[Yuanlung]

You are assuming the tank has MP to cure himself, which may not always be the case. Ture, it really doesn't matter at all if you are just comparing normal exp when you are fighting simple things that barely make people use half of their character's potential.

The differences, however, shows through when you need to stretch it to the very limit. It happens more often in stuff like BC, quest NM, missions, North land Dynamis, HNM and stuff like that. The difference, again, is not huge, but it's there.


As for your example, tank isn't always PLD. NIN can be put in a difficult spot when a mob does a shadow widing triple or Aoe, and follow up with something nasty. The size of your Hp bar does come in play here. Even PLD can find himself in a tight spot, Silencing Gas, for example, does decent damage while stops you from casting. While a good WHM will likely bring your out of this, a mediocre WHM, which is more common place, might have let a PLD with smaller HP bar die if he was in the middle of doing something, such as recasting a regen.

[dirtyclown]

A new player isn't going to be doing HNMs, BCs or Dynamis for a great deal of time. By the time they get to that level they'll have an idea of what conclusions to draw based on their experience. You've made good points, but as you said yourself, in normal exp conditions these things do not matter. And that's what matters for this discussion, because it applies directly to the OP.

Originally Posted by Yuanlung

You are assuming the tank has MP to cure himself, which may not always be the case.

Yes I assumed, it was more or less a 50/50 shot. I was just comparing two different races of the same job. It also just happens to be my job of choice. >.>

As for your example, tank isn't always PLD. NIN can be put in a difficult spot when a mob does a shadow widing triple or Aoe, and follow up with something nasty. The size of your Hp bar does come in play here. Even PLD can find himself in a tight spot, Silencing Gas, for example, does decent damage while stops you from casting. While a good WHM will likely bring your out of this, a mediocre WHM, which is more common place, might have let a PLD with smaller HP bar die if he was in the middle of doing something, such as recasting a regen.

In my experience, Ninjas seem to pretty much spin a roulette wheel when their shadows are down. They either get lucky or they eat floor. A spider is just as good at killing a Taru Ninja as a Galka Ninja. I've seen both get owned by a double crit + Sickle Slash, same applies for Paladins. There's alot of "Oh shi-!" situations when you're playing that you can't do anything about, and your chosen race isn't a factor. The game will kill you just as ruthlessly either way. For situations like your example, the tank needs to rely on their own personal skill or the vigilance of their party members. A well placed Shield Bash can go a long way to saving your ass.

[Yuanlung]

Originally Posted by dirtyclown

A new player isn't going to be doing HNMs, BCs or Dynamis for a great deal of time.

A new player also won't have all the hawt stat-balancing gears either. The racial difference actually are quite evident in lower levels. Also THANKS to SE (I need a /scarcastic tag), many of the CoP mission BC's can be done pretty early in the game now.


Also, that's even more reason to start thinking about the right race for them now, because I've seen a good number of people regret their race choice only after they've hit 75, when it's too late to restart and they just have to live with it, or spend countless hours building a second character. It's usually a good tatic to think ahead. =P

Originally Posted by dirtyclown

A well placed Shield Bash can go a long way to saving your ass.

I wish, I wish, oh how I wish that's still the case. T.T They've changed shield bash and made it a provoke. -_-;

Now it hardly ever stuns. I've taken many deaths since because noone in my party is smart enough to stun/silence an AM, and my shield bash failed to stun the mob out of casting. (Yes, I am also a Taru PLD)

[dirtyclown]

Originally Posted by Yuanlung

I wish, I wish, oh how I wish that's still the case. T.T They've changed shield bash and made it a provoke. -_-;

Now it hardly ever stuns. I've taken many deaths since because noone in my party is smart enough to stun/silence an AM, and my shield bash failed to stun the mob out of casting. (Yes, I am also a Taru PLD)

Really? I haven't noticed any change in Shield Bash, was there anything mentioned in patch notes about it? Far as I can remember there's been a chance of it not working since day one, but I haven't noticed yet. I use a Guardian Ring for Shield Bash, so I dunno if that has an effect or not.

[Draco Dagon]

Originally Posted by Mog

Unlike what you said, people pay attention to mithran drks, taru plds, etc.

Overall, don't pay attention to race. If you play your job well and buy the right gear, race is not a deciding factor in how well you will perform in a party situation. Period. Moreover, I would love to see Taru mnks outdamaging Elvish monks, which I'm sure is possible.

Mog, perhaps you're right. It's not that I've not seen the above occur, but overall since I've started, there's always someone going "ZOMGZ!!!" over a Galkan mage alot more compared to any other combination, but it's just my experience...

Originally Posted by Caspian

(However, a taru pld at normal xp levels can hold hate like nobody's business, mp oceans ftw.)

Yeah, some of the best PLDs I've partied with were taru.

Originally Posted by dirtyclown

OMG YOU BETTER GO WITH ALL OF THE COOKIE CUTTER COMBOS OR YOU'RE A TOTAL NOOB AND YOU'RE DESTINED TO FAIL AT EVERYTHING YOU DO. RACE AFFECTS ABSOLUTELY EVERYTHING, THAT TARU MNK IS BAD BECAUSE OF HIS RACE, NOT BECAUSE HE HAS SUBPAR GEAR AND HAS NO IDEA HOW TO USE A MNK PROPERLY.

QFT!

(I know you're being sarcastic.)

[Rai]

I do have to say, anyone paying attention to the game, and leveling a character will see that Race does effect job performance.

Mithra THF SATA + WS will hit a little harder then an Elvaan THF's, A Taru BLM's burst will hit a little harder than an Elvaan BLM's. A Galka DRK's Soul Eater will do more damage because he can sustain it longer than a Taru DRK.

While anyone observing these things should be able to acknowlege them. They should also be able to realize the that there is a window of acceptable level of performance, and any race trying to level any job, as long as the player is making an effort and using acceptable gear their performace should be acceptable.

[Theyaden]

Originally Posted by Rai

I do have to say, anyone paying attention to the game, and leveling a character will see that Race does effect job performance.

Mithra THF SATA + WS will hit a little harder then an Elvaan THF's, A Taru BLM's burst will hit a little harder than an Elvaan BLM's. A Galka DRK's Soul Eater will do more damage because he can sustain it longer than a Taru DRK.

While anyone observing these things should be able to acknowlege them. They should also be able to realize the that there is a window of acceptable level of performance, and any race trying to level any job, as long as the player is making an effort and using acceptable gear their performace should be acceptable.

This I can definatly agree with you may be a little behind in some areas, but not anything crippling. I can personally attest your right on the blackmage manaburst. In Altep fighting Beetles myself (Elvan blackmage) and another pt member (Mithra or hume female). My elemental skill was capped and my gear was +1 or +2 intellegence (it's been a little while I only remember because I was suprised by it being so close to equaling mine) more than her total int bonus neither of us were wearing +elemental gear and we were both the same level. (We both had decient gear my RSE gave me a slight edge) We kept doing ice manabursts with the same spell leaving an easy comparison. Hers were consistantly at least 10 higher in damage.
I considered this acceptable since we were keeping a steady xp without death going and my ego will survive being mildly outperformed. However it's important to know what your races strengths and weaknesses are in order to compensate for weak points and build on strong ones.

I was hunting through old links and finally located this it should help with getting a rough idea of the statistical differences and offer insite on subjob choices and their additions stat hp and mp wise. Goodluck and remember there are more things to consider than just stats such as Taru dance moves and other non performace items.

http://www.datasync.com/~dsmith/FFXIStats/