A Galka Monk/War or Sam/War

[Felron]

Well I'm going to start a new character in a different server and I just wanted to know what I should do. I loved being a monk in the game but got a little upset because there were no real adv. jobs I could take. But I didn't care that much because I love how much dmg monks do. I just like the idea of a samurai though. Can anyone tell me what is better? Also if you have any advice on being a different race than galka then please tell me. And also, I just want to be a melee dmging character, so I wouldn't want to change class just for better mp or something like that.

[sourjirou]

neither is better than the other in my opinion.
i think i ve seen a post on which does more dmg and they said in the long run monks will do more dmg. since monks get some uber weapon skills in the later lvls. of sam has its good points too. they r very versetile since ur gonna be a glka sam u can make a decent tank. i think sams r meant to assist other melee classes by being able to chain skill with jus about any type of element, and they get TP fast so they r always ready for the chain skill.

i personally am doin monk to lvl 60 then doin sam to 60

[TMPikachu]

warrior as a sub does absolutely nothing levels 1-29 for offensive players

(provoke is defensive)

exept for a passive attack up boost thingy.

Sam/mnk works up to 29, with TP store you use WS's faster, and boost is very handy for, well, boosting WS damage.

counter at lvl20 would also be nice for solo, or pullers, or when you do too much damage for the tank.

[sourjirou]

ummm... war is probably one of the best subs for all dmg dealers. a little tired to waste tie explainin. ill jus say this with war sub u get beserk,double attack, war cry, attack boost, provoke and def boost. although u won t be tankin provoke and def boost makes u a great back up tank if things go wrong like theres a link or pld dies in battle. alot better than standin around watchin the mob beat down all the mages

btw y the hell did u bother postin aboout warrior being a bad sub. this guy wants to kno which job to choose for is main.

damn im noticin more and more on this forums that theres always someone that likes to post totally off topic jus so they can complain.

[TMPikachu]

I'm saying that instead of sam/war, he could try out sam/mnk, there is nothing off topic about that. What would be off topic is your claims that my post was (which it isn't)

and berserk & double attack are lvl 30 and 50 respectively

if you read what I wrote, i said lvl1-29

30+, berserk and double attack are obviosly better than just boost
:spin:

[Frarinalga]

Just go samurai/warrior or monk/warrior. In several past parties ive been in, the leader would be looking for a melee, but wouldn't invite unless they had provoke. Most melee are able to tank under 30. It's stupid seeing a monk/dark knight or something like that. They can cast around 1 spell before resting, and they can't save the mages if aggro is lost. They're dead weight.

[sourjirou]

double attack is lvl 25 so u would earn it at lvl 50 so its not that far off. in the early lvls a sam can easily get away with tankin

the only benefits of sam/monk is focus. boost not too useful if u dont have chi blast helps ws a little beserk way better. dodge useless since u wont be voking or tanking. counter useful for soloin but usless in a party since u wont be voking or tankin. martial arts useless for a sam cause its for H2H. HP boost usless again cause u wont be voking or tanking. these skills r all meant to complement the monks and their H2H skills since they can sub war and voke incase of emergencies.

monks r pretty crappy as a sub unless u sub it with theif or war.

btw he didnt mention any thing about his sub so HA :p

[TMPikachu]

all of the offensive benefits of /war are level 30+
you're regurgitating everything I've already said, berserk is better than boost and dodge, that's obvious.
I could say provoke is 'wasted' on an offensive melee
that def boost I is wasted on an offensive melee.
and that /sam 'wastes' third eye
that would make it sound bad, but we all know /war is an exellent choice because it eventually gets you double attack and berserk

Monks are only horrible subjobs post lvl30, when the warrior job gives berserk. Before lvl30, you have boost, which is well, a small boost in power, best with weapon skills (the first katana WS is a two hitter, which doubly benefits from boost, and as samurais are also halfway decent with spears, double thrust is also a two hitter)

I'm sam/mnk right now, and doing dandy. The parties I've been always have tanks and backup tanks, I'm the damage dealer with TP store + boost. I plan to go /war at lvl30 for berserk, but untill then, /mnk's boost is carrying me on.



If you start as a warrior, level warrior to 18
level monk to 15
then at lvl 30war/mnk, get sam




Mnk/war is also a very strong combination
at level 51, you get warrior's double attack AND your kick attacks, meaning you could strike 4, and in increadibly lucky circumstances, 5 times a round.

[Frarinalga]

So let's see
pre-30
Sam/Mnk
Pros: A crappy boost that adds around 10 attack for one round. Total damage added from boost? 0-4, if you're lucky.
Cons: No Provoke. No defense. No additional offensive abilities till 50, unless you consider the crappy boost substantial at all. Martial Arts is useless, which is one of the main reasons you would sub monk. Hp boost not worthwhile, because you won't be drawing aggro.
Sam/War
Pros: Offers flexibility by being able to deal nice damage (store tp, samurai's natural offensive capabilities), and have a strong defense at lower level (able to wear most armor warriors/paladins can below 30, defense boost at 20, etc), and aggro management
Cons: subbed warrior doesn't add any offensive capabilities till 30

Pre-30, almost any melee can be an effective tank. Not including rangers, and thieves.
I've been in more parties that have samurai tanking than warriors. Most warriors in parties (pre-30) are inexperienced and can not handle aggro worth a damn. Samurai may even be more defensive than a warrior, with third eye at 15.

[TMPikachu]

noone ever subs monk for martial arts, if they wanted to use martial arts, they would do monk main.

"Cons: No Provoke. No defense. No additional offensive abilities till 50"



you even said yourself PRE 30. post 30 warrior is obviously better, I know that.

and you can boost before using a weapon skill, generally that's what most people use boost for.

you forgot the pro: Offers flexibility by being able to deal nice damage (store tp, samurai's natural offensive capabilities), and have a strong defense at lower level (able to wear most armor warriors/paladins can below 30, high vit and hp, counter at 20, etc)
(I know, no provoke.)

and you forgot the sam/war pro: Crappy att+ passive ability that might add 1 more damage


or just stack boost while your puller is pulling. With three or more stacked, I've been able to get a nice 15+ more damage off the bat (if I don't miss, elvaan :p) at lvl 12 against IT
And even so, that extra 4 damage is still better than nothing (the reason people buy +2 str rings or +attack equipment, those 'little' things gil is squandered on)

I'm not saying sam/mnk pre-30 will completely outshine sam/war
but it's a workable alternative.
I also play with my LS, which has a paladin and sam/war near my level, so I don't worry about backup tanking.

sam/war is probably more flexible for parties, but sam/mnk should not be completely discounted (pre-30, of course)

[Frarinalga]

Let me make this a bit more simple for you.
Sam/monk is worthless. All you get is boost. Big fucking woo.
Sam/war protects the group, offers so much more, offers aggro management, etc.
So do you want to be more useful to a party, or be a worthless pile of shit with your seek flag up for 3 hours?

[TMPikachu]

damn, that's harsh.

still think you're wrong tho'


The last party I was in had...
sam/war
pal/war
nin/war
myself
brd
whm

I don't think they needed me as backup tank.

SAM/WAR is still an exellent choice, I do not deny that. Having a backup tank is always nice. I just hope I'm not in a party where you need 4 tanks

On boost. If +attack equipment is worn, +10 attack with an ability every 15 seconds has to do something too.
You're a monk main, don't you ever boost before a weapon skill?


You know what's funny? We're arguing this on the monk board, this samurai sub debate on all things, the monk board.




*Sinten...
hmmm, I might have partied with you before ? :confused:

[Frarinalga]

Your subbed monk is good for ideal situations, where you have a good tank, and only one tank is needed. That is rarely the case below 30. You will run into many idiots who don't know how to manage aggro, or don't want to because they don't like getting hit. This is my case. In most parties I'm in, I become the main tank because the other tanks are incompetent and i'm the only one that can protect the mages. Most parties I'm in, I form, and I don't invite any melee that don't have war subbed (ranger and thief are exceptions, I don't expect them to take hits). And it is very easy to become picky when choosing a melee, there are usually at least 4 seeking, and with myself being one, there are 2-3 spots left for another melee. I just choose a melee with a proper sub that is adequately leveled. This is the general consensus with others I have partied with as well.
If you have partied with me, it would have had to been in the past month. This name is pretty new. I only party on weekends as well, weeks are too busy.

[TMPikachu]

In the past month, were you in Yhoater?
Or maybe I've just ran past you before, and the name stuck.

Yeah, sam/war would be a safer combo, especially in the dreaded Valkurm and Quifim, I see your view.

[Atis]

Somehow I knew you were Elvaan before even looking at your race TMPikachu.

Anycase Mnk doesn't offer SAM much up till level 29, at which point you will want to switch to warrior anyways for bezerk.

1-29 you would receive
1. Counter
2. Martial Arts
3. Boost

Thats it. Hp boost/dodge is level 15 monk so therefore level 30 Sam/mnk, at which point you'll want to go Sam/war anyways.

1. Counter - Useless to the SAM. As you do not have provoke or such, you won't be tanking.

2. Martial arts- No explanation needed

3. Boost - Lower levels does not provide much.

And we're done..

Warrior subbed would provide provoke for a backup tank. Samurai's can wear good armor, have excellent hp and high parry/evade for a reason after all.. If you got /mnk subbed, what you gonna do when the mob is pounding on your whm and the tank either used up his/her provoke or is dead?

In the case of having 3 other tanks besides you with provoke then yea, you can sub whatever you want.. however not only is it very rare to have so many in a group... but at higher levels your lucky to have 2-3 melee's in a group. *ie 1 tank 2 attk melee's. In which case you will still need a backup provoker.