[Kensai]

http://ffxi.allakhazam.com/db/jobs.h...2172128&num=14

I know it may seem fake but has anyone heard anything about AGI affecting your parry and blocking rate?

[imac2much]

A lot of misinformation and pompous flaming on those boards, just like most FFXI boards (ign, gamefaqs, etc). Even though I like that site a lot for information, the boards are full of people full of themselves who like to insult everyone behind a mask of anonymity.

For one, the evasion bonus from either drone or dodge earrings means JACK. When I fight perytons (IT mobs in sorrow valley), they occasionally blind me. I have 2 bat earrings, so blinded = +30 evasion. They still never miss me.. maybe they miss me once out of every battle. I purposely told my WHM not to blindna me so I can see how often I'll evade... and it was laughable.

So maybe AGI really does affect parrying and shield blocking. I am not sure about this at all... I didn't notice any difference when I used drones... but to be honest I wasn't paying attention that much most of the time. Maybe bside or daigoro can help us out on this issue? If so, maybe I should trade my bat earrings for drone earrings... it feels weird "downgrading" from 50k earrings to 15k earrings though.

[daigoro]

I also could not see any effect from the +6 AGI so I just gave up and started equiping MP items in my earring slot...wearing 2 death pierce now for 20MP, while waiting for guilders to get the Robust Earrings (vit+2) to ramuh...assuming I can even afford them if they do.

-daigoro

[Nemes]

I'm only a level 30 PLD, and I'm aware I don't have as much experience as you guys have.

But, I do believe that AGI does more than 2 AGI = 1 Evasion. To easily prove my point, we can all agree that VIT isn't only 2 VIT = 1 DEF. I don't see why AGI would be useless like that.

I really do believe that it increases Shield/Parry/Evasion rate, though I don't have any numbers of proofs to support my claim...

I also believe that since PLDs have such low AGI, and that Mithras have the highest AGI, they're probably the only ones that can take advantage of it. At least that's the way I see it all. Once I get my Drone Earring, I'll try to keep an eye on my shield/parry/evasion rate then.

[Lerican]

2 Agi = 1 Evasion and 1 Ranged Accuracy.

2 Vit = 1 Def and reduces Dmg based on Opponent's Str.

That's all I know for sure =/.

-Lerican

[imac2much]

Originally posted by Nemes
I'm only a level 30 PLD, and I'm aware I don't have as much experience as you guys have.

But, I do believe that AGI does more than 2 AGI = 1 Evasion. To easily prove my point, we can all agree that VIT isn't only 2 VIT = 1 DEF. I don't see why AGI would be useless like that.

I really do believe that it increases Shield/Parry/Evasion rate, though I don't have any numbers of proofs to support my claim...

I also believe that since PLDs have such low AGI, and that Mithras have the highest AGI, they're probably the only ones that can take advantage of it. At least that's the way I see it all. Once I get my Drone Earring, I'll try to keep an eye on my shield/parry/evasion rate then.

Yes, that's obvious, and we didn't state otherwise. All base stats affect several derivative stats and other circumstances. AGI also decreases the chance of monster critting you, for example.

The big question is, how much does it help?

Certain derivative stats make almost no difference. For example, evasion makes no difference against XP PT mobs, which are incredibly tough. I have 2 bat earrings, when I am blind, I have +30 evasion. That should be a lot right, cuz that's 60 AGI? Wrong, when Peryton's blind me, there is absolutely no difference in evade rate.

Other derivative stats, such as attack and accuracy, make a lot more difference because they affect how a monster "cons" to you... like, if it's high evade/def, normal, or low evade/def. The way it cons affects other things... for example, they increase your base damage before random variables are added/subtracted.

I tried 2 drone earrings for several XP PT's just trying it out. The fact is I noticed no difference. +10 mp is much more concrete... isn't much, but it's there for a fact. And later levels you can get better MP earrings to get up to +20 mp as daigoro states.

[xcalibur2k]

Originally posted by imac2much


The big question is, how much does it help?

Certain derivative stats make almost no difference. For example, evasion makes no difference against XP PT mobs, which are incredibly tough. I have 2 bat earrings, when I am blind, I have +30 evasion. That should be a lot right, cuz that's 60 AGI? Wrong, when Peryton's blind me, there is absolutely no difference in evade rate.

Is it possible that evasion is capped based on your character's lvl which causes "non difference" ?

I know when I check my weapon skill stats evasion is always capped based on my level. So does wearing +evasion items go beyond the cap? or am I totally misunderstood the evasion skill altogether?

EDIT:
Also forgot to mention that PLD has a C rating for evasion. So if the above are true, then we definately have a less chance evading IT mobs no?

[imac2much]

Well, let's analyze this:

1) Even if what you say is true, that is all the more reason why drone earrings are pointless. If you are saying that +evasion doesn't help because it is already capped for my level, then how will drone earrings help also? Unless you're saying somehow the stat-derived bonuses CAN go over the cap... but then you're grasping for straws.

2) I'm pretty sure it goes over the cap. When a RDM uses phalanx, the damage reduction is (Enhancing Skill/7)-10. When a RDM uses phlanax with capped enhancing skill, he will take X amount less damage. Then he puts his AF hat on for Enhance skill bonus... he takes even less damage. Then he gets 70% hp and <100% tp and puts on Fencer Ring... even less damage! This should prove that +stats can go beyond your level cap.

So either way, drone earrings = useless, except for THF.

[xcalibur2k]

ok now i'm confused. are we talking about evasion or defense?

This is how I understand it. Evasion relates to the rate of mobs hitting/missing you while defense relates to what damage you take.

I admit I just got the game last December so maybe I still have to learn a few things.

As far as i know defense doesn't have a lvl cap associated with it, but evasion does.

However you look at it, paladin still have a C rating in evasion which makes those earrings useless (This will probably depends on if +stat items go beyond level cap, which I have no idea if they do).

I am not high level so I can't say this for sure, but I am guessing that those earrings are mainly useful for THFs and NINs (they have A rating in evasion) at higher level when it takes longer to reach their respective evasion level cap.

PS: I am really curious if +stat items really does go beyond their respective level cap. Does anyone have any links which may point to some information about this?

EDIT:
I'm sorry, I neglected to look at the stat for drone earrings before I replied to your post.
Initially I thought drone earrings adds to evasion...but turns out that it adds 3 agility.
So I take back what I said about drone earrings being useless for paladin as agility does effect critical hit rates, so it does have some use.

One more apology is in order. You are actually relating to the RDM's enhance skill...not the defense stat.
In that case then that is a strong evidence that +stat items really does make skills go beyond their level cap.
Good call Imac!

[imac2much]

Where did I ever mention defense?

The skill rating won't affect whether a +skill will go beyond cap. The difference between an A skill and C skill at level 60 is only 13 points. My +30 evasion from bat earrings when I'm blind would make my skill much higher than someone with A skill....... and I still don't evade. +3 evade from 2 drones or +6 evade from 2 dodges are going to help this much: absolutely zilch.

I already gave PROOF that +skill equipment lets you go beyond the cap, with the RDM example.

Could someone please post a list of the NEW REWARD ITEMS for when you beat an avatar?

As you can see, even though Applepie's enhancing skill is at a level cap, his AF armor's +skill for enhancing let's it go up 15 more points... and Fencer Ring will do the same.

Where's the confusion?

[xcalibur2k]

ah, you are quicker to post than me.
Doesn't matter still good info as I learned something new.

[xcalibur2k]

Originally posted by imac2much

The skill rating won't affect whether a +skill will go beyond cap. The difference between an A skill and C skill at level 60 is only 13 points. My +30 evasion from bat earrings when I'm blind would make my skill much higher than someone with A skill....... and I still don't evade. +3 evade from 2 drones or +6 evade from 2 dodges are going to help this much: absolutely zilch.

OK, the only thing I can think of is maybe the mobs accuracy is greater than your C skill with +30 evasion.
Maybe we can try a test with someone who has an A rating and that +30 evasion condition and see if that makes a difference.

I don't if I may be wrong about this, but 13 difference between A and C sounds a lot to me, based on the posts I've read about choosing weapons for level up party.

[imac2much]

Xcal, you're not seeing the big picture.

Ninjas and other jobs with A evasion are NOT going to use bat earrings. First of all, the +30 evasion only kicks when you're blind, which won't be often. At best, they will use 2 dodge earrings for Evasion + 6.

So they will have a total of 19 more evasion than my PLD with C evasion. But then when I am blinded (bat earrings are +5 mp and +15 evasion when blind, I use them for the MP, not for the evasion bonus), I have 11 more evasion than them.

And guess what? IT mobs still hit me like crazy. There's almost no difference at all against IT mobs that you will fight for XP. Perhaps for even match and below, the evasion bonus will help, who knows?

Bottom line: Evasion is pointless for a PLD, and really only helps when you cast flash. But when I cast flash, even with a capped C rating, I don't get hit.

You're putting way too much emphasis on the skill rating of evasion. I already stated previously that certain derivative stats have more practical impact than others. Evasion is probably useless compared to defense because there aren't +% evasion boosts from food and spells and job abilities (for PLD) as there are with DEF... if I wasn't using Protect, food, etc, my defense would be pretty crappy as well.

[Nemes]

I don't believ the Drone Earrings are usefull for the small bonus in Evasion. It is only for the AGI bonus.

As for saying the monsters hit you like crazy, surely you mean "most of the time", right? 'cause if we look when we just leveled, our Evasion Skill pumps up like crazy. And it only pumps when the monster misses. So, Evasion can't be useless...

Also, as I said earlier, PLD have LOW Evasion and AGI, which may be why you don't get to evade as much as you wish. On the other hand, a Mithra as very high AGI, and *maybe*, just maybe, a Mithra PLD can evade/shield/parry as much on a Tough or VT mob than a Galkan/Elvaan PLD can on an Even Match.

Of course, this is based on the fact that AGI does more raise a little Evasion and Ranged Accuracy...

But, I seriously doubt AGI isn't usefull like VIT can be usefull. My guess is that AGI is calculated with the mob's DEX. I've heard ppl saying that AGI helps raise shield/parry/evasion rate, and I certainly don't think it's crazy, but I certainly can't prove that as well...


So, I guess what I'm trying to say, is that because PLD is so low on AGI, maybe the only real race that can make full use of that is a Mithra.

[imac2much]

Some good points there Nemes. However, no offense, but I disagree.

Evasion goes up whether you dodge or not. You didn't know that? Paladins almost never dodge unless you use Flash (which doesn't last long). Evasion goes up fast because you tank a lot... it goes up even when you get hit.

Race means nothing here. 2 AGI = 1 evasion as stated, and even with +30 evasion (+60 AGI), there is no difference. Mithra has like, what, 8 more AGI than Galka at my level? 4 evasion... useless.

And don't say that maybe Mithra will dodge more WITH the +30 evasion... the +30 evasion is not practical in normal XP PT usually (only works when blinded), I was just using it to test, otherwise I would want a blindna ASAP (and only a few monsters blind you anyway). So if a Galka with +30 evasion cannot dodge, then a Mithra with +6 evasion can't either.

Your emphasis on base stat is misguided.... it seems you think that AGI must be important just because we now realize VIT is important. Realize this:

VIT on the whole doesn't make much difference. The reason why higher levels value VIT is because at higher levels you have too much DEFENSE, to a point where VIT will reduce damage more than DEF. This is because you can get Protect 4, fish mithkabobs, Defender, Sentinel, Rampart. Without these, DEF is a lot more important than VIT.

What do you use to increase evasion? That's right, nothing. So I see no reason to speculate that AGI is more important than EVASION at this point. Sure, you might shield block, parry a bit more, but it won't be noticeable. I have tested with drone earrings and noticed nothing, Daigoro confirmed this as well.

Most people who use drones are because they just like the bonus on the stat screen, not because they actually objectively notice any difference.