an idea: job synergy. tell me what you think

[Armando]

Re: an idea: job synergy. tell me what you think

Speaking of underused subs, one of the things that greatly disappointed me about DRG is that they can't remove themselves from a battle temporarily 'til Level 50. It really would've been good for both the main and sub's versatility if the Lv.10 Jump removed you from the battle for 3-4 seconds.

[Ziero]

Re: an idea: job synergy. tell me what you think

WAR/MNK Synergy FTW!!!!!!!!!! (J/K but I miss WAR/MNK)

Don't we all. If I could survive as a /mnk as long as I do as /nin, I would never sub that job again...unless I'm sneaking around places.

NINs that sub DRK are retarded, it's that simple. That is so fucking stupid it doesn't even warrant an explanation, you are insulting me by even mentioning NIN/DRK. BLU is a sidegrade from WHM sub for DRGs, and usually when you're in a DRG PT you want to have /WHM anyway incase someone dies. SAM subbing RNG is stupid as well, they aren't going to hit anything with an archery cap of 230 vs RNG's 276 not to mention sidewinder is already inaccurate as is.

I have all of those jobs at 75, so you're going to need to try alot harder, you can't BS me.

...everything you just said there is so painfully wrong. Nin/Drk is one of the highest hate jobs in game, while at the same time increasing their melee Dmg output for even more hate. Drg/Blu has far better self buffs and much more low MP, quick casting, Healing Breath Triggering spells then Whm. It also gets some nice bonus stat boosts and even a trait or two with the proper set-ups. And Sam/Rng is an excessively popular Exp pt set up...when geared correctly. Things just explode when a well played Sam/Rng gets involved.

If you seriously have all of those jobs at 75 and don't know this...I think you better start reading up on how things work.

p.s. Thf can sub /Drk too on HNMs and high def mobs to help make up for it's low Dmg hits by increasing it's spike damage even moreso then usual. Plus stun works on most mobs, including HNMs, even while subbed (a boost to Nin/Drk as well)but you knew that...right?

In the end, subs are situational. And almost every job has a situation where it makes a good sub. These things aren't supposed to be 100% interchangeble and never will be, but almost every job has it's use as a sub.

[Raydeus]

Re: an idea: job synergy. tell me what you think

It really would've been good for both the main and sub's versatility if the Lv.10 Jump removed you from the battle for 3-4 seconds.

Who do you think you are, Kain?

But yeah, you are right, XI's DRG Jump has always bugged me. It needs to do double dmg and remove you from battle for 1 turn (which in XI would probably vary depending on your weapon's delay), otherwise what's the point.



PS > DRG is the only unlocked job I still have at lvl 1. With all Aht Urgan jobs still lvl0

[Durahansolo]

Re: an idea: job synergy. tell me what you think

With all Aht Urgan jobs still lvl0

That's how my BRD, SMN, PUP, and SCH are and I'm pretty sure I still have 1 or 2 more that I haven't unlocked yet.

[Ziero]

Re: an idea: job synergy. tell me what you think

Only job I haven't unlocked yet is Sch...and that's cause I'm cheap and lazy. Cheap, because I don't want to pay for the quest items and lazy because I don't feel like rearranging my inventory to start crafting the quest items.

[Armando]

Re: an idea: job synergy. tell me what you think

I haven't unlocked quite a couple of jobs out of laziness. DRK, BRD, DNC, SCH, PUP.

[Silversky]

Re: an idea: job synergy. tell me what you think

one of the main points of this thread wasnt to debate the current usefullness or uselessness of job/sub job combinations, it was to present ideas for new ones.

more specifically, it was to introduce opportunities where certain jobs could sub another job that they would never THINK of subbing.

for example, when would a DNC sub BRD? never. ever ever ever. but at the same time, with the suggestion i had, maybe they might. and i dont think it would completely overtake the /NIN or the /SAM, but it would provide an entirely unique subbing situation.

similarly, a SMN should hardly, if ever sub BLM. but if they could use it, it would be interesting, and provide an alternative, not necessarily a replacement.

perhaps my suggestions aren't perfect in the specifics, but the intent remains: that some unique, possibly thematic combinations be explored to provide alternatives. i know there has been increased variability in subjob options, but there are still combinations that would NEVER happen, and it would be interesting to see if they might. like, would you ever see DRK/PLD? probably not. maybe in like ONE circumstance, but maybe the combination could be given a little bit more mainstream usage.

similarly, jobs that have very specific, situational subjob options could be given more mainstream use with these ideas.

[meSchnitzel]

Re: an idea: job synergy. tell me what you think

one of the main points of this thread wasnt to debate the current usefullness or uselessness of job/sub job combinations, it was to present ideas for new ones.

more specifically, it was to introduce opportunities where certain jobs could sub another job that they would never THINK of subbing.

for example, when would a DNC sub BRD? never. ever ever ever. but at the same time, with the suggestion i had, maybe they might. and i dont think it would completely overtake the /NIN or the /SAM, but it would provide an entirely unique subbing situation.

similarly, a SMN should hardly, if ever sub BLM. but if they could use it, it would be interesting, and provide an alternative, not necessarily a replacement.

perhaps my suggestions aren't perfect in the specifics, but the intent remains: that some unique, possibly thematic combinations be explored to provide alternatives. i know there has been increased variability in subjob options, but there are still combinations that would NEVER happen, and it would be interesting to see if they might. like, would you ever see DRK/PLD? probably not. maybe in like ONE circumstance, but maybe the combination could be given a little bit more mainstream usage.

similarly, jobs that have very specific, situational subjob options could be given more mainstream use with these ideas.

You say that you dont want to talk about the current bonuses from subbing different jobs, however in order to talk about unused subs you need to know their current uses.

I would say that any changes, even slight changes, like the ones that you are talking about would indeed create even MORE cookie-cutter players. If a bonus to one job outshines all the others then people are going to flock to it. Especially mix/max players.

As it is right now just about every sub is completely situational.

An example would be me playing DNC the other day. I was level 24 and saw every other dancer
using /nin so i tried it. After about an hour I decided that I didn't like it all so I started playing with different subs. /rng helped my acc and let me equip towards damage, so that was nice. /drg helped with damage and TP gain (very little) from jump. /thf was of no use yet, perhaps at 30 ill use it to land quicksteps easier with SA. /blu was awesome, it gave me beast killer and cocoon as well as some awesome stat boosts, w/ refresh from FoV i never had to rest for MP since I was using so little. /war was boring, as all it did was give me another provoke, but i could see it upping my damage and defense at or after 30. I settled on /drg and really am liking it (and yes now i know that it is actually a popular choice for this level... i didnt know that before i tried it though)

I do this with about every job and I find what suits me. SE doesnt need to change/add any aspects of specific jobs as subs, its the general outlook of the players that needs to be modified. If people would just open then eyes and realize that you dont always have to sub /nin you would be surprised how interesting things could get!

[Ziero]

Re: an idea: job synergy. tell me what you think

one of the main points of this thread wasnt to debate the current usefullness or uselessness of job/sub job combinations, it was to present ideas for new ones.

more specifically, it was to introduce opportunities where certain jobs could sub another job that they would never THINK of subbing.

for example, when would a DNC sub BRD? never. ever ever ever. but at the same time, with the suggestion i had, maybe they might. and i dont think it would completely overtake the /NIN or the /SAM, but it would provide an entirely unique subbing situation.

similarly, a SMN should hardly, if ever sub BLM. but if they could use it, it would be interesting, and provide an alternative, not necessarily a replacement.

perhaps my suggestions aren't perfect in the specifics, but the intent remains: that some unique, possibly thematic combinations be explored to provide alternatives. i know there has been increased variability in subjob options, but there are still combinations that would NEVER happen, and it would be interesting to see if they might. like, would you ever see DRK/PLD? probably not. maybe in like ONE circumstance, but maybe the combination could be given a little bit more mainstream usage.

similarly, jobs that have very specific, situational subjob options could be given more mainstream use with these ideas.

The issue with this is that you'd just be trading one cookie cutter for another. I understand the concept and desire to create "thematic" main/sub combos, but in the end it just creates more of the same. Unless all jobs gave special bonuses to all other jobs when subbed, where all of them serve some sort of specific benefit, then this new idea wouldn't be too different then the current status quo. As long as each job has 2-4 specific subs it can make use of for different situations, then really that's all that would be needed for a nice balance in this game. Which, to be honest, is pretty close to what we have now.

The only main issue is that single jobs shine a bit too brightly (nin) for exceedingly specific reasons (utsu). And while SE did manage to shake things up a bit, it's still not a totally perfect balance.

[Lmnop]

Re: an idea: job synergy. tell me what you think

I have all of those jobs at 75, so you're going to need to try alot harder, you can't BS me.

I won't attack anything you say. Just please don't use this argument.

The only person I've ever met who truly knows this game only has one level 75 job. A well trained monkey could get a maat's cap if he has the time and patience (and likely a PL).

[Raydeus]

Re: an idea: job synergy. tell me what you think

There's a reason you have to practice Kendo with a shinai or a bokken for years before you are even allowed to touch a Katana.

And everyone knows what happens if you try to skip steps in your training...

[Durahansolo]

Re: an idea: job synergy. tell me what you think

And everyone knows what happens if you try to skip steps in your training...

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NdWVMR6m_hc&feature=related"]YouTube - Ninja Fail[/ame]

^^This?

I feel bad for the guy that missed the dummy @0:30 and also the dude that got defeated by the apple.

[Raydeus]

Re: an idea: job synergy. tell me what you think




On the bright side at least he didn't cut his own ear off.


PS > Put Afro ninja back.

[Durahansolo]

Re: an idea: job synergy. tell me what you think

PS > Put Afro ninja back too.

I took it down because that clip is in the montage of the other clip lol. @0:50

[Raydeus]

Re: an idea: job synergy. tell me what you think

I completely missed it. XD




Note to self: Watch the entire thing twice before posting.