Newbie instrument question

[Vilurum]

The only list I've found is for when each paeon improves, off a Japanese website. I'm not really in a position to test the accuracy of the numbers, of course.

Anyway, according to that website (http://bdbk.s41.xrea.com/verification/0002.html), you get:

Paeon I goes from 1 HP/tick to 2 HP/tick: singing + instrument skill sum >= 138
Paeon II goes from 2 HP/tick to 3 HP/tick: singing + instrument skill sum >= 194
Paeon III goes from 3 HP/tick to 4 HP/tick: singing + instrument skill sum >= 306
Paeon IV goes from 4 HP/tick to 5 HP/tick: singing + instrument skill sum >= 363

(Which, assuming you skill up both to cap, and aren't using skill+ equipment, means level 24, level 34, level 53, level 59, respectively.)

If the numbers are wrong, chew out the website I quoted. I'm not at all sure it should be taken as gospel, considering another one of their "verification" tests shows Earth Staff as having no effect on the resist rate of Elegy. I personally swear by the thing. (Well, now I swear by the HQ, but same point.)

Point is, of course, you're gonna be skilling up anyway, and your songs will gradually improve as you do so. If you like, whenever you level, you can keep track of how much your songs gave before, and how much they give now with your new higher skill total.

[lufia22]

Can you only cast two songs on an enemy before they start replacing each other or are enemies not like party members?

[{Pug}]

You can have a Threnody, an Elegy, a Requiem, and Finale the enemy and they won't overwrite eachother. But you can't put more than one of each on the mob at the same time (i.e. 2 Threnodies).

[RuneGrey]

Ah, thank you for the effect increase data on songs - this is pretty accurate, at least from my experience.

Another big question though - when does Ballad get a bonus effect, going beyond the usual 1 or 2 MP regenerated?

[Niland]

it doesnt

[_11of8]

Something to note as well regarding buff songs, i.e. etudes, madrigal, and minnuet. Similar to paeon, they will all max out at certain skill levels. When you ding to a level that gives you access to a stronger version, like from Valor Minuet I to Valor Minuet II, if you have max singing skill, Valor Minuet I will be slightly stronger then Valor Minuet II, at least for a short while. Once your singing skill improves, Valor Minuet II will become stronger.

This happened to me last night. I dinged 62 and switched to Bewitching Etude. It currently gives me 1 less CHR bonus then Enchanting Etude. Not a big deal, but something to keep in mind.

[Vilurum]

But rest assured that, in the end, the later songs are equal to or better than the earlier songs. Both sets of etudes now give +6 for me (+8 with HQ instrument). Every Minuet is better than the last, every Minne is better than the last, every Paeon is better than the last, etc.

When you first get them (well, the first few anyway), the high level etudes aren't worth using since they're actually weaker than the low level etudes for several levels. The same can be said about any new version of Minuet (or Minne, if you use it), but that generally is only true for 1-2 levels before the new song quickly passes the point where the old song was capped.

I wouldn't be surprised if less quantifiable songs - Madrigal, Mambo, March - are also as effective as, or less effective than, the earlier version they replace, at the level you first get them. Obviously they end up visibly better, but I wonder if the same rule might not apply to them too.

[lufia22]

Hmm...about Etudes. If they take the place of one of your normal songs, then why are they used? I guess just explain to me Etudes because I don't see the point in casting your main two songs just to replace it with an etude seconds later. I'm going off the fact that someone in this topic told me that etudes count as one of your two songs on a person...so the only way I find them useful is if they only target one person but from the way they sound, they sound like they're AoE songs.

[Quaerito]

so the only way I find them useful is if they only target one person but from the way they sound, they sound like they're AoE songs.

Well, yeah, by means of one of the recent patches, the lower level Etudes have been changed to single-target songs, which does in part explain the increase in prices of Rose Harp +1s.

As for why people would use Etudes, it's pretty much a judgment call. Most of the time, you'll find yourself singing Minuet+Madrigal or double Madrigal for your melees, and double Ballad for your mages. This works fine most of the time, but occasionally you may find a BLM who wants extra INT for that last crucial MB to end a chain 5, in which case you might want to be ready and sing BalladI, then BalladII, wait, then the appropriate Etude when TP has been sufficiently gathered to do the SC off which the BLM will MB. And also MNKs on gods will probably make you stack +MND Etudes for the boost to Chi Blast, their main weapon against gods.

Also, I've seen a BRD singing only Madrigal, Ballad and appropriate Etudes for the different jobs in an exp PT, but I don't know how well this works. I'd still stick with the standard fare.

[Lushipur]

on my statid i do:

run to mage:

ballad1
ballad2

target mob:

threnody
elegy

run to melee:

madrigal
minuet
(sometimes prelude on rgn or thf)

before sc:

etude on blm

repeat...

i really having an hard time to do all of this

[Laehn]

Etudes can be very useful in some situations. Often times in good parties ballad isnt so much of a necessity, and the extra int or what not can help a lot. I often use etudes when fighting NM's on myself to lessen the likeliness of my songs being resisted. Plus etudes make our job a little interesting and less monotaneous imo. I encourage you to play around with song combinations on different jobs and different characters, some might gain more from an etude than from another song. Theyre obviously there to be used in some situations. Even if they dont make a noticeable difference compared to another song, its nice to be able to mix up the songs a little.

Another thing, song bonuses on instruments can affect offensive songs like requiem lullaby elegy and finale. Im not sure if the other song instruments affect the potency of the songs but duration is a sure thing and i personally feel resists are fewer with the right instrument. +requiem instruments work the same way as +paeon instruments. The monster will lose HP in greater amounts every 3 secs with a +requiem instrument. Like i said, im not sure about the other bonus instruments in this case, but im positive of the requiem ones.

[Kibagami]

I'm very new to the BRD job but ive played around with every job in the game and have an idea of who needs what and when. Single target etudes are a great change for xp parties. There are 3 jobs i think get the most benefit of this: 1) BLM for MB, no doubt the first thing you would think of. 2) THF for SATA, now SATA when done well is a no miss attack that is modified by DEX and AGi. I think that i'll try using +DEX and +AGi songs on THF just b4 SATA WS when i get to that lvl. 3) RNG, now i don't know if you can stack both +RNG ACC songs on one player, but if you can't then you could use + AGI and +ranged ACC on them.
I don't know if later on using the +VIT on a pld tank would be a good idea. +STR song on a DRK/THF that closes a SC is a good idea too.

About the +Requiem instruments. Yesterday i had a party in korroloka tunel and 3 worms linked to the melees and killed them (our party was 1 THF, 1 WAR/RNG, 1 BLM and Me). Our BLM was out of mp so what i did was i used Soul Voice and then used Requiem with my flute+1 and ran as far as posible without losing sight of the worm i casted on. Then i casted Paeon I and II on me just in case. To my surprise the worm died fast. I mean you could see it's hp drop as if it was getting hit constantly. And it was an IT. Dunno how much diff it would have been if i had used an instrument without +1 Requiem. Btw i was lvl 16 so no requiem 2.

At the moment i posted this my BRD is lvl 18.

[Schozie]

I find myself feeling slightly downheartened when I get a blm asking for INT + ballad instead of double ballad. Theres only been a few that have done it since 50, but in ym experience i've found it to be the ones who nuke too much (blizzard 2 as pull is coming in!?!?) and also nuke to try and kill it whenever they get agro. You know the sort.... They always end up with no MP as well, which is mainly because theyre inefficient obviously, but the ballad would have helped.
I find myself occasionally giving INT etude right before SC, if i'm really not doing anything else. I usually try to if theyre using freeze as well, just because its got a long casting time so its easy to throw the etude in.

As far as dex/agi for thf, i havent had much experience with this actually creating much of a difference, never had a thf say how much its improved their SATA when i've done it, and never had a thf ask for it. So i'd put this at the bottom of your list of priorities. I find myself not usually having any spare time at all between pulls anyway so I dont usually bother. (by the time i've refreshed ballads next pull is in)

[lufia22]

I dunno about THF. At my level, the etudes are only giving about +4, so unless that gets a lot better, I don't think DEX/AGL Etudes for THF would be very useful compared to an ATK song. I would also think it would be kind of hard to time it right before they SCed. You'd have to be keeping a close eye on the log. As for RNG, is the AGL etude good for them? I was thinking you could possibly get them to stand aside for a minute while you cast +Ranged Accuracy song on them. It would seem to work in theory but since I don't have the song yet I wouldn't know first hand.

Anyways, since this topic was bumped, I'll ask some more questions:

1.) Is it hard to camp mary's horn? I'm debating on plopping all my money down on it or not...I really hate camping NMs but if it's an easy drop then I might just take my THF/BST combo out there and hunt it. God knows Monster Signa is a really rare drop.

2.) I have a question about charisma and its effect on how long a song stays. Does it determine how long a songs stays by the CHR you have when you cast that song? Or, lets say I start out casting a song and then raise my CHR after the song is cast, will that effect how long the song I just played before raising my CHR will last? In other words, does CHR only take place as you play a song or is it always present?

3.) What are the standard melee songs? I just got Valor Minuet II and on easier enemies I tend to cast Valor Minuet I and II rather than the accuracy song because on easy enemies they already have decent accuracy. However, I'm wondering about harder enemies. Is the accuracy song a pretty standard song all the way up until 75 or does it become one of those songs you only use if your PT is missing? The reason I ask is because the song that makes my PT attack faster is just around the corner, and I'm debating on whether or not that should replace my accuracy song or not. So what are typically the standard melee songs?

[Kibagami]

Well about the THF SATA issue. I thougt about since not so long ago every THF would use the Lust Dagger+Greed Scimitar combo which gave them +7 DEX and +7 AGI. Which they stoped using cuase of them not being good weapons overall. Even if your etudes just give them +4DEX and +4AGI then that's a prety good increment. Dunno would have to test if it's better to leave them madrigal and minuet or change to etudes.