the beginning of the battle, otherwise the Paladin is fighting a lost cause against aggro.

Divine Seal - Curaga2 is very nasty to hold aggro against, even more if you have to do it early in the fight. If possible, try to repair the AOE damage with multiple healers.

Also how you look at the HP depends on the mob you are fighting. Scorpions can one-shot a Paladin with Death Sickle (or whatever it's called, it HURTS), same with that Black Mage type Anticans, and I am sure a whole lot more type of mobs.

About those Anticans, I had the dubious honour of having a taste of Burst. At least it was a quick and painless death.

[Lan'Urk]

If it comes down to having to DS+Curaga 2, run behind the PLD and ask him to cover you... Any well trained PLD know that if thats coming he will cover you, so your role is run behind him... that should buy enough time for everyone else blast the mob to death.

~Lanurk

[PaladinsArc]

If it comes down to having to DS+Curaga 2, run behind the PLD and ask him to cover you...

Depends on your PT layout. I always PT w/ my brother (DRK/THF) who uses Trick Attack + Guillotine every minute onto me. So a WHM can use DS+Curaga II whenever he wants. =)

-Arc

[Dux]

Originally posted by neelon
Divine Seal - Curaga2 is very nasty to hold aggro against, even more if you have to do it early in the fight. If possible, try to repair the AOE damage with multiple healers.

That can be easily arranged. Typically a good RDM will pick up the cures to support me anyway but you don't always have one.

Also how you look at the HP depends on the mob you are fighting. Scorpions can one-shot a Paladin with Death Sickle (or whatever it's called, it HURTS), same with that Black Mage type Anticans, and I am sure a whole lot more type of mobs.

I am not sure what you mean here. I can read that two different ways as a WHM.

1) Against Scroption etc etc etc keep PLD at highest possible HP just in case the killer attack goes off and he ?might? survive. This is a disaster for PLD + WHM mana due to crossed over heals left and right.

2) If death is inevitable against such an attack don't waste my mana keeping him at full health and just keep him just out of yellow. (Good for WHM mana not so good for PLD).

Can you please clarify what you mean for both situations.

Thanks

[Lan'Urk]

Originally posted by PaladinsArc

Depends on your PT layout. I always PT w/ my brother (DRK/THF) who uses Trick Attack + Guillotine every minute onto me. So a WHM can use DS+Curaga II whenever he wants. =)

-Arc

That holds true to a very specific set up, but I'm saying is that in a emergency case all the hate drawers should be aware of cover... if you think you might pull the aggro off run behind the PLD for cover... yeah you might not need, but its a good practice never the less...

~Lanurk

[Rico]

Plus it takes a while for Cover to reactive once again, when I have enough MP I'll throw a Cure IV. But what monsters your range do AoE's? The only one I know is Robber Crabs and Moss Eaters.

[Somajan]

Any well trained PLD know that if thats coming he will cover you, so your role is run behind him

Actually this is a big thing for all mages to do when casting a big spell like Curaga2 with DS or a perfect Ancient Magic Burst.

If the paladin is lacking in skill, remember to tell him to cover you. And make sure before battle that he's got cover macro'd

[neelon]

Originally posted by Dux



I am not sure what you mean here. I can read that two different ways as a WHM.

1) Against Scroption etc etc etc keep PLD at highest possible HP just in case the killer attack goes off and he ?might? survive. This is a disaster for PLD + WHM mana due to crossed over heals left and right.

2) If death is inevitable against such an attack don't waste my mana keeping him at full health and just keep him just out of yellow. (Good for WHM mana not so good for PLD).

Can you please clarify what you mean for both situations.

Thanks

What I meant is with some mobs it might be mandatory to keep the Paladin's health as high as possible. Death Scissors from a Scorpion (I think that's the attack), Silence Gas from an Exoray and Ancient Magic for black mage type Antican are what I have Experienced at first hand (with the latter 2 killing me once in a one-shot). Those were anything but pretty.

Downside when you need to keep the health at maximum is aggro holding might be a bit comprimised.

[TheBruce]

First, you should be partying with at least 1 and more likely two other jobs that can curaga. Blm, Brd, Rdm. So 3 regular curagas will boost everyones hp to full.

On agro, it depends on the paladin and how much mana they have, but whm should try to med in the beginning of the fight and let the pld do an initial cure III etc.

Doing skillchains without a /thf or thief its almost required that you give the pld room to throw in a cure III or even a cure IV. I found that with light renkeis and no /thf even a cure III wasn't adequate to keep full agro after the skillchain. Obviously it depends on the pld, but letting them throw in a 350+ cure IV to maintain agro will obviously keep the monster facing the right person.

If the pld is in the skillchain blindna and haste are essential or skillchains will always be too slow because everyone is waiting on the pld to get tp.

Basically the whm and paladin work as a team and if they work well exp will be efficient but if they don't work well exp will suffer. I always try to cure as much as possible so the whm will have little downtime after a chain 5. This obviously depends on the group dynamic and each group is different, but as a general rule keeping the whm's mana at good levels will always help exp.

[Zalius]

Newbie pld question, what does a Cover macro usually look like?

[Rico]

I do mines manually.

[Zalius]

what about /ja Cover <stpc>?

[Rico]

That works fine, just make sure to tell the person that you have covered

[Lan'Urk]

My cover macro goes as follows:

/ja Cover <st>
/wait 3
/p <lastst> Come behind me for cover! <call2>

I find the <st> very useful so I have the freedom to choose who to cover without altering the macro, and the last line just to make sure the person being covered knows what to do and that hes being covered.... I could probably use 2 lines for that macro but I really dont like spaming PT chat... so If its an emergency, I will probably be telling him to come behind me, throught normal talking, the macro is just to comfirm. Although when I use it in regular situations, the BLM already knows that he needs to come behind me and etc... I find more useful instruct PT members through normal talking, and passing orders than set phrases on macros, I use those just as confimation and whantnot.
hope this helps any.

~Lanurk