No Provoke

[Jei]

Re: No Provoke

FF12's Decoy is an interesting alternative to provoke imo. Probably make sense if it's castable by PLD or some support jobs.

[Likibiki]

Re: No Provoke

You'd think that DD would realise they needed to balance DEF and ATK.

But... they don't.

They're not that smart. I still see humes and taru running around in level 30 RSE in the new zones, others wearing level 50 gear because of the stat bonuses, then they complain when they get hit for way more than I can handle.

Here's a tip - don't wear gear that gets you hit for >200 every 3 seconds, when I only have Cure 3. Because... you'll die. Often.

[Omni]

Re: No Provoke

You'd think that, wouldn't you...

lol what?

[Jugil]

Re: No Provoke

I think we'd see even more burn parties if Provoke didn't exist. Pure offensive mentality: kill it before it kills you.

[Vyuru]

Re: No Provoke

In a world without provoke, I'd think people would sub more of the oddball stuff to help support the party, I could see drk/whm for instance, especially on aspirable stuff, probably more drg/mage.

Or else they'd go the easy route and grab 2x tanks and a thief, tanks stand on opposite sides of the mob and thf just alternates SATA between them until level 60, then you could easily get by with one tank.

Yeah you could have a melee grab hate for SATA back onto tank, but in most situations, and especially with reduced hate control, it'd make the tank's job a bit harder.

[eticket109]

Re: No Provoke

See, people keep telling me that PLD can tank as /NIN at endgame - but I refuse to believe it.

I was speaking more of HNM type stuff then exp. I would think in most exp situations, pld/war would be best, but like Omni was saying a well-prepared pld/nin could be very viable against amnesia mobs.

Though thinking about it... sj on amnesia doesn't matter in regards to voke anyway. If a pld gets hit with amnesia they don't have 'voke regardless of what they subbed.

[Likibiki]

Re: No Provoke

The melee jobs would gear balance between DD and Def? And no more IT mob hunting.

You'd think that, wouldn't you...

[Celeal]

Re: No Provoke

No provoke would result in no solo tank? The melee jobs would gear balance between DD and Def? And no more IT mob hunting.

[Omni]

Re: No Provoke

And if the PLD gets amnesia, and he's the only one with voke? You're still screwed.

Actually pld is the job i trust the most to tank stuff that uses amnesia. If a ninja gets amnesia and doesnt have hate already then yea, youre screwed.

If a pld has amnesia, no prob. drop a flash and a cure III on himself/someone.

Silence is heck of alot easier to counter than amnesia.

[Likibiki]

Re: No Provoke

See, people keep telling me that PLD can tank as /NIN at endgame - but I refuse to believe it.

I've partied with so many parties of PLD's, SAM's, DRG's, whatever - a party without Provoke, basically.

Either my avatars or myself end up tanking.

And if the PLD gets amnesia, and he's the only one with voke? You're still screwed.

People just assume that /NIN = fast exp. For them, maybe. For the poor healer spamming Cures on the stupid melee who get hate and have no way of getting it taken from them... not so much. Because hate will go onto us, and we will die because you can't take it back.

[eticket109]

Re: No Provoke

Its viable in endgame to tank as pld/nin without voke... that would be one heck of a rough road getting to that point without it though. lol

[Omni]

Re: No Provoke

nin/brd and nin/drk for uber hate sustaining abilties. :D though, it would make nin dd-less however.

probably pld ftw. lots of hate grabbing abilties. though, not till 37. cure bombing grabs hate but takes time to build up.
war wouldnt have anything to grab hate with.

ping pong the hate ball?
like nukapai said, hehe a lot of blm wouldnt make it past 20.

[Nukapai]

Re: No Provoke

BLM would never get past level 20. :p

Ooooor you'd end up with Mana-burn parties at early levels (which, incidentally, is something I tried at around level 14-18 and it wasn't half bad).

[little ninja]

Re: No Provoke

Actually we had this discussion in shell. At first i think S.E would have given Warriors some form of a hate trait, or hidden feature that caused war to be main focus of parties. When pld came out. thats when i think a provoke type job ability would have been introduced.

[little ninja]

Re: No Provoke

Actually we had this discussion in shell. At first i think S.E would have given Warriors some form of a hate trait, or hidden feature that caused war to be main focus of parties. When pld came out. thats when i think a provoke type job ability would have been introduced.