How newbie friendly is RDM?

[skeeterlite]

Title really says it all, how friendly is the RDM class to a new player? I understand they are costly to fund overtime, but if a new player were to just get the key spells and get the others as time/gil permitted, is the RDM going to be ok money-wise ona new person? I initially started out on a WHM kick cause i like the support role but was introduced to the support arsenal of the RDM. Can heal, and cast refresh(mana crack! for those from EQ back in the day), but the real seller to me was the debuffing that RDM's do. The hidden art of tearing an enemy apart, without doing any damage yourself! I know RDM's can do damage, but you get what I am saying

That said, I'd like to keep playing the class as a main as long as I can know that gil shouldnt be a huge issue.

Thanks for the advice.

[Lejar]

Title really says it all, how friendly is the RDM class to a new player? I understand they are costly to fund overtime, but if a new player were to just get the key spells and get the others as time/gil permitted, is the RDM going to be ok money-wise ona new person? I initially started out on a WHM kick cause i like the support role but was introduced to the support arsenal of the RDM. Can heal, and cast refresh(mana crack! for those from EQ back in the day), but the real seller to me was the debuffing that RDM's do. The hidden art of tearing an enemy apart, without doing any damage yourself! I know RDM's can do damage, but you get what I am saying

That said, I'd like to keep playing the class as a main as long as I can know that gil shouldnt be a huge issue.

Thanks for the advice.

Rdm is a very beginner friendly class. Since you'll level in parties you will be getting crystals and other items to sell on the AH which will get you enough money for spells/equipment. (If not you could always farm bees or something.) Just some side information, though... debuffing, healing and refreshing all in the same fight is a little much but you probably have a ways to go until you get to 42 so you'll have time to figure out how to do it well.

[Feenicks]

I know that since you've posted this, you have another thread on these boards about starting out, and someone has told you that RDM is expensive. I have no idea why this person has told you that because RDM is comparatively inexpensive compared to most other jobs. You don't have to buy tools or ammo, and most mage gear is cheaper than melee gear and doesn't have to be updated as often.

As far as the actual playing of RDM goes, it's relatively smooth sailing until Lv40+, when you suddenly become one of the busiest jobs in the game. Think of it as an exercise in learning good play techniques.

[Omgwtfbbqkitten]

RDM requires a bit of dedication to subjob levelling, at first this means levelling BLM and WHM to complement it, but down the road it also means levelling several other subjobs such as DRK, SCH, NIN and others to really tap the full potential of the job.

If you prefer just be a typical mage and nothing more, RDM stays fairly inexpensive, but if you're wanting to go all out and persue every angle of the job fully, then it can get about as expensive as the average melee job.

Its all in how you wish to play it.

[Malacite]

I wouldn't say RDM is very beginner friendly at all because of it's wide range of abilities. Plus the job undergoes a rather dramatic shift at 40/41, so you may wish to start off with say WAR and then try either WHM or BLM a bit to get a feel for RDM.


RDM will not melee much outside of Valkurm Dunes/Qufim Island, but it's still better to get a perspective on melee from a melee class.


Now, go ahead and try RDM right off the bat if you want, no one can stop you and it's all about having fun. But RDM is a very busy job the higher you get in levels as and I said, it's role steadily changes as you go from 1-41.

[Ryoii/Nonomii]

Is a new player able to competently perform RDM's role in XP parties on the way to Lv75? Yes, especially one willing to research a little online and ask other RDM's questions.

Is a new player capable of completely maximizing all of RDM's capabilities on the way to Lv75? Probably not.

How can I keep RDM simple?
Focus on the main needs of the party:
Enfeebles including Dispel, cures, Refresh, and Haste

(Learn to perform your tasks through macros. Glad you're already planning to get a controller. I found the Saitek controllers last longer.)
(Elemental magic spells are secondary, but you will need to raise your skill for your Lv70 battle against Maat.)

How can I keep my costs down?
Focus on a subset of gear:
MND for maximizing white magic based enfeebles and cures, MP gear for convert, and elemental staffs at Lv51

(You'll need to learn to swap gear in macros starting at Lv40. You can mostly ignore melee and INT gear.)

What makes RDM more complicated and expensive?
Maximzing all of RDM's capabilies takes a variety of subjobs, the raising of many skills, an investment in tons of different sets of gear, and many sets of macros for all of the different setups.

[IfritnoItazura]

RDM will not melee much outside of Valkurm Dunes/Qufim Island, but it's still better to get a perspective on melee from a melee class.

I would say assume not to melee is the better idea for a beginner RDM, especially in a balanced party with a proper front line (damage dealers and tank). Look at some of the typical targets in the early levels:

- Hill Lizard:
- - Plague Breath: poison; prevents resting
- - Fireball: AoE fire damage.
- - Baleful Gaze: Petrification (gaze attack)
Instead of eating unnecessary damage from Fireball, possibly getting poisoned or petrified, a RDM in normal party should be in the back line, enfeebling and helping to cure the front line.

- Goblins: (Ambusher, Butcher, etc.)
- - Bomb Toss: AoE fire damage.
Again, instead of taking unnecessary damage, should be in the back line.

- Snipper:
- - Scissor Guard: 100% increase to (the crab's) defense
When a Valkurm Dunes crab pops up Scissor Guard, melee fighters will hit for 0's and 1's most of the time. This is when those INT gear and elemental magic spells come in handy; nuke it down, so it doesn't take 5 minutes to kill. Even if the Snipper also has Bubble Curtain (shell; 50% damage cut) on as well, a party is almost always better off with the RDM help nuking. And, to nuke, the RDM needs MP--which is only recoverable by resting (and juice, but I don't expect beginners to have that). Can't heal (rest) while meleeing, so better in the back line than front line.

- Land Worm: (Korroloka Tunnel)
- - Sound Vaccum: Silence (prevents casting).
- - MP Absorption: Steals MP.
It also has two different AoE attacks. All of its TP moves are short ranged, so a RDM can dodge them all just by staying in the back line.

- Beach Pugil:
- - Screwdriver: Critical damage
If a tank is doing his job, shouldn't get hit by that. But, Pugils have bunch of AoE and cone attacks, so the front line needs extra curing, and the Screwdriver can really hit tanks hard--yet more curing.

- Damselfly:
- - Cursed Sphere: AoE Darkness damage
- - Venum: Cone AoE water damage and poison
The flies can really spam the Cursed Sphere; again, it's better not to take damage and help with curing. Getting poisoned really sucks for a mage, since it prevents healing for MP. One can bring Antidotes, but it's expensive for newbies. A White Mage in party who has Poisona can fix it, but not all newbie WHMs have all spells--and not all parties have a WHM.

Anyway, do keep a level appropriate sword (and maybe a dagger) and a shield around; need them for soloing. In parties, however, put the sword away, equip a wand with MND+ and INT+, and cast spells from the back.

If the party is awash in curing power and MP, then can consider moving up front to swing weapon. Otherwise, the back line should be the default place for Red Mages.

* * *

To address the OP, I would say, "No, it's not terribly newbie friendly."

Not that Red Mage is comparable to rocket science, but it takes a good understanding of the monsters and fairly good grasp of the game mechanism to perform well as a Red Mage. (I see seasoned players switching to low level RDM and tossing both Dia and Bio at critters thinking they would stack. Bleh.) A Red Mage also need to develop a sharp sense of situational awareness--when is it helping the party more to melee, and when is it far better than hang in the back? Should nuke, or conserve MP?

It's a hybrid job which seemingly is able to do everything yet not to excel at anything, and that just makes it a bit more complicated than what a new player needs. If you really want to play a RDM, I would say go for it, but keep in mind there's a lot of learn. (It is actually a very fun job--very busy at higher levels, but I truly enjoy it.) Otherwise, I would suggest a more focused jobs such as White Mage (healer) or Monk (damage dealer) to start one's FFXI experience with.

[Lunaryn]

Eh, RDM melee potential is high enough in the levels specified that I'd say you may well be called upon to provide either a front-line or back-line role depending on the party makeup. Dunes parties in particular tend to be best with an abundance of healing abilities, and you have subless members to worry about (keep in mind subless BLMs cannot assist in healing at all; they are purely offensive), so mage-heavy parties are actually pretty common when there are the seekers for that approach. Be prepared to melee or to go pure support depending on the party makeup. Get your Enspells on time, especially Enthunder at 17, if you want to be bringing good melee support to a group at early levels.

I'd say RDM is probably the easiest job to level to 10 subless, and one of the easier to take to 18 subless, though take care that parties don't try to get you to main-heal before level 14. You get access to a lot of the better low-level armor, can use most swords, get a nice Def-down/DoT enfeeble right from level 1, Cure at 3.

That said, the job gets increasingly more complex as you get higher level. The early 40s will probably be make or break as far as whether you think you're up to using RDM as a main job. The good news is that it's quite a valuable subjob to a number of other jobs, such as WHM, BLM, PLD, SCH, or even some more unusual combos.

[skeeterlite]

Is a new player able to competently perform RDM's role in XP parties on the way to Lv75? Yes, especially one willing to research a little online and ask other RDM's questions.

Is a new player capable of completely maximizing all of RDM's capabilities on the way to Lv75? Probably not.

How can I keep RDM simple?
Focus on the main needs of the party:
Enfeebles including Dispel, cures, Refresh, and Haste

(Learn to perform your tasks through macros. Glad you're already planning to get a controller. I found the Saitek controllers last longer.)
(Elemental magic spells are secondary, but you will need to raise your skill for your Lv70 battle against Maat.)

How can I keep my costs down?
Focus on a subset of gear:
MND for maximizing white magic based enfeebles and cures, MP gear for convert, and elemental staffs at Lv51

(You'll need to learn to swap gear in macros starting at Lv40. You can mostly ignore melee and INT gear.)

What makes RDM more complicated and expensive?
Maximzing all of RDM's capabilies takes a variety of subjobs, the raising of many skills, an investment in tons of different sets of gear, and many sets of macros for all of the different setups.

That was pulled from a guide. yes? I've read a lot and not all of it is sticking yet. I've read 3 guides here on the forums and ffxiclopedia so far.
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As for many of the other replies, thank you very much. I am definitely aware of the evolving complexity of the RDM as it is leveled up, and that's a big reason why I am enjoying it so much right now. I personally don't like to be a person that just has a few things to do in the party. I like being overly involved, if that makes any sense? I'm certainly keeping my eyes open and learning different things as I go along, though I am only lvl 9 so far. I'm hoping I can get a dunes group soon, but haven't seen much action anywhere yet, in the 1-9 range.

[Ryoii/Nonomii]

No, not from a guide. Just my way of simplifying the job and making it seem less demanding to a new player while acknowledging the extensive possibilities it provides. The job will certainly keep you busy and engaged in a party.

The game allows for making things much more complicated once you've played for a while and learned more. I'm currently leveling RDM on my second character so that I can try playing it differently in the lower levels (/DNC, /WAR, /DRG, /DRK, /NIN). RDM/DRG did the most damage until Lv30. RDM/DNC works nicely in small parties. RDM/WAR is a great tank when none are available. RDM/NIN helps with pulling, but I don't think I'll use it until Lv41+. Currently my RDM is Lv37, and I'm leveling DRK to work on elemental and dark magic skills.

[IfritnoItazura]

I am definitely aware of the evolving complexity of the RDM as it is leveled up, and that's a big reason why I am enjoying it so much right now. I personally don't like to be a person that just has a few things to do in the party. I like being overly involved, if that makes any sense?

Makes perfect sense to me. In that case, I wholeheartedly encourage you to continue on with Red Mage.

[The Mauva Syndicate]

The thing with RDM in the mid levels is - as has been said here a gajillion times - RDM is one of the most situational jobs in this very situational game, If you need to be on the frontlines, there are many spells you can apply only to yourself which will compensate for RDM's lacking melee skills (of course, by 30 the entire buff series can consume nearly a third of your available MP in one fell swoop depending on your gears/race/sub) being back line frees up a lot of MP by keeping from having to throw all of those spells. At the same time, when you do throw them you can effectively hit the monster - especially if you keep your weapons skills leveled.

I duo A LOT and we find that in duo situations you can combine less than optimal subs - ones you wouldnt want to bring to a larger party - so as to provide the needed survivability to the duo (one of us is almost always WHM main, for example, but with maybe a WAR sub for the emergency provoke and the extra HP).
In the end tho, SOMEBODY has to kill the monster, RDM can do it pretty well, by themselves, or in a small group. Like BRD (swiftly becoming my new favorite job) it can also make a party BETTER at killing the mob, without actually hitting it once.

Its situational