Can you change drop rate for rare/ex items to 100%

[Malacite]

Re: Can you change drop rate for rare/ex items to 100%

Actually, the mob with the most retarded pop conditions, imo, is King Vinegarroon - 21-24 hour spawn, but will only pop if there is double earth weather, maybe single earth weather. No earth weather, it may pop next time there is. Now that's SE!

Not FFXI related, but ever try getting a pink tail from the Pink Puff in FFIV? Son of a bitch that was frustrating.


Yeah, SE has made a tonne of ridiculous quests as you pointed out BBQ, but those were all in offline titles with very little replay value. There's no really good reason for that in an MMO other than shits and giggles or for the sake of giving some stupidly hardcore people an unrealistic goal.


To draw a parallel, FFXI = Real World America right now. Founded on the idea that everyone has a shot in life to achieve their dreams, as much or as little as they want. But in reality that isn't the case anymore. The reality is not everyone has a fair shot at some of the better things, either due to their own schedules, RMT, money, what have you. Granted, SE can't really be god and make a perfect world, but they can at least try.

[Kirsteena]

Re: Can you change drop rate for rare/ex items to 100%

True - I've tried for Noble Mold before - and regretted it.

[eticket109]

Re: Can you change drop rate for rare/ex items to 100%

Actually, the mob with the most retarded pop conditions, imo, is King Vinegarroon - 21-24 hour spawn, but will only pop if there is double earth weather, maybe single earth weather. No earth weather, it may pop next time there is. Now that's SE!

I stand by Stubborn Dredvodd and Noble Mold as more screwed up then that. The tough spot with KV in comparison is that he isn't soloable like the others.

[Omgwtfbbqkitten]

Re: Can you change drop rate for rare/ex items to 100%

Sorry, but not quite. SE makes totally random stuff with insane requirements for the sake of those that want to do that.

They do the same in FFXI. You don't *HAVE* to get these items, despite what many uninformed idiots say. However if you *WANT* to and are the type of person that enjoys these types of things, they exist.

I think the problem is people only want the "best" so they crybitch about it until SE does something just because they did it on a few things in the past.

Ulli's 21-24 hour spawn was ultimately proven to be flawed design because RMT exploited it. Same with Eastern Shadow, more or less. The thing was that they botted and whored themselves on these NMs for sellable drops, one of which led to one of the most desired R/E in the game.

SE removed the sale factor from Ulli's drop, so while the Autumnstones are still sellable, they're now also easier (well, if you consider a senseless farming grind "easier") to obtain. Byakko's Haidate is just as random a drop as ever and he's simply not that challenging any more, so why should that be 100% just because you had the triggers?

ES's flaw was that Eurytos' Bow was sellable as well, but the combination of moving the original Bow to BCNM and replacing the original with an R/E version of the bow both serve to retain some value to the original bow while both remain rather rare. If you want an adequate bow nearly on par with those, you can get one for the price of a few Sandorian Carrots and a few hours of effort. I call that a deal, especially consdiering there are moments Selene Bow outshines V/E-Bow, as rare as those situations may be.

Speed Belt, Peacock Charm, Emperor's Hairpin, Leaping Boots, Strider Boots, Eurytos Bow... all this stuff has a R/E equivelant on NM, the originals have been moved to a BCNM and some of it even has pop NM equivalent or Assault gear comprable that's sometimes better than the original piece. Its hard for me to look at something like Chivalrous Chain and still think Peacock charm is better for a melee, especially with things like Jaridah, Pahluwan, Hauby and other gear out there now, both new and old.

People are just lazy in that they want the best all-in-one piece for no work.

If beastmen or kindred seals are hard to come by for your job, that's understandable, but I don't have much sympathy for it when you're able to level a soloable job that will allow you to get them. I'd love to be COR and RNG all the time, but if I want seals independantly of my Taru's BST, I have to have something soloable on my Mithra as well.

Sometimes you just have to look at the big picture for your character, not just what you want.

[Kirsteena]

Re: Can you change drop rate for rare/ex items to 100%

Actually, the mob with the most retarded pop conditions, imo, is King Vinegarroon - 21-24 hour spawn, but will only pop if there is double earth weather, maybe single earth weather. No earth weather, it may pop next time there is. Now that's SE!

[Mhurron]

Re: Can you change drop rate for rare/ex items to 100%

SE just makes some shit totally random for the sake of stuff being seemingly rare.

Sorry, but not quite. SE makes totally random stuff with insane requirements for the sake of those that want to do that.

They do the same in FFXI. You don't *HAVE* to get these items, despite what many uninformed idiots say. However if you *WANT* to and are the type of person that enjoys these types of things, they exist.

[Omgwtfbbqkitten]

Re: Can you change drop rate for rare/ex items to 100%

Bull. Going back to the classic FF's, there was always ample reward for everything you did (Frustrating as some of those sidequests or monsters were, like the Queen of Cards quest for Nemesis Weapon).

Those were epic battles. From what I've heard of sky etc, these HNMs, while tough, are regularly brought down. AV is the closest thing to an epic mob in the game, and has insane rewards if they drop.

I'd like see more mobs along that line (though not quite as insane ^^;) with very good drops (and a decent drop rate) but the challenge should be extremely high, be it the mob itself, the surrounding area, or what have you.

Basically, make a real adventure out of it. You gather the people to do it, set out on some epic quest, and at least a few people get enough out of it to warrant doing it again or for others.


IMO, SE has crossed the line between Rare and obscene.

Should I point out the utterly ridiculous requirements you had to meet to get Excalibur for Steiner in FFIX? Yunaleska in FFX? Yeah, you didn't beat that one without the guide, the internet or a friend's help. The treasure chest trickery in FFVI and FFXII? The fact that to get 100% done and the mascot dressphere in FFX-2, you had to play the game multiple times or follow the guide to the letter the first time through? In FFX, you're forced to endure broke-ass blitzball if you want Wakka's ultimate weapon? The Lunar Ruins in FFIV Advance? Ugh don't get me started on that one.

Where was the challenge vs. reward in all of that? How am I supposed to even know the criteria for those chests in FFVI and FFXII without a guide? That's some bullshit right there, check a chest now and screw yourself out of an ultimate weapon later! Granted I expect that to happen now in other FFs because of FFVI, but that doesn't make it rational design and has nothing to do with challenge or reward.

SE just makes some shit totally random for the sake of stuff being seemingly rare. You either accept thier crazy ways of doing things sometimes or you don't get what you want, ever. As far as the games go, it makes them worth replaying to experiment and see what you missed, but its not exactly what I call normal .

I can cry and cry that Gilgamesh doesn't just drop Genji armor in FFXII, but no, I have to go back and steal it if I really want it. Meaning I have to rewrite my Gambits... AGAIN!

This is madness.

This is Square-Enix.

[Mhurron]

Re: Can you change drop rate for rare/ex items to 100%

You honestly believe the rewards are balanced for time/effort spent?

I think not.

It doesn't matter what you think except to yourself. Reward to work ratio is going to be different for every person.

If it's worth it to you, go out and do it, if not don't. It's that simple.

[Sevv]

Re: Can you change drop rate for rare/ex items to 100%

Wall o'text 2.0

If a mob can only spawn during a window of every 24 hours and has a chance, but not guaranteed, to spawn ... that is retarded. Especially if the item rewarded is not something game-breaking (or "the best of the best there is")

It pops between 16-32 hours. Not 24 and then it doesn't spawn.

http://wiki.ffxiclopedia.org/Eastern_Shadow

Think about it ... if every server has 5,000 players ... and even if only 1/5 of those players were so inclined to camp that item, that would be 1,000 players.
Out of the 1,000 players that really want it ... the % that would actually bother to camp plummets greatly ... due to the fact that not everyone has that kind of stupid time on their hands to camp an NM with that kind of spawn behavior.
Usually kids on their school break, people who are unemployed (but not really forced to be employed to get through in life) or physically disabled people who can't conveniently leave their homes will have this kind of time to devote to camping an NM.

The auction house and you can buy it, if you want the r/e version spend the time, this goes for any r/e vs sellable drop.

But, reading SE's disclaimer of how it is not recommended that people devote large amounts of time to this game ... can you explain to me, then, how you encourage players to not spend large amounts of their life into a game and yet expect them to do so anyway to get a particular item that they might desire for a particular job (Not necessarily usable by all jobs)

They don't tell you not to spend large amounts of time in this game they tell you to not forget friends, family, school, work.

NM camping takes a particular mindset and its rare that I'm focused enough to achieve it, but even I can reach that point sometimes. The first thing you do is bring another constructive task with you so you're not just wasting your time standing there.
You come to camp and if its a PH mob, you kill of those first PHs and time the respawn. Let's say you have a 16 respawn mob. Great, that means if you know and monitor the times in between, you have 15 minutes to do other things and 1 minute to prepare for the next spawn. Do math homework, read a book, write a novel, play your PSP or DS, fix a fast meal, anything.
Window spawns are not really much different, just no placeholders usually, but sometimes there still are. If the NM respawns on a fixed timer, your only real concern is competition.

All very good ideas, don't forget clean your room, work out, spend time with family, anything.

HNM camping is another matter, fuck that shit, I got better things to do with three hours of my day and camp crap that offers my jobs nothing. HNM camping is all about windows and having lots of warm bodies for claim. You don't need 40+ people to kill an HNM, you just need lots of people to improve chances of claim.

True but also on the 3 hr thing, this is a window for alot of nms, smirugh which benefits your rng for instance. You have 14 min of time you are active in that 3hrs.

You mean like Thief's Knife? Good.
Destroying the value of Thief's Knife was one of the best things SE has done recently (item-related, at least). Sucks to be the guy who bought it the day before the update, but the game as a whole is better off for the change.
I went 1/shitload on Ose (and that doesn't count several multi-hour solo camping sessions where I didn't even get the bastard to pop), but if they made AJ 100% tomorrow I'd cheer.

Thief knife was never considered the best thf weapon in the game (damage wise), it was a item for people to say my th better then yours! (well by 1% lol)

Despite 100% drop rate, the effort involved in obtaining an Ohat, Uggalepih Pendant, Tatami Shield or Galliard Trousers is nontrivial, to say the least. I think those items are the right model and low drop rates/horrible uncontrollable pop conditions are the wrong model. The item in question being sellable exacerbates, but does not create, the problem; thus introducing the rare/ex equivalents has alleviated the problems but not fixed them.

O hat can be killed with 6-7 people if you are players who have faught it before and have exp -playing with each other.

Uggalepih Pendant is not 100% unless you have a hq, which alot of people don't use. http://wiki.ffxiclopedia.org/Golden-Tongued_Culberry

Tatami Shield is also not 100% unless you have a hq, http://wiki.ffxiclopedia.org/Gration

I wish SE wasn't so damn reluctant to retrofit their old content after they invent better solutions. Many, many old NMs deserve the Ullikummi treatment. Practically everyone except RMT loves what they did to Ulli. So why aren't they doing it more, to all the other NMs everyone complains about? I just don't get their reluctance to do something that is clearly a good idea and would obviously be hugely popular. Are there really that many people who would quit in a huff because their epeen got nerfed when someone else got Ebow/Valis? (If so, why don't they have Yoichinoyumi already if it matters that much to them to be ahead of the Joneses?)

Giving everyone every item in the game with little to no work, makes everything about accomplishment and hard work nothing. This is FFXI a multi player game, you won't have everything in the game like in the single player games, you work hard in those leveling up etc, the difference here is that in the online game you can't gameshark your items you just want.

Being a great player is not about what gear you can get, but what you can do with it. Difficult fights, not insane pop conditions, are the true test of playing ability.

Not to argue here about this, I just wonder what is a difficult fight in your opinion.

P.S. My old static killed Mysticmaker at around 50 IIRC - several times, because more than one of us needed it. But it's rare to find 6 people willing to do the fight together instead of asking a 75 or two to kill him.

And you all still friends right? You camped for each other pulling your static together, granted some people wanted to level up more but you were there for each other, man low drop rates hurt.

waaaa waaaa waaaa i want i want i want but i'm not willing to do what it takes to get it.

Hell This comes from a kid who has very low play time, still telling him to quit his job >.>. He wants a joyeuse, he doesn't complain ofcourse we were mad it didn't pop sunday, but we will be there again sunday working on a joy again till he gets it. Still kind a$$holish the way you posted tho mhurron >.>

You honestly believe the rewards are balanced for time/effort spent?
I think not. No one's asking for hand outs here, just fairness. The greater the risk, the greater the reward, not spend a billion hours getting one item (*cough* Relic *cough)
That disclaimer at the POL menu is a joke.

Malacite, if you go by drop rate they are. The drop rates aren't bad for most items in the game, but they have no "memory" so its not assured to drop unless it is 100%. It comes down to personal luck Malacite, if it had memory and say it was 10%, you could always claim 9/10 days never get drop and the one time you miss it would drop. If you look at it once it would drop, the next 9 claims will not drop. Ya relic isn't hard if you can make gil, level all crafting mules and bamn you can be on last stage, only to find out gungir blows hard core.

Bull. Going back to the classic FF's, there was always ample reward for everything you did (Frustrating as some of those sidequests or monsters were, like the Queen of Cards quest for Nemesis Weapon).
Those were epic battles. From what I've heard of sky etc, these HNMs, while tough, are regularly brought down. AV is the closest thing to an epic mob in the game, and has insane rewards if they drop.

Kings at one time were epic, as well as alot of the mobs considered jokes now. Hell kirin kill was amazing when it first happened, now its so common no one cares, if they hadn't nerfed the way and ban people for wall trapping av, it would be common place by now.

I'd like see more mobs along that line (though not quite as insane ^^;) with very good drops (and a decent drop rate) but the challenge should be extremely high, be it the mob itself, the surrounding area, or what have you.
Basically, make a real adventure out of it. You gather the people to do it, set out on some epic quest, and at least a few people get enough out of it to warrant doing it again or for others.
IMO, SE has crossed the line between Rare and obscene.

This is the only thing with a semi-bitchy surronding area: http://wiki.ffxiclopedia.org/Khimaira

Everything is a real adventure for people the first few times, and then it becomes common place. Like in all games you have an epic quest that is like wow O.O but when you play alone you don't have people beating you too it or saying how easy it is. First kill of anything is epic and given alot of respect, kings are still exicting for people on their first kill. Sky for people who just got it fighting their first god as they are so happy they finally killed a god and love it. Anything no matter how epic it is becomes common place in a MMO.

[Omgwtfbbqkitten]

Re: Can you change drop rate for rare/ex items to 100%

That reminds me of the old days of PSOv1 DC where you had nothing but 'common rares' drop every five minutes from mobs.

PSO was a dupe-fest. There were no rares after the first three months. Anyone could have a Lavis Cannon if they knew a duper. That's what killed the game for me.

And Sega never did anything about it.

At least PSO Ep. III didn't have that problem. You could hack the best deck of cards, but you couldn't hack the dice generator, so a skilled player with a basic deck could still toast your ass.

[Malacite]

Re: Can you change drop rate for rare/ex items to 100%

You see, when they call something rare, that means its supposed to be rare. If everyone could get the rare, then nothing would be special about rares and no one would want rares. They would be "normals," not "rares."

As it stands, rares from HNMs basically say "I stood in this zone longer then you did and had 40 people to claim." Where's the challenge in that? And even if the HNM was a real challenge, why should that determine the reward? Should be reward enough to say you beat the damn thing if it was truely hard, because that's all most people are going to walk away with, not a reward.

You don't have, so you complain. You complain because you think the time spent does warrant a reward.

That's not how the real world works, why should a game be any different? Because you pay to play? Should you get #1 High-Score on Pac-Man because you pumped Quarters into the machine and stood there long enough?

Bull. Going back to the classic FF's, there was always ample reward for everything you did (Frustrating as some of those sidequests or monsters were, like the Queen of Cards quest for Nemesis Weapon).

Those were epic battles. From what I've heard of sky etc, these HNMs, while tough, are regularly brought down. AV is the closest thing to an epic mob in the game, and has insane rewards if they drop.

I'd like see more mobs along that line (though not quite as insane ^^;) with very good drops (and a decent drop rate) but the challenge should be extremely high, be it the mob itself, the surrounding area, or what have you.

Basically, make a real adventure out of it. You gather the people to do it, set out on some epic quest, and at least a few people get enough out of it to warrant doing it again or for others.


IMO, SE has crossed the line between Rare and obscene.

[Dymlos]

Re: Can you change drop rate for rare/ex items to 100%

You see, when they call something rare, that means its supposed to be rare. If everyone could get the rare, then nothing would be special about rares and no one would want rares. They would be "normals," not "rares."

That reminds me of the old days of PSOv1 DC where you had nothing but 'common rares' drop every five minutes from mobs.

[Omgwtfbbqkitten]

Re: Can you change drop rate for rare/ex items to 100%

You honestly believe the rewards are balanced for time/effort spent?

I think not. No one's asking for hand outs here, just fairness. The greater the risk, the greater the reward, not spend a billion hours getting one item (*cough* Relic *cough)

That disclaimer at the POL menu is a joke.

You see, when they call something rare, that means its supposed to be rare. If everyone could get the rare, then nothing would be special about rares and no one would want rares. They would be "normals," not "rares."

As it stands, rares from HNMs basically say "I stood in this zone longer then you did and had 40 people to claim." Where's the challenge in that? And even if the HNM was a real challenge, why should that determine the reward? Should be reward enough to say you beat the damn thing if it was truely hard, because that's all most people are going to walk away with, not a reward.

You don't have, so you complain. You complain because you think the time spent does warrant a reward.

That's not how the real world works, why should a game be any different? Because you pay to play? Should you get #1 High-Score on Pac-Man because you pumped Quarters into the machine and stood there long enough?

There are tons of things in this game where if you invest the time, there's an eventual reward for doing so and there are challenges within them. Limbus, Assault, Crafting, Ranking Up, Completing Quest/Mission storyarchs, Levelling up, etc.

And people deserve those rewards, why should the rest of the game be handed to them?

[Dymlos]

Re: Can you change drop rate for rare/ex items to 100%

Damn, I really didn't expect to jump from R/EXs to another different matter. oO Yesh. Luckily I have my Sbow (alot easier to grab than Vbow) but it would be nice if SE couild at least change the spawn times for Eastern Shadow to make it more reasonable. -_-. Apparently that's too much to ask. :x

[Malacite]

Re: Can you change drop rate for rare/ex items to 100%

You honestly believe the rewards are balanced for time/effort spent?

I think not. No one's asking for hand outs here, just fairness. The greater the risk, the greater the reward, not spend a billion hours getting one item (*cough* Relic *cough)

That disclaimer at the POL menu is a joke.