Post your opinions on the new RNG changes

[peacemaker]

Square needs to do something about the nerfs with the next patch, both RNG and NIN. Even though as a Paladin I had never been very fond of Ninjas, there is still a difference between balancing jobs and killing off two jobs with one patch.

[neighbortaru]

There is no skill involved. Finding the sweet spot is not a challenge and even then won't help you enough. Rngs are the new dragon.

LOL. It's not that bad is it?

[Caspian]

LOL. It's not that bad is it?

I screwed around with it quite a bit, but in all honesty finding the sweet spot took all of 3 shots...its roughly 7-10 steps away with bow. I xp'd last night on funnel bats which I had been xp'ing on before the patch. Only a few were IT (and that was barely, one more lvl and they'd be VT). I did the same dmg on those bats from the sweet spot, but if it anything is any higher than barely IT my dmg would drop like a brick. Roughly 30% minimum. Yes, I know they said in the update it would do this, but it said the difference in dmg on higher lvl mobs wouldnt be as much as it was for melee. This is obviously not true (had both a war/mnk and mnk/war outdmging me the last two nights, not by much but some). What bothers me is that we are still forced to spend atleast 6k a stack of arrows (use over 10 a lvl right now) just to do mediocre dmg now. Like I said, its just depressing now.

[Xyphere]

In my opinion, the "sweet spot" idea should be kept, BUT the range, or area of it should be increased. You have to admit though, RNG was overpowered. RNG needed a nerf but not to this extent. If you seriously want change, send hate mail to SE about it and something will be done seeing as how everyone and their grandmother is a RNG nowadays. I'll probably send one because I wanted to use /RNG in Ballista heh. But making all these complaint threads won't help but fuel your anger and make yourselves more stressed XD. For now just try to cope.

[poweryoga]

send hate mail to SE about it and something will be done

I giggled.

[TenTako]

what do you think is going to happen to people with ranger subs? (sam/rng, nin/rng for shuriken, etc)? Do these changes apply to subs aswell?

[Caspian]

In my opinion, the "sweet spot" idea should be kept, BUT the range, or area of it should be increased. You have to admit though, RNG was overpowered. RNG needed a nerf but not to this extent. If you seriously want change, send hate mail to SE about it and something will be done seeing as how everyone and their grandmother is a RNG nowadays. I'll probably send one because I wanted to use /RNG in Ballista heh. But making all these complaint threads won't help but fuel your anger and make yourselves more stressed XD. For now just try to cope.

I can see why ppl thought RNG needed a bit of a nerf. However, the one we got flat out sucks. I think I could deal with most of the dmg (though I'm getting outdmg'd some now by war/mnk's and such on occasion and that sucks) but probably the worst is the accuracy nerf that they never mentioned. All SE said was that it would be toned down some from long distances. Ive actually missed some with +40 something r. acc chomping on sole sushi and with sharpshot up. Everyone keeps saying its making everyone's ranged accuracy more the same. Thing is I have two accuracy up effects as well as a lot more +ranged accuracy than really any melee has +acc. If they would just give me back my accuracy (and maybe a little dmg on anything higher than IT, which has severely bottomed out) I would be a lot less pissed.

[Nodachi]

I think the accuracy 'nerf' was a bit harsh but aside from that it's not worth all the numerous complaints. All it means is BRDs will hate RNG PTs even more now cause instead of being able to slack off and do double minuet, they have to focus on preludes again. If you find the right spot, have enough acc, the damage is fine. The 'nerf' was a bit drastic i agree, but still very playable.

I for one like the 'nerf' because i began to get sick of so many cookie cutter IGE sellouts who buy all the best gear and sit back while hitting alt + D or whatever your shoot setup is. After EN release Ranger went from least played melee to second most played advanced job on my server (second only to NIN). Ranger lost it's class, appeal, dignity and many other things since EN release, to me anyway. And those who stick with RNG even after this update may regain my respect i once had for the job.

Double Post Edited:

what do you think is going to happen to people with ranger subs? (sam/rng, nin/rng for shuriken, etc)? Do these changes apply to subs aswell?

It pretty much destroys that setup. If my knowledge is correct. If the 'nerf' effects sub jobs as well, it wont' work well at all. It may help ACC issues but the damage from the ranged attack will be so weak it won't be worth the time and money.

[SeeD Soldier]

All it means is Ranger has to deal with the problems melee have to. They may not be exactly the same but similar. RNG always had very high accuracy and now they are on par with other melee. I believe they mainly made it so RNG actually now has to be a RNG. Most games require to use a bow you have to be at long range and not close up. Now RNGs have to watch their hate, because if they get hate the monster will walk from the tank to them (I guess they like BLMs now). Its a nerf but in a few weeks the true RNGs will keep at it and be almost as powerful as they were before.

[Icemage]

I think the accuracy 'nerf' was a bit harsh but aside from that it's not worth all the numerous complaints. All it means is BRDs will hate RNG PTs even more now cause instead of being able to slack off and do double minuet, they have to focus on preludes again. If you find the right spot, have enough acc, the damage is fine. The 'nerf' was a bit drastic i agree, but still very playable.

I for one like the 'nerf' because i began to get sick of so many cookie cutter IGE sellouts who buy all the best gear and sit back while hitting alt + D or whatever your shoot setup is. After EN release Ranger went from least played melee to second most played advanced job on my server (second only to NIN). Ranger lost it's class, appeal, dignity and many other things since EN release, to me anyway. And those who stick with RNG even after this update may regain my respect i once had for the job.

Very well put Nodachi. I posted it elsewhere, but I think a lot of the Johnny-come-lately RNGs do not realize what the RNG job used to be like. I still think S-E overnerfed the damage very slightly (emphasis on the word 'very'), or at least should have made the cost to play RNG less onerous, but maybe those changes will come with time. I've had a chance to look at several RNG in various situations now. Their damage is down, but when they're standing in a good spot for what they're trying to do, they still deal decent damage with good accuracy, just like any other melee, except for the fact that they get to shoot from several paces away.


Icemage

[peacemaker]

The fact that they HAVE TO stand several paces away messes up the entire party dynamics, and can potentially screw up renkei, which is a problem none of the other melee jobs has. If you play a mage job, you probably won't notice much difference, but if you play a melee job and is invoved in renkei, such as the tank, THF, or /THF, no one appreciates the mob moving around all over the place and everyone have to move with it or their TP go to waste. And if you have two RNG in pt, the second one in renkei will have to move away to do his WS due to the new distance ratio because even the weakened Sidewinder will still get enough hate to move the mob to the 1st RNG when he WS. And if there is a BRD in PT, unless he sings it well ahead of time, the 2nd RNGs is probably going to miss getting Minuet because he has to move to the opposite side to WS. The THF nerf way back when only made things a little more specific and there was no actual nerf in damage, but the RNG nerf went way beyond that - its fine that they adjusted the exp gap dmg, but the distance thing is really unnecessary and it screws things up for not just the RNG, but for all the other melees and renkei in PT.

[Icemage]

The fact that they HAVE TO stand several paces away messes up the entire party dynamics, and can potentially screw up renkei, which is a problem none of the other melee jobs has. If you play a mage job, you probably won't notice much difference, but if you play a melee job and is invoved in renkei, such as the tank, THF, or /THF, no one appreciates the mob moving around all over the place and everyone have to move with it or their TP go to waste. And if you have two RNG in pt, the second one in renkei will have to move away to do his WS due to the new distance ratio because even the weakened Sidewinder will still get enough hate to move the mob to the 1st RNG when he WS. And if there is a BRD in PT, unless he sings it well ahead of time, the 2nd RNGs is probably going to miss getting Minuet because he has to move to the opposite side to WS. The THF nerf way back when only made things a little more specific and there was no actual nerf in damage, but the RNG nerf went way beyond that - its fine that they adjusted the exp gap dmg, but the distance thing is really unnecessary and it screws things up for not just the RNG, but for all the other melees and renkei in PT.

This sort of complaint reminds me greatly of the outcry that buzzed around when Sneak Attack was changed (something which nerfed thieves MUCH more than this change nerfs Rangers, incidentally).

So basically you're saying that a RNG who can't control his hate level is going to pull aggro, move the mob and screw up a skillchain.

Sure, it's going to make it harder for THF and /THF melees to skillchain. But they will adapt, or RNG will learn how to control their enmity so the mob doesn't beeline for them on a WS.. or heaven forbid that the tank follow the monster and the THF or /THF do so as well. It's 2-3 steps, people, not the Boston Marathon. This is not an insurmountable obstacle.

Does it make RNG weaker in a party dynamic viewpoint? Sure.
Will sucky players not be able to deal with this? Probably.
Should that matter to anyone who knows what they're doing? Probably not.

This change raises the bar for required skill when in a party, but many people have complained that combat is too easy. Well, now melees might actually have to think about what they're doing now. Horrors.


Icemage

[Jei]

Well if rangers don't pull aggro on WS imo it destroys the whole point of having a Thf or /Thf closing the skillchain : / The way out probably is for rangers to go up close before WS? But I also heard slugshots doing 200-300 damage at close range which again can't turn the mobs around. Shadow bind > WS > run up close? Will this work?

[Icemage]

Well if rangers don't pull aggro on WS imo it destroys the whole point of having a Thf or /Thf closing the skillchain : / The way out probably is for rangers to go up close before WS? But I also heard slugshots doing 200-300 damage at close range which again can't turn the mobs around. Shadow bind > WS > run up close? Will this work?

No. Any damage will break Shadowbind.

Only way to do it is to back up, WS, let the monster come to you, and have the tank and THF or /THF reposition before closing the renkei.


Icemage

[kuu]

Same problem as a /thf sub and thf/nin in the same pt.

The fact that it makes rangers harder, is an indirected balanced issue. the ranger mentality of "HA I can do it and you can't nya nya" is whiped.

It takes skill now then simply shoot off and wait for SATA. Now rangers have to play the russian roll-et game equivalent of Provoke +Berserk + WS = maybe turning it, and face its wrath.

Does it hurt, yea, but it's suppose to hurt.