[DakAttack]

Originally Posted by Feba

Dak: Because being different means you are making an effort not to conform.

Everybody conforms to something. Why not conform to something more socially accepted? Or at least to something successful? The same goes for homies and hoods who think dressing street will automatically earn them respect. It's a look, it's more of a representation than an expression, and it's something that's completely unnecessary. Personally, I go with a pair of jeans or slacks that fit, and a shirt that I believe represents me tastefully.

I don't know where this is going, but in summary, goths need to stop being such d-bags.

[Mhurron]

Originally Posted by Feba

Dak: Because being different means you are making an effort not to conform.

They're failing miserably because they're not any different.

[Murphie]

The bottom line is, it doesn't matter what other people wear. If they want to look objectively stupid, then that's fine. Other people do it too (not just goths). This bus driver was way out of line, and will hopefully be fired for being such so blindingly stupid.

[Feba]

Everybody conforms to something.

Not true. Everyone might fall into a stereotype, but that doesn't mean they're conforming to anything.

Why not conform to something more socially accepted?

Why the hell should they care what society thinks?

Or at least to something successful?

From what I heard, both of them had jobs. I don't see anything that would lead to pointing at them as failures. Well, except for blatant stupidity, but that's par for the course.

[Mhurron]

Originally Posted by Murphie

The bottom line is, it doesn't matter what other people wear. If they want to look objectively stupid, then that's fine. Other people do it too (not just goths). This bus driver was way out of line, and will hopefully be fired for being such so blindingly stupid.

Actually as the operator of a bus he does have a say in what is or is not safe. Someone on a leash on a moving bus, isn't safe.

[Feba]

Actually as the operator of a bus he does have a say in what is or is not safe.

Yes, but he does not have a right to keep people off the bus because he disagrees with their lifestyle, which is clearly the case here.

There is no reason to believe the leash is dangerous, and there is no reason to believe it could not be controlled somehow if it were.

[Restlesstornado]

Originally Posted by Mhurron

Actually as the operator of a bus he does have a say in what is or is not safe. Someone on a leash on a moving bus, isn't safe.

Edit: Feba is quick like a fox.

Yes but in this case that WAS NOT the reason for being thrown off the buss, at least thats how the story is being told by the goths.

[Murphie]

Mhurron, only if he can prove that the leash is unsafe. Which it really isn't. I mean, dude could just let go while they are on the bus. And again, not the case here. They are really only able to refuse people who are drunk or obviously a danger to other passengers.

[Restlesstornado]

Originally Posted by Murphie

Mhurron, only if he can prove that the leash is unsafe. Which it really isn't. I mean, dude could just let go while they are on the bus. And again, not the case here. They are really only able to refuse people who are drunk or obviously a danger to other passengers.

What about the others Murphies law; Whatever can go wrong will go wrong! Some people do live thier lives that way.

I personally agree with you but its fun to play devils advocate!

[Murphie]

Doesn't matter. He's not allowed to refuse service to customers just because he doesn't like them. That's a whole can of worms we closed a long time ago.

Honestly, I'd rather sit by these two than half the dirty freaks that ride my bus every day.

[Mhurron]

Originally Posted by Murphie

Mhurron, only if he can prove that the leash is unsafe. Which it really isn't. I mean, dude could just let go while they are on the bus. And again, not the case here. They are really only able to refuse people who are drunk or obviously a danger to other passengers.

No, he does not need to prove it is not safe. These are what are called 'judgement calls.'

he does not have a right to keep people off the bus because he disagrees with their lifestyle, which is clearly the case here.

"Operations director for Arriva Yorkshire, Paul Adcock, said: "Arriva takes any allegation of discrimination very seriously and have interviewed the driver regarding Mr Graves' claims.

"Our primary concern is passenger safety and while the couple are very welcome to travel on our buses, we are asking that Miss Maltby remove her dog lead before boarding the bus."

[Murphie]

Yes, their press release trying to cover their asses really supports your point.

He physically threw the guy off the bus and insulted them (called her a dog, since she was wearing a leash, called them freaks, etc.) Because he didn't like them. Not because it was a safety issue. That was mentioned later, by the company.

You (and they) are wrong here.

[DieselBoy09]

Fascist pigs!

[DakAttack]

Originally Posted by Feba

Not true. Everyone might fall into a stereotype, but that doesn't mean they're conforming to anything.

Yea it does. You, a man of pure ideals, should understand what it is to conform to ideas and concepts the most. You wouldn't call somebody a goth if they're not a goth, thus what they've conformed to whether they're attempting to or not is the concept of what a goth is.

Why the hell should they care what society thinks?

What a defense mechanism. Everybody cares what people think of them. Everybody.

Everybody.

[Ziero]

Super Multi-Quote Post go!

Originally Posted by DakAttack

I don't know what I'd do if I saw one person leading another person with a leash. That's not goth at all, that's just trying too hard to be different. You cant call people fascists when you're trying THAT HARD to be different. I'm sure there's something we can call them, but it slips my mind.

I saw that once, two kids walking down a highway with the chick on the leash. I ignored them because I didn't care that they looked like retards.

Originally Posted by Feba

Dak: Because being different means you are making an effort not to conform.

Goths 'conform' to goth lifestyles. The dude specificially said he was a goth for cryin out loud. He's just as much as a conformist as the 9-5 guy in a suit, he's just conforming with a different crowd.

Originally Posted by Murphie

Dak: It's called Hot Topic shopper.

That's actually 'pop-goth' from my understanding, meaning real goths make fun of hot-topic goths. Which is just one big lolfest imo. Though the 80s junk and some of their obscure things they have there can be pretty cool.

Originally Posted by DakAttack

Everybody conforms to something. Why not conform to something more socially accepted? Or at least to something successful? The same goes for homies and hoods who think dressing street will automatically earn them respect. It's a look, it's more of a representation than an expression, and it's something that's completely unnecessary. Personally, I go with a pair of jeans or slacks that fit, and a shirt that I believe represents me tastefully.

I don't know where this is going, but in summary, goths need to stop being such d-bags.

Why should they care what's more "successful" or "accepted"? They're doing fine, happy with themselves and not hurting anyone. People spending hundreds of dollars on shoes and paying triple digits for a simple shirt because it's got some fancy name on the label are socially accepted, but I'll still think those people are morons. Society as a whole, ain't too bright to begin with, so why the hell should they worry about having everyone "accept" them. If you have a problem with how they look, that's your problem, not theirs.

Originally Posted by Mhurron

Actually as the operator of a bus he does have a say in what is or is not safe. Someone on a leash on a moving bus, isn't safe.

Originally Posted by Mhurron

No, he does not need to prove it is not safe. These are what are called 'judgement calls.'

"Operations director for Arriva Yorkshire, Paul Adcock, said: "Arriva takes any allegation of discrimination very seriously and have interviewed the driver regarding Mr Graves' claims.

"Our primary concern is passenger safety and while the couple are very welcome to travel on our buses, we are asking that Miss Maltby remove her dog lead before boarding the bus."

While that is indeed a possibility, that's not the case here according to Captain McGothy pants. He's saying this *specific* bus driver was hostile, aggressive and offensive to him and there is *no* reason to act that way. I'm sure if it was a saftey issue and they were asked politely to remove the leash on the bus ride they would have.

Originally Posted by DakAttack

Yea it does. You, a man of pure ideals, should understand what it is to conform to ideas and concepts the most. You wouldn't call somebody a goth if they're not a goth, thus what they've conformed to whether they're attempting to or not is the concept of what a goth is.

What a defense mechanism. Everybody cares what people think of them. Everybody.

Everybody.

Honestly, I really don't care what the average person thinks of me. Their opinion has no effect on who I am or what I do so let them think what they want. I'm a nice guy because I like being nice. I wear what I wear because it's comfortable and I like what's on my clothes. I listen to music I listen to because I like that music. I am me because it's what I want to be, and whether you (as a society) like it or not doesn't mean a damn to me because ultimately I decide what I do and who I am.

Confidence people, it's a good thing.