Why the new claim system P***es me off greatly.

[Taskmage]

Re: Why the new claim system P***es me off greatly.

No person A was someone in the other party of the alliance.

Basically, Shikigami weapon was aggroed by a SMN of ours, who was in a different party in the alliance. Cort, our RNG used Shadowbind on it (low hate), and two seconds later, it was voked by another LS.

Double Post Edited:
Which is another bug, just not one that obviously contradicts the patch notes. Two parties in an alliance shouldn't have to compete with eachother for claim any more than two people in the same party should interfere with the other's ability to claim.

[Tsikuro]

Re: Why the new claim system P***es me off greatly.

I still don't see a bug =/
Common knowledge that "provoke" is the most powerful hate taking tool that actually targets a monster... well, except maybe Eagle Eye Shot, which is all I can think of off the top of my head, but it's not instant (saying 'hate taking that targets the mob', because of other abilities that are worth a lot of enmity but do not cause the mob to attack you like benediction, and invincible if it's not already attacking you), so he got claim from using it. Shadowbind is nowhere near equal the enmity of provoke...

As for Lasswyn, I don't even know what the hell you're talking about =/

[Spinnthrift]

Re: Why the new claim system P***es me off greatly.

Ok... the bug is that - his alliance has aggro, he does something which should by all rights claim the mob, but - because the system counts his own alliance (team) against him, he doesn't get claim. No one else had interfered with the mob until after it should have been claimed by the alliance.

[Lasswyn]

Re: Why the new claim system P***es me off greatly.

Fine. Sorry I spoke. I won't bother you again.

*leaves*

[Spinnthrift]

Re: Why the new claim system P***es me off greatly.

Lasswyn - it's true that hate decreases both over time and when the mob hits you - your understanding of the rules regarding hate in this respect are correct.

Basically - if you do something aggressive against a mob - you get claim... dia, provoke, shadowbind, ancient magic, attacking with a weapon, steal, mug, etc...

So long as the mob is uncontested...

When the mob is contested - it's a battle of aggressive enmity, meaning you have to make the mob hate you more by doing damage/provoking/shadowbinding etc to it, until one party/player/alliance has claim... the *problem* comes from... having your alliance/party count against you for claiming.

Take Goblin Smithy, he's a nasty sort - he's stabbing your friend in the face with a knife. You want to hurt him, so you do something nasty to him - like stabbing him with your own knife. Your mate - is now curing himself to try and heal the face wounds but because you're creating less emnity that your ally is creating - no one gets claim, because your ally who has the most hate is generating more non-aggressive hate than you're creating aggressive hate. You're both fighting him, and he's taking damage - but you don't have claim... even though you're both on the same team (alliance).

Someone else who we'll affectionately call Mr Rude Gilbuyer and friends walk up and voke the mob out from under you - as provoke is a massive hate spike, and you lose your claim on Goblin Smithy.

Even though you've done enough to gain aggro on it, the system makes it counterproductive to claim/fight - and a Warrior with enough +Emn can still force an MPK by spiking hate, and taking a hit or two, then watching the mob go back to where it was.

The system is broken unfortunately, and you don't need to hide under a sofa. Really. That's reserved for Dr Who and Buck Rogers!

- Saeriel

[Tsikuro]

Re: Why the new claim system P***es me off greatly.

Alright, so here's what happened:

Someone in your party aggros Shikigami weapon. At this point, this person could have HIT the monster and gotten the claim, but, not knowing the new rules, (probably because of some reading disability) that if someone other than the person that aggro'd the monster hit it, it will go unclaimed for a set amount of time, allowing other people to draw more hate, the RNG uses shadowbind.

Now, the monster is 'up for grabs' (though for a very short amount of time) because of his mistake.

LS 'B' runs along, provokes the mob, drawing MORE hate [because your LS didn't bother to do anything else to beat a potential threat].

LS 'B' gets the claim.

You go online, very angry, naturally, and explain to everyone that your gameplay has been hindered by a horrible bug/glitch.

[Kailea]

Re: Why the new claim system P***es me off greatly.

this could have been solved by just haveing one PT in the alliance consintraite on claiming hate, and then you would of had claim. Maybe there is a small glitch when it comes to alliances, but other then that there is nothign wrong with the system.

oh yeah and I have Dyslexia (who spelled it right) so the insults are very anoying, and I do not "hump SE's leg" I enjopy the games I play, and dont treat it like a compition. Forgive me for treating this game like a *gasp* game.......

oh and in referance to my "SE loveing", I have common courtousy toNOT sit there and insult a company that is allowing me to play a very awsome game.

[Taskmage]

Re: Why the new claim system P***es me off greatly.

So if nothing else we have determined that there is a bug in the claiming system that forces allied players to compete with eachother for hate, and because of differing rates of enmity decay, players can still be attacked and killed by mobs that are claimed by another player, which was the very issue the change was supposed to fix. There are also issues with enmity caused by pets and a loophole in the new system that can cause nobody to get claim before a mob dies, resulting in no exp or presumably drops. So as we've been saying repeatedly, the new code is not successful in preventing the MPK issues it was designed to counteract while introducing other secondary issues that have a negative impact on the game.

I consider it common courtesy to let people know when they are doing something wrong so they don't continue to embarass themselves or otherwise cause trouble for themselves. Considering I've been getting paid to do this for years, it would seem to me that game companies appreciate this behavior. Meanwhile, I haven't gotten a red cent for holding my tongue and extolling the virtues of a game while ignoring its flaws.

[little ninja]

Re: Why the new claim system P***es me off greatly.

dunno i think the hate system is broke as well. just the other night i couldnt voke a imp with +40 eminity from another pt who aggroed him. you wouldnt think aggro would produce more hate then a voking +40 eminity ninja. not to mention their puller was /nin. an shadows are suppose to reduce eminity. yeah i can pull hate from a pld, when first comming into a kirin fight. but i cant pull hate from an aggroed mob that nobody has done nothing to is ghetto. an broke. call it a stupid glitch. that still means its broke.

FYI granny says its broken an it freakin sucks. well then ITS BROKEN AN IT FREAKIN SUCKS BELIEVE IT!!!!!

[Rodin]

Re: Why the new claim system P***es me off greatly.

Okay, small Update:

Onijiro finally got his robe. We got it for him yesterday. Funny part was, we claimed with CHARM. Shadowbind produces more hate than Charm, yet yesterday, we charmed the damn thing and it was claimed.

Pics soon to come.

[Taskmage]

Re: Why the new claim system P***es me off greatly.

Was Charm used by someone that was in the same party as the person who got the aggro/link?

[Rodin]

Re: Why the new claim system P***es me off greatly.

Pace (Beastmaster) used Cure III on himself, got aggro, then charmed, for the claim.

Edit: Got the pic of Oni getting his robe, but none of Pace claiming with Charm.