(yet another) Valkurm Dunes Rant

[Eauijhkuu]

Salutations.

Eauijkuu here.

Pissed to no end, when my feet hit the dunes and I'm faced with some horrid...just...irritatingly well expected series of happenings while I decide to level my RDM through dunes.

I guess even I came here as a newbie once. And you know what, I think it's great that newbies can gather together in this specific area and learn the ins and outs of what makes a party a party. This is a good thing for people who are new, to learn the game's mechanics - the pure basics of PT fundamentals.

But I think I have a slight problem with you when you've been through this craphole 5+ times with higher level jobs, and I see your HP bar suddenly dwindle from 300 to 140 to 0. What? Death by Agro? 7 times in one day in the same party? This is all too much I could ask for from more than four people today. So now that you've succeeded in irritating me, I have a few questions for you:

HOW many times have you been through Valkurm Dunes?
HOW many times have you agroed goblins and known that they obviously agro by sight?
HOW many times have you agroed bats and known that they were obviously agressive to sound?
Knowing that you were going to have to travel past 2 tunnels full of bats and potentially guarded by goblins, would you have made slight preparations just as you would in any other higher level party by purchasing items for sneaking and invising?
How much time am I going to lose by looking for a raise?
How wrong would I be for kicking your sorry cheap gimped unprepared carcass from my group?

WHY the heck...do people...take jobs through this zone...5 + times... acting clueless?!
Witnessing 7 deaths in one hour is just not cool.
Especially when they're all from agro.

We camped at the Secret hidden beach over near C-6 in Valkurm dunes...and in the process of inviting more players to replace old ones.
WHM died twice on his way getting to camp.
SMN died once, and had to wait 40 minutes to get a raise from a WHM who was pissing and moaning about having to run all the way over to C-6 to raise one person just for the shere pleasure of it all (Because he'll get sand under his perfectly peticured toenails! oh noes!)
PLD d/cs and dies from the WHM's agro, that he pulls to Camp...and doesn't zone.
THF Dies trying to get to camp.
WHM dies again coming from camp.
NIN dies twice coming from Konstatch Highlands. First from Tremor Ram. Then from agroed 3 bats(Not to mention all the other monsters he agroed along the way, which should of killed his lame arse). He dies, and figures that he's being inconveninced, and decides to HP back to Whitegate.

And the party has yet to start, mind you.
And this is all action from agroed mobs!

You would flipping think that flipping people would learn the flipping first time and bring some flipping powders or oils if they can't flipping understand how to flipping avoid flipping mob agro in the first flippin place, instead of causing massive player wipe on the server. Stop being so flippin' cheap and flippin' unlearned. There's no flippin' excuse as to why you shouldn't be able to afford them anymore either, because flippin' prices on the flippin' AH are flippin' 10 times lower than what they used to be.

UGH.
Get learn't or go home!

/end rant.

Now where's that bag of skittles?

[Cavick]

You're scaring me about going to the dunes my first time -_-

[Eauijhkuu]

Good.

Even thought we are possibly on different servers (hail Bahamut)
Don't you be a victim to this ignorant magnonimous bullcrap.

Ignorance is by no means an excuse to be gimped.

[Sabaron]

You're supposed to provide an escort for mages through the Secret Beach tunnel. They cannot pass it themselves without Powder/Oil and a lot of low-levels are new and don't have money. You can't expect newbs with virtually no farming ability or crafting skill to pony up 30-40k for stealth items -and- keep their gear and spells up to date. Be nice.

A lot of high-levels get lazy about stealth because they have a tendency to run through areas where they're on the top of the food chain. This sets in a bit of subconscious laziness.

It should be a trivial matter for high-levs to pay for stealth in this region--that is as inexcusable as not bringing stealth to other dangerous areas like Ifrit's Cauldron.

[Eauijhkuu]

You're supposed to provide an escort for mages through the Secret Beach tunnel. They cannot pass it themselves without Powder/Oil and a lot of low-levels are new and don't have money. You can't expect newbs with virtually no farming ability or crafting skill to pony up 30-40k for stealth items -and- keep their gear and spells up to date. Be nice.

A lot of high-levels get lazy about stealth because they have a tendency to run through areas where they're on the top of the food chain. This sets in a bit of subconscious laziness.

It should be a trivial matter for high-levs to pay for stealth in this region--that is as inexcusable as not bringing stealth to other dangerous areas like Ifrit's Cauldron.

And my party is supposed to just stop everything that they're doing, and escort a party member, right?


If you can't avoid agro. Buy stealth items. Period.
I don't care who you are, what level you are, what job you are, how experienced you think you are, and at higher levels, they won't either.

Big deal if you're wearing insanely uber gear and have all of your spells.
If you can't make it to point A from point B without dying or endangering the party, what use are you to the group?

I would rather you stealth your way to a party spot instead of agroing everything in your path before you even reach camp, and then be forced to wait for a Raise from an edgy WHM who doesn't care much to bother to walk and find your dead carcass lying in the sands.

Because there's not going to be an escort available all the time, just like there wasn't in my instance Since I had to heal an already active party in the first place.

And I'm not going to be biased to mages either; A good Melee has the same, if not more, monetary issues to deal with concerning stealth items and gear and food. You're going to show heavy understanding for that THF that wanted to skill up his marksmanship and grab some +1 gear as well, and yet, agroes everything in his path? And honestly, what mage or melee is ever wearing 10k worth of gil in gear at that level anymore?

[Icemage]

You can't expect new players to understand these mechanics. That's what you get for inviting people to party in Valkurm - it just happens, live with it or stay away from that hellhole.

I'm working on my 4th job through Dunes level, but I'll admit I hate that place with a passion. Maze of Shakrami and Korroloka Tunnel are 10 times better if you can get even 2 other people to come with you. There's really no need to go to Valkurm if you know what you're doing.

If you absolutely insist on going to "VD", then the only way to avoid a repeat performance of this is for you to bring extra stealth meds and personally escort these ninnies across the zone.


Icemage

[eticket109]

Getting aggro on the way to camp is just how it goes in the dunes. I know I didn't buy oils and powders for my first trip through the dunes. I wouldn't expect anyone else to either.

On another note, if someone bites it on the secret beach... look for a Raise from a 40 pt in Gustav. They're a bit closer, though if they are into heavy xp, they may not be able to come out for a while.

[Aeolus]

Salutations.

Aeolus here.

You should stay in the dunes and personally educate every new person or newb 2nd jober that zones into valkurm, supply them with oils/powders and maybe even escort them to their parties only helping if they pull aggro so they can learn to dodge aggro themselves without death. And maybe use another word than flipping or just miss it out of your sentences completey.

[tdh]

I've leveled all of the following jobs in the Dunes at one point or another. Some of them I leveled almost entirely in the Dunes from Lv.10 to Lv.19 or 20.

RDM
BLM
WHM
WAR
THF
MNK
DRK
RNG
BRD
NIN
DRG
SAM

I've been aggro'd and killed by Gobbys more times than I ever care to admit, and I'd have to say about 50% of them happened in the Dunes. I've run through the Bat tunnel and narrowly escaped to the zone with my life. And as much as I have hated that ashtray of Vana'diel, it has taught me to skirk the edge of detection and avoid a lot of aggro.

My first job to Lv.75 was RDM, so basically I didn't need to bring Sneak/Invis items by the time I really needed them. Well I've been leveling a lot of melee jobs, and I always have the items handy now. So if I find myself in Qufim when the lights go out, I just pop a Silent Oil and walk right past the Wights with out a worry.

[IfritnoItazura]

Part of the fault is with the leader.

I don't think it's much work for leaders to remind invitee:

"You need to get through a tunnel to reach camp, and gobliins like to gather at the entrance--make sure you bring Silent Oil and Prism Powder (or Shinobi-Tabi)"

Part of the fault is with the player coming to camp.

If someone hasn't picked up the fact that you need Silent Oil and Prism Powder (or Shinobi-Tabi) when not on chocobo by the 2nd or 3rd time in Valkurm Dunes, that person is just stupid. Laziness is a form of stupidity, too, of course.

I always have a full or nearly full stack of silent oil, prism powder, and echo drop in my inventory. Usually, also a Reraise item as well. I' was tempted to bring Antidotes last time I was in VD, but decided to use the inventory space for juice material instead. It's hard to believe the number of WHM's out there w/out Barfira and Poisona, though.

Part of the fault is with the people in party who have already seen deaths on way to camp not reminding leader and inviteee to take precaution, too, BTW.

* * *

The only time I can remember being invited to any place other than Valkrum Dunes at those levels is to Gusgen Mines. It sucked, badly. If I only knew that's where they were headed--I could have easily predicated that my RNG's damage on skeletons wouldn't exactly be impressive.

[Anaki]

the problem i see people i stating that to play ffxi you have to use a walkthrough which is really a stupid point of view.

your first job you just started the game you are lvl 10 at this point in time you probably do not know about sneak and invisible. you may not know that mobs aggro to sound or sight by now heck all you know for monsters is some aggro and some dont. also oils/powders are NOT cheap so if you cant afford them at lvl 10 then you cant afford them at lvl 10. and laziness and lack of knowing are not the same thing.

if the people have lvled past dunes and KNOW of aggro and the sort then they are just lazy/stupid for getting killed. but if its your first time then your not lazy or stupid you just have yet to get killed alot in dunes to learn of how dunes works.

[Nerotu]

And my party is supposed to just stop everything that they're doing, and escort a party member, right?

But didn't you just say that the party hadn't even started yet? Wouldn't that imply that those of you waiting at the beach were basically just sitting there?
No matter what level you used to be, getting through the dunes at a low level (especially as a mage and especially alone) is very tough.
When a few of your Party members are coming from Konschtat Highlands, you could have chose a meeting point such as the exit to the cave, or maybe even the OutPost.
It's the leaders job to get everyone together, not just invite them and let them make their own way, but to help each other out and get to camp.
To be honest, if they got aggroed by Gobs, that's their own fault. Stay clear from gobs is all I have to say. But getting aggroed by bats can't be helped.
Think about it, which would have been quicker? Watching their healths going down and then dieing, and then spending your time shouting for a raise and meeting up again? Or meeting at a designated spot, and then travel through the dangerous areas together? (such as caves and the gob camp)

[Jei]

I think it's so expected really, people aggroing bats and die in tunnels, that's the VK fun xD

If the person is rank 10 and still do that tho, I would be upset too.

[Taermus]

I haven't been to Valkurm to xp for a long time. I've leveled 10 jobs there, and I'm going to solo whatever's left to 18~20.

The main reason is that camp. It's garbage. The mobs there don't pop fast enough, and their xp spread is foul. You get yellow hp during nighttime and you're dead. If you do die, it takes forever to get back from your hp, and waste more oil and dust (tonko does 1 job out of 18 any good at this level). I really would like to know what the fascination with the place is.

The xp loss from death at these levels is laughable. Man up and hp.

[Riian]

AAHHHHHHHHHH the doones...

Everybody hates the dunes and you all are right. A mixture of noobs with lazy high lvl players who are to good for oils/powders in the dunes is not a fun mixture. Best way to keep a party safe in the dunes is meet up at a zone and keep close together avoiding gobs along the way. A party can take those bats no problem. I find it hard to give noobs advice in the dunes though. One tries to be helpful because OBVIOUSLY some ppl need the advice and then they act offended or give you that crap about "I have 4 75 lvl jobs and I think I know what I'm doing!" B.S. These days I don't give advice unless somebody asks or is OBVIOUSLY a fresh on the sands noob. It's not worth it. You'd think though that a lvl 10 who somehow managed to get from say windy to selbina would have a few extra oils/powders on him/her from the trip across Bur. Penninsula.