A monk's opinnion over giving Pup Asuran Fists - Final Fantasy XI :: Dreams in Vana'diel :: Community

ValiantRedemption · 12-27-2006, 10:03 AM

My LS the other day was having a discussion about puppetmaster getting Asuran Fists as Hand to Hand is their best skill and they do not get any Weapon Skill that needs to be quested.
Giving Pup master a B skill or higher will give them the ability to have 250+ hand-to-hand skill(currently a pup can have 250skill with merits and items) which would allow them to be able to quest for Asuran Fists. Many people in my LS voted against Pups getting Asuran Fists because it was considered a monk thing. However, other people said that hand-to-hand was the only weapon skill that only one job could use.
So, with that said, I would like to hear the forum's opinnion about letting Puppetmaster get Asuran Fists.

Mog · 12-27-2006, 10:13 AM

If you want Asuran Fists, grab monk. While pups have a decent hand-to-hand skill, that's not the job's primary focus. Maybe giving the puppet a certain weaponskill though, that would be a good idea.

Raydeus · 12-27-2006, 10:21 AM

The only reason PUP should be able to get Asuran is because they don't have any other fighting skill they can use, but if that's the case then they should have their skill rating raised to B.

I still wouldn't like seeing PUP's getting it but since they can't get anything else...

tdh · 12-27-2006, 11:02 AM

I'm of the mind that only MNK should gain access to Asuran Fists. That having been said, I've also stated in previous posts that PUP should be given a WS Quest. Just not for the PUP themselves, but a Quest to give the Automaton a WS. Basically give them an Remote with a latent on them. They have to break the latent like everybody has to with their WS Weapons, and then fight a NM to get WS for the Automaton.

My plan at the time was to give PUP a means to participate in Lv.3 Skillchain. Allow the PUP, with the Automaton, create a 3 person Lv.3 skillchain and close for decent damage.

Jei · 12-27-2006, 11:19 AM

I'm with Asuran a mnk onry. It just feels that way, no reason for me really.

Raydeus · 12-27-2006, 11:28 AM

Hmm... PUPs do get Dragon Kick so the lvl3 SC thing is already covered.

So maybe a quested lvl3 Auto WS would work better indeed.

tdh · 12-27-2006, 12:01 PM

Originally Posted by Raydeus

Hmm... PUPs do get Dragon Kick so the lvl3 SC thing is already covered.

So maybe a quested lvl3 Auto WS would work better indeed.

They do? I thought they got Howling Fists, but not Dragon Kick.

EDIT: Confirmed

PUP does get Dragon Kick, but at Lv.75. I had no idea this was added. I thought they required you to have an A in the Skill to get the Lv.225 WS.

Dragon Kick Wiki page

BurningPanther · 12-27-2006, 12:37 PM

I'd be all for giving PUP Asuran Fists. As a RDM, I have just enough skill to get access to Savage Blade, and I've heard a few times from "dedicated" Sword jobs(PLD, WAR), that I have no business having it. The way I see it, PUP and Asuran Fists is to Hand to Hand fighters(all two jobs), what RDM is to Sword swingers: Getting a little something extra to augment their primary abilities.

Makes more sense them something like, say, DRK, getting access to it, eh?

Tipsy · 12-27-2006, 12:51 PM

Two words; Hell no.

Asuran Fists is nothing spectacular, damage wise. Would be pretty pointless given PUP's crappy melee stats (STR/DEX/VIT). They do good enough with Dragon Kick, giving them Asuran Fists really wouldn't do much for their damage, it would just ruin a tradition.

Icemage · 12-27-2006, 01:00 PM

Asuran Fists is totally out of flavor for PUP.

I would prefer to have Square-Enix give Puppetmasters A rank Club skill instead of trying to make them sort of jumped up pseudo-mage-DD. We don't have any jobs that use clubs in combat right now, and it would make a good fit for PUPs IMO.

Icemage

Hantz · 12-27-2006, 01:03 PM

Originally Posted by Icemage

We don't have any jobs that use clubs in combat right now, and it would make a good fit for PUPs IMO.

The AF weapon could be a juggling pin...

BurningPanther · 12-27-2006, 01:24 PM

Originally Posted by Icemage

Asuran Fists is totally out of flavor for PUP.
I would prefer to have Square-Enix give Puppetmasters A rank Club skill instead of trying to make them sort of jumped up pseudo-mage-DD. We don't have any jobs that use clubs in combat right now, and it would make a good fit for PUPs IMO.
Icemage

Good point. Actually, I think I agree with this more.

Though I don't think that Asuran Fists is out of flavor for PUP, so long as PUP has H2H skill.

Karinya · 12-28-2006, 05:07 PM

I believe their AF weapon is actually the turbo animator; although I don't know what effect it actually has compared to a normal animator, it might be the only AF "weapon" that is still used at 75 (if only because it isn't a real weapon).

Anyway, I agree with tdh's suggestion that they should get questable *puppet* ws (or new heads/frames that have new ws built in) rather than questable personal WS. The requirements for the quests could be tied to the puppet's melee/magic/ranged skill to indirectly keep it level-restricted and therefore it wouldn't be something that has to be balanced for 1-75 the way new attachments are. (I don't know why SE decided not to put level requirements on attachments but it's probably too late to change that now.) Currently it seems that PUP's power doesn't rise sharply at high levels the way every other job's does.

I would prefer for every PUP to be able to do all three quests to maintain the versatility of their jobs, the same way they can get all three frames/heads (and people with multiple A or B weapons can do multiple WS quests).

Jei · 12-28-2006, 05:24 PM

Originally Posted by BurningPanther

As a RDM, I have just enough skill to get access to Savage Blade, and I've heard a few times from "dedicated" Sword jobs(PLD, WAR), that I have no business having it.

Savage blade is not that good damage wise tho... It's just better than fast blade. I don't think PLD even use this WS for damage.

SharMarali · 12-28-2006, 05:35 PM

Personally, I think it's sheer laziness on SE's part that they didn't introduce some NEW weapons for the new classes. PUP should have been a whip-wielding class, IMHO. Instead, they gave them crappy H2H skills and nothing to make them stand apart from other DDs to facilitate their PT invitations. Likewise, I think CORs should have gotten a new TYPE of gun (perhaps gunblades?) instead of using the guns that were already in existance.

The last time SE released new jobs, they also released two new classes of weapons (Katana and Great Katana) that had never existed before, and they took a weapon that nobody *really* used (polearm) and assigned it to a new job. So why this time did they make the new classes limp along with weapons that were already out there and being put to BETTER use by other jobs than the new jobs would make of them?