+Skill or MAB/INT?

[Omgwtfbbqkitten]

I was going over various things now that SCH is 75.

I think I've hit the MND cap for Stoneskin and Possibly Phalanx as well. I suck at the math behind this, but I'm at 267 Enhancing skill (seems my present cap with AF would be 271) and 62+45 MND with present gear. I think that covers the 350 stoneskin cap and probably Phalanx's cap as well. I'm just basing this off the fact it takes about three of four smacks from a greater colibri for Stoneskin to wear off and also that it makes main healing a PT almost TOO easy. Don't think there's much more to do here.

Not worried about Healing potency, if its needed, that's what Rapture is for.

On the nuking side, I think I'm leaning more toward workin on more M. ACC+, elemental and enfeebling skill gear than I am more MAB and INT gear. I have Moldavite earing and Vicious Mufflers and don't see a visible need for more than what I have. I am working on Yigit regardless, but here's the thing:

SCH can cheat to get magic potency boosts - storm spells and Ebulliance - and it usually works.

I can get Fire IV or Blizzard IV over 1k and probably Thunder IV as well. Its the resists that are getting to me. Going from that 1.1k Fire IV to 100 on Fire IV does not please me.

What strategem I use does vary by mob type. If its Aspir-able, I generally rotate Alacrity for Aspir spam and Ebulliance for nuke potency. For mobs I can't Aspir, I turn to Parsimony mostly.

I don't think my INT build is impressive its 77+32 INT right now. I use Druid Slops with AF body for nukes, but sometime wonder of Jet Sereweels would be better. I have MC Braclets, but I'm not always in the zones to use them in and probably wouldn't want to displace Vicious Mufflers until I had Yigit or Goliard hands anyway. If I use AF body, it means giving up errant body right now. Doesn't seem to matter either way from the manaburn PTs I've had over the last few levels, but I prefer accuracy and +15 skill will give that.

I'm also thinking maybe about getting Haste gear to really exploit Alacrity. SCH is a real MP efficiency whore, if I can halve the recast of Aspir, why not get it down just a little more?

Anyway, I'd like to get some thoughts on this if I could.

[Malacite]

If we're talking nuking here, MAB will always trump INT, and +skill is really for resist rates (ignore my job levels please -.- I actually have played BLM to 60 on my taru and have been hovering various BLM forums for years; I do know what I'm talking about)


For things like Gravity, +skill > +INT

[Mog]

On the nuking side, I think I'm leaning more toward workin on more M. ACC+, elemental and enfeebling skill gear than I am more MAB and INT gear. I have Moldavite earing and Vicious Mufflers and don't see a visible need for more than what I have. I am working on Yigit regardless, but here's the thing:
.

For nuking, stick with intelligence and Magic Attack Bonus...not so much Magic Accuracy.

Do you have any elemental magic skill merits? If so, I wouldn't be too concerned with Elemental magic skill. This is from a black mage standpoint though, so I'm not sure how much different it is for you. When you're fighting something out of the ordinary, such as HNM's, NM's, whatever, you'll want to wear elemental skill. The torque particularly helps with this.



SCH can cheat to get magic potency boosts - storm spells and Ebulliance - and it usually works.

I can get Fire IV or Blizzard IV over 1k and probably Thunder IV as well. Its the resists that are getting to me. Going from that 1.1k Fire IV to 100 on Fire IV does not please me.

What strategem I use does vary by mob type. If its Aspir-able, I generally rotate Alacrity for Aspir spam and Ebulliance for nuke potency. For mobs I can't Aspir, I turn to Parsimony mostly.

I don't think my INT build is impressive its 77+32 INT right now. I use Druid Slops with AF body for nukes, but sometime wonder of Jet Sereweels would be better. I have MC Braclets, but I'm not always in the zones to use them in and probably wouldn't want to displace Vicious Mufflers until I had Yigit or Goliard hands anyway. If I use AF body, it means giving up errant body right now. Doesn't seem to matter either way from the manaburn PTs I've had over the last few levels, but I prefer accuracy and +15 skill will give that.
.

Since int is a factor in resists, I would use mahatma slops or jet seraweels over the druid slops. They're not worth it imo. I'm not sure of other hands besides the MC for scholar though, besides the vicious mufflers.

But yeah, just think of it like this. For normal mobs, stack MaB and int (assuming you have a decent amount of merits ). For larger mobs, you'll want to play around with elemental skill and see how much works for you. For scholars, they have a lower base Elemental Skill than blms, so you'll need the gear for it.

Hope that helps.~~

[Omgwtfbbqkitten]

Thanks for the replies thus far.

For nuking, stick with intelligence and Magic Attack Bonus...not so much Magic Accuracy.

Do you have any elemental magic skill merits? If so, I wouldn't be too concerned with Elemental magic skill. This is from a black mage standpoint though, so I'm not sure how much different it is for you. When you're fighting something out of the ordinary, such as HNM's, NM's, whatever, you'll want to wear elemental skill. The torque particularly helps with this.

No Elemental Magic skill merits at this time, I just finished capping out EXP for 75, so magic skill merits are up next. With Dark Arts at AF Body active I'm granted 271 Elemental Magic Skill at present, which takes me from B+ skill to roughly A- skill territory, I believe.

So perhaps I am overthinking skill gear since full merits would put over the top for average merit situations. Theres a deep part of me that's an accuracy whore and always wants to get things as accurate as I can.

The AF body is just too damn good for most things tho, so it might be a mainstay for nukes. Its not only +15 to Elemental, but +15 to Enfeebling and Dark Magic skill as well when Dark Arts is active. AF pants also grant +15 to Enfeebling and Black Magic enfeebs are still affected by the bonus, but at a greater MP cost and Light Arts strategems won't affect them. So Enfeebling merits are always going to be good for this job either way.

Since int is a factor in resists, I would use mahatma slops or jet seraweels over the druid slops. They're not worth it imo. I'm not sure of other hands besides the MC for scholar though, besides the vicious mufflers.

Patrican Cuffs, Goliard Hands, Cobra Unit Gloves, Yigit Gages are the other options I'm aware of. All of them have some merit to them, but for nukes, it seems that Vicious may still win out.

But yeah, just think of it like this. For normal mobs, stack MaB and int (assuming you have a decent amount of merits ). For larger mobs, you'll want to play around with elemental skill and see how much works for you. For scholars, they have a lower base Elemental Skill than blms, so you'll need the gear for it.

Hope that helps.~~

Ok, thanks. My INT build is arguably weak... for a Taru, anyway. which is probably just saying I'm average. I had so many main healer invites pre-72 that INT wasn't really a major concern. I suppose I'll just concern myself with Elemental/Enfeebling torque for the time being and work out those Jet Sereweels, Yigit Gages, Balrhans Ring and Elemental/Enfeebling Torques and INT gear for the time being. After I get what is purchasable, I can start farming toward those HQ staves.

[Mog]

Thanks for the replies thus far.
No Elemental Magic skill merits at this time, I just finished capping out EXP for 75, so magic skill merits are up next. With Dark Arts at AF Body active I'm granted 271 Elemental Magic Skill at present, which takes me from B+ skill to roughly A- skill territory, I believe.

So perhaps I am overthinking skill gear since full merits would put over the top for average merit situations. Theres a deep part of me that's an accuracy whore and always wants to get things as accurate as I can.

The AF body is just too damn good for most things tho, so it might be a mainstay for nukes. Its not only +15 to Elemental, but +15 to Enfeebling and Dark Magic skill as well when Dark Arts is active. AF pants also grant +15 to Enfeebling and Black Magic enfeebs are still affected by the bonus, but at a greater MP cost and Light Arts strategems won't affect them. So Enfeebling merits are always going to be good for this job either way.
.

The AF scholar body is golden for nuking. I would never take it off, even if you were fighting normal mobs. That extra +15 elemental skill really helps and I would definitely take that over the errant houppelande. (even though I see LOTS of scholars nuking in the errant body for 10 intelligence, but that's beyond me)


Ok, thanks. My INT build is arguably weak... for a Taru, anyway. which is probably just saying I'm average. I had so many main healer invites pre-72 that INT wasn't really a major concern. I suppose I'll just concern myself with Elemental/Enfeebling torque for the time being and work out those Jet Sereweels, Yigit Gages, Balrhans Ring and Elemental/Enfeebling Torques and INT gear for the time being. After I get what is purchasable, I can start farming toward those HQ staves.

Sounds like you've got a good plan. Even the errant slops will suffice if you can't afford the jet seraweels. HQ staves are of course a luxury, so I wouldn't worry about those until you get the crucial gear out of the way, which is what you're doing! :thumbsup:

[MrMageo]

Depending on what your looking at nuking it really all depends. For Hnm's etc it is really best to hit the 300 skill level before heading into MAB.

Also aim to get 110+ INT this will make up for the lost accuracy as well as offer some damage.

Personally given SCH's sub 300 skill level but able to reach an A i would look at getting INT to 110+ followed by skill gear. Once you have reached the 110/300 level work in MAB. MAB only adds to the damage you will do to mobs after INT is calculated so it is best to make sure your INT is going to beat a Mob's handidly before using MAB.

(This is how i look at enfeebling skill on rdm breaking the 110/300 barrier allows me to stick enfeebs sans staff. so this should make your nukes resistance levels drop. It should also work if you do it with enfeebling as well.)

[Omgwtfbbqkitten]

Just out of curiosity, what's the concensus on the new Cobra Unit Mage gear? I'm still a ways off from even getting Yigit Feet since I juggle two characters in both Assault and Campaign, so I just kinda hop on what Assaults I see for now to spam for points.

The feet look really good with +22 HP/MP and +3% MAB, but the legs also look good, but I'm unsure if the MAB on those is enough to outweigh what Errant or Jet Seraweels would offer.

There was a lot of other nice stuff put in the update, particularly the staves, sheild and mace that caught my interest. Well and Ixion's Cape and Clock, along with the MAB Cape and Numerist Pump from ZNMs. Kinda pissed SCH got shafted on the Oracle set, though. OH, but lolBRD gets it >.>;

[Mog]

I'd rather take the +2 MaB, +3 int from the yigit crackows than the +3 MaB from the cobra feet.

Same deal with the legs... 8 intelligence from mahatma slops far far far outweighs +2 MaB that the Cobra Unit Trews offer.

Don't even get me started on the cobra hat and hands. > .>

Just stick with what you've got. lol

[WishMaster3K]

BBQ, just check out Kaeko's posts, lol..

I'm not a BLM nor SCH, but I can say that with the Elemental Torque, HQ Staff and capped Elemental, I consistently pull off 600ish Blizzard IIIs. Then again, I capped Ice Potency, so I might be biased.

For exp, your skill should be fine, and you should stack MAB, since, unless I'm mistaken, it's a multiplying factor.

For HNMs, Kaeko recommended getting above 320 skill, then going for MAB. The thing is, last time he posted that, it was nigh impossible for SCH to get over 320.

[Mog]

I'm not a BLM nor SCH, but I can say that with the Enfeebling Torque, HQ Staff and capped Elemental, I consistently pull off 600ish Blizzard IIIs. Then again, I capped Ice Potency, so I might be biased.


Elemental torque you mean?

[Callisto]

Or Spider! j/k j/k!

Anyways to BBQ, also keep in mind that SCH has a relatively small MAB boost of +20 with /RDM, and none native, important because the MAB you can add in will have a more noticeable effect that it would to a BLM. However for high-end mobs you have both a lot of skill and alot of INT to make up. I would personally take Yigit hands for manaburn merit-type situations. You won't see a noticeable damage difference between them and Vicious Mufflers, and 5 INT is a huge chunk for the hands. For higher things I'd toss it up between those and Genie Gages, if you don't want to pay for them and have a few friends willing to help they're pretty easy to get.

Nothing out there really compares to Yigit feet for nuking, they're worth it, I'm dying myself not having them and being stuck in Nyzul at the moment.

For legs, really every bit counts and Mahatma Slops are relatively cheap, not much more than Jet Seraweels last I checked. If you're going to spend money on the Jets just save a bit more for Mahatmas.

And yeah, Cobra gear is decent for 68-72ish, but nowhere near optimal in any slot past that.

[LyonheartLakshmi]

If we're talking nuking here, MAB will always trump INT, and +skill is really for resist rates (ignore my job levels please -.- I actually have played BLM to 60 on my taru and have been hovering various BLM forums for years; I do know what I'm talking about)
It's an oversimplification to say that MAB will always trump INT. The break even point is around 2 INT in exchange for MAB +1, though it also depends on which nuke in particular and how much MAB you already have. Tier IVs and Tier III -gas favor even 2 INT over MAB +1, and the more MAB you already have, the less each additional point will increase your overall damage relatively speaking.

Just out of curiosity, what's the concensus on the new Cobra Unit Mage gear? I'm still a ways off from even getting Yigit Feet since I juggle two characters in both Assault and Campaign, so I just kinda hop on what Assaults I see for now to spam for points.
The +3 INT you get from Yigit Crackows will outperform the +1 MAB you would get switching to Cobra Crackows. But it's a small improvement (approximately +1 INT beyond the point where the two yield similar results). I'm in the same boat as you, where I'm not sure when I'd be able to accumulate the assault points for Yigit feet, whereas I had more than enough AN and high enough rank to get Cobra feet. If I already had Yigit feet, I would have stuck with them. And if I ever build up a decent amount of Lebros Cavern points, I'll probably switch to Yigit feet. But for now, I'm quite content with Cobra feet.

The feet look really good with +22 HP/MP and +3% MAB, but the legs also look good, but I'm unsure if the MAB on those is enough to outweigh what Errant or Jet Seraweels would offer.
As Mog mentioned, Cobra Trews are underwhelming. At only MAB +2, you're looking at a ration of 3.5 INT : 1 MAB (or 4:1 with HQ Slops).

[Omgwtfbbqkitten]

Just kinda sucks all this endgame gear comes into the update and its seems little to none of it aside from some staves, a club, a shield, a cloak and two capes were made for SCH. Meanwhile they gave BRD MAB gear for no goddamn reason.

/pout.

I'm honestly taking a bit more time with Foobar's progress anyway, since Kitten presently has the gear update and merit focus. I've put a couple merits into enfeebling and elementals so far. I still have to catch RDM up to 75 anyway >.>

[Callisto]

I don't think that SCH really missed out on much, some of the gear is extremely up in the air in terms of usefulness, and SCH already has very powerful nuking options available to it from pre-existing gear. New shinies are already nice, but really none of the new stuff really stands out in terms of nuking. Really the only thing that is 'holy crap' to me out of the new stuff for mages is Ixion Cape. Otherwise you're already better off with the options currently available.

[Malacite]

Order of the Blue Gartr • View topic - INT vs. Magic Atk. Bonus (http://www.bluegartrls.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=31&t=34610&p=1089760)

Magic Damage - BGWiki (http://wiki.bluegartrls.com/Magic_Damage)

[Taskmage]

idk if this was already assumed or we were just talking about tier IVs, but I wanted to point out that good gear for a big nuke and good gear for a good helix are different. Ripping the magic damage formula from Kaeko:

[ Base Damage + ( Caster's INT - Target's INT ) ] x MAB x Staff Bonus x Weather Bonus

Base damage for helix spells is said to be 25. So let's say you've got 100 INT and the mob has 50, blm sub on matching weather.

(25 + 50) x 124% x 110% = 102 damage

So if we take that and compare adding say Errant Hpl vs Yigit Gomlek ...

(Yigit) 75 x 129% x 110% = 106 damage
(Errant) 85 x 124% x 110% = 115 damage

The 10 points of INT ends up having over 3x the boost in damage vs 5 points of MAB.

[Omgwtfbbqkitten]

Malacite, while I understand you're trying to be helpful here, you're doing that one thing that usually pisses me off about people and how they relate to BG. You're posting links from BG, waving it around, but you don't seem to understand what that data actually means when you apply it fully to the jobs in question. You're just waving it around because it has BG associated with it and its not saying what you think it is saying.

WishMaster was right, too, I should probably just stick to Kaeko's blog, it seems to be the definitive source for SCH info at this point.

Gonna grab the CU feet as a placeholder for Yigit for now

[Malacite]

Malacite, while I understand you're trying to be helpful here, you're doing that one thing that usually pisses me off about people and how they relate to BG. You're posting links from BG, waving it around, but you don't seem to understand what that data actually means when you apply it fully to the jobs in question. You're just waving it around because it has BG associated with it and its not saying what you think it is saying.


I probably should have elaborated in my earlier post, sorry. I honestly do not understand the formulas, math is not my best subject at all > . <;


I just figured I'd put up the formulas and test data so others could glean something off it. I was always told MAB > INT because it acted as a multiplier, or something to that effect (and multipliers are generally stronger than adding to a base) but it seems like INT matters more. I knew INT added both to DMG and resist rates but I was positive MAB had a more potent impact.

[Taskmage]

MAB is better when you're already working with a large D value. If you're swinging with Thunder IV which has a base D of 541, you do a lot better increasing that value by 5% (mab+5) than by 5 (int+5). Because the initial damage of helixes is so low, percentage increases to it don't count for nearly as much.

[Temagori]

Just thought I would add that Ixion Cape is unusable by SCH at this point in time. ; ; And since it was released quite abit after SCH I don't really see SE giving it to us. I personally gear myself much to the mindset that Taskmage has.

Prism Cape, Powerful Rope, Errant Slops(Want Mahatma, but that's just cuz I'm a HQ whore :P) Atm Rostrum, Diamond Ring, Tamas, Errant Hands, SCH AF Body, SCH AF Head(Because INT +4 and more sub is nice), Aquilo's Staff, Bugard Strap +1, as a neck I only have Fenrir's Torque and the Mohbwa Neckpiece, and I wear the Modly and Loquacious for my earrings.

I did however get to borrow the Novio and the ele torque for Dynamis-San d'Oria and it enhanced my nukes significantly. I went from averageing unresisted Blizz 4's at 890ish to 1150ish. With just those two pieces..

I actually switch to Errant Body for my helixes because I have noticed that as long as I'm not resisted I do proc for more. Klimaform always helps obviously when you can.

I do prefer the Goliard feet over the Yigit tbh. Since we can't quite get as high of elemental magic skill with gear etc I prefer the magic acc that the goliard give because they also give a nice healthy int boost. It's all about your personal style tbh and since I am an Elvaan and your a taru you may find more benefit in the Yigit.

I hope that helps, if even only a little.

[LyonheartLakshmi]

If we're talking nuking here, MAB will always trump INT, and +skill is really for resist rates (ignore my job levels please -.- I actually have played BLM to 60 on my taru and have been hovering various BLM forums for years; I do know what I'm talking about)
I probably should have elaborated in my earlier post, sorry. I honestly do not understand the formulas, math is not my best subject at all > . <;


I just figured I'd put up the formulas and test data so others could glean something off it. I was always told MAB > INT because it acted as a multiplier, or something to that effect (and multipliers are generally stronger than adding to a base) but it seems like INT matters more. I knew INT added both to DMG and resist rates but I was positive MAB had a more potent impact.
{Hmmm.}

[Omgwtfbbqkitten]

Yeah, I do seem to be leaning to Goliard Feet more than Yigit, just for the accuracy. Dunno how many statics would just want to go to 20th floor, though. I guess I could work on other Goliard for RDM, but I'd prefer to do Nyzul on Kitten a bit more since I want Quicksilver and Denali, too.

This is what I get for having two characters, but at least its a lot easier to manage now that both have CoPs done.

Anyway, I actually favor T4s more than I do the Helix spells. Not that the Helix spells aren't worth it, the T4s are just easier to magic burst or cast more quickly. The Helix spells are great for killing off high mob regen and such, though.

[Temagori]

Well I like to solo on SCH and you have no idea how much those help on the Flans lol. Again, truthfully at this point I'm only swapping in one piece that I already carry on me for resting anyhow so it's not too big a deal. ^^

[Callisto]

A lot can depend on your support as well, Helixes obliterate everything in terms of MP efficiency in most situations, I would think only maxed Bio III would be a close contender in fights where helixes are likely to hit resists. If you're in a situation where MP conservation is an issue then Helixes will probably always win out, not to mention that I'm pretty sure they make a considerably smaller amount of hate than T4 bombs.

If you're comfortable using Strategems often enough to Celerity/Penury all your T4s then that may be different, I personally don't know how strained a 75 SCH is for Strategem charges but I personally play all my jobs somewhat stingy in that I always try to leave at least one up, i.e. I almost always bank my second QD charge on COR or Sentinel on PLD for just in case situations.

[Omgwtfbbqkitten]

Melee based mobs solo - I favor Parsimony/T4 over everything else.

MP mob solo - I rotate Parsimony/T4 and rotate Alacrity/Aspir in during sleeps. If you play this right, you can end up with practically all the MP you started with on some mobs. I've had very little downtime between Phaubos, regardless of what they conned.

[Karinya]

Yeah, I do seem to be leaning to Goliard Feet more than Yigit, just for the accuracy. Dunno how many statics would just want to go to 20th floor, though. I guess I could work on other Goliard for RDM, but I'd prefer to do Nyzul on Kitten a bit more since I want Quicksilver and Denali, too.
Wouldn't a static hang around on a given floor until its members had what they needed there, and then go higher?

A static of non-assholes, I mean. I don't know why you would get into the other sort.

[Malacite]

< _ >


Okay, bad wording on my part Lyon. I've personally always found +MAB to be most effective, but then again that was using a taru BLM blasting tier 3's on top of what seemed like a consensus among numerous BLM forums.


Interesting to find out that INT is best for Helixes though, thanks for the info TM. Argh, just makes retiring my taru all the more painful.

Elvaan INT {Too Weak}

[LyonheartLakshmi]

< _ >


Okay, bad wording on my part Lyon. I've personally always found +MAB to be most effective, but then again that was using a taru BLM blasting tier 3's on top of what seemed like a consensus among numerous BLM forums.


Interesting to find out that INT is best for Helixes though, thanks for the info TM. Argh, just makes retiring my taru all the more painful.

Elvaan INT {Too Weak}
To be fair, if level 60 was the highest you reached as BLM, then your choices for MAB gear was fairly limited. Pretty much any piece of gear you can wear up to level 60 that has MAB has so much of it that it's worth wearing -- Modavite with MAB +5, Bastokan/Republic Circlet with MAB +3/+5, Sorcerer's Ring with MAB +10. The only MAB "trap" item I could see at that level is Bitter Corset.

It's not until you reach the 70s where you get gear options with small enough amounts of MAB that are clearly out classed by the +INT alternatives.

[Malacite]

Yeah I can see that now having browsed some of the available BLM gear. Even still, stuff like Morrigan's looks like it really outclasses other gear (but then that's an extreme case I suppose, being one of the l337 Salvage armors)

[Omgwtfbbqkitten]

Wouldn't a static hang around on a given floor until its members had what they needed there, and then go higher?

I have two characters, which make is a little tricky. I can't join a static on Kitten because I need to lead one to get floors recorded to do COR relic. If we had people working on two or more discs, then I could slip to Foobar on the Floor repeats on the days we'd do it.

There's just one thing Kitten needs from Assault and my Nyzul obstacles are mostly removed to taking them both through Nyzul.

A static of non-assholes, I mean. I

Such a thing exists? I always seem to get one per sucessful static, all the ones with good people just fall apart early :P

[WishMaster3K]

In addition to MP Efficiency ratio to Damage, Helix's also benefit from casting time.

Unless you're stacking it with a JA, or have superior timing, a T4 might get you popped in the back of the head untimely.

I know that with movement speed gear, this is a non-existant problem for exp, but a lot of NMs have bonuses to their movement, and a Gravity / Stoneskin wear at the wrong time = Death. ; ;

And Helixes are SCH Specific, so I feel they have merit in usability. How many Helixes can be on at a certain time? Because they can do above the damage of a T3 for less than the MP cost...

[Malacite]

I'm fairly certain you can only have 1 helix active on a mob (due to the insane DoT they do)

[MrMageo]

Just to expand on your INT vs MAB vs Skill trouble some more I have acctually been running some tests with my 75 RDM, my brothers 75 BLM and a friends 75 SCH(as he is in the same situation you seem to be in).

So far from the testing we have done (puddings and wamoura) I have found for myself as a RDM with such low elemental skill (just recently bumped it to 283 and I dont know if can go much higher). I find that INT helps alot more on the higher level enemies (in comparison to skill level). Al though it is hard to determine if it is acctually the INT carrying the additional accuracy (which I beleive is the case), and the fact it hasnt been tested conclusivley, but the assumption is roughly 2 INT= .9 accuracy when your skill is >200.

Now in comparision to the MAB gear, I noticed while I did manage several nukes at full damage, they were moderatley higher, then the ones I hit full with an INT set up. However the drawback was only several of the ones I casted hit for full damage, my accuracy dropped greatly when focusing on MAB instead of INT.

Now the SCH we were with found the same trouble, he was getting resisted in MAB gear even with a 281 skill (dark arts+torque+earring). Albeit when he did hit unresisted he was pushing 1.2-1.3K nukes with MAB gear he found he was more consistently hitting 1K+ nukes in a full INT spread .

Now in comparison to the BLM who was able to go all out in MAB/INT gear and not focus to hard on skill. But we know how BLM can maximize and not sch.

If im not mistaken SCH can only get MAB 2 from subbing BLM(mine is only 37 atm so im not overly sure) but thats low building block (which is why I dont overly MAB myself on RDM). If you figure optimal setup may net you +20 MAB that only puts you at a 44% increase. So a nuke with a base of 540 is only getting bumped to 776, where as if you dropped on +40-50 INT gear to increase the DIF

your looking at lets say for arguments sake 50% of available INT (should be high 70's for a taru mage/blm +50 = 120 so 60 damage aprox)

540+60*1.24= 744 a loss of about 30 damage, however if INT does infact affect accuracy you are gaining
50/2*.90= 22.5
22.5 points of ACC provided this is the correct formula and function (which I beleive is pretty close judging from nuking on my rdm.)

Even still if you do wear some higher +INT gear and some other MAB gear that dosent take up a high +INT slot (such as moldy earring) you can essentially be looking at with just that adjustment

744*1.05= 781 so your beating your damage from an MAB setup, with +50INT and 1 additional source of MAB.

I think in the case of nonBLM jobs INT is a much better focus simply because we start back from a BLM in terms of damage already.

32% boost from MAB4 vs 24% from MAB2.

Personally I would go with a pure INT+ build, even though their is no hard evidence of it providing MACC it will provide you with an equal damage floor (not to mention increase potency on all black magic spells something MAB does not do.)
Depending on the INT = MACC thing you may be able to survive on merits and INT to successfully land your spells. INT>MAB if not a blm other jbs just dont have the initial power.

[Mog]

Personally I would go with a pure INT+ build, even though their is no hard does not do.

Good god, this is flawed in every sense of the word. Don't spread this to other black mages/scholars <.>. You do not want purely intelligence. If you have intelligence....and nothing but intelligence, you're missing out on the potential that extra MaB can give you.

It all depends on what you're fighting, but for puddings, you want to stack intelligence and MaB, so you get the benefit of the additional damage from the base damage the int gives.

For higher end mobs, stick int and elemental skill and less on MaB. Int and skill both ensure that you will stick nukes that won't get resisted.

[Omgwtfbbqkitten]

MrMageo, I don't know if you've ever noticed, but when people ask questions on these forums, they're generally not interested in hearing your answers.

Malacite, from what I've read elsewhere, Helixes do stack. They're recognized by the system as Elemental Magic (i.e. nukes) so there is no reason for them to cancel out each other. One SCH can cast Pyrohelix and I could cast Cryohelix and the effects would still stack.

I don't have a problem with the Helix spells, its just that like any other DoT spell out there, you have to be in a situation that justifies it. If its a mob that requires some degree of sleep control, its not an option. If the situation doesn't call for sleep control, helix away.

[MrMageo]

Ya w/e BBQ you build your SCH how you want, I suppose you can run it around with your ranger that doesn't pull, your COR who refuses to use corsair roll, and your bard who doesn't offer up madrigal.

You asked about gear choices I offered my knolwedge of casting nukes with a crappy elemental skill (283 which is higher than yours), and a crappy MAB skill (which is also higher than yours unless your /BLM @24%) From the looks of it were working from pretty well the same location except you got bigger spells. Which really hurt when they miss and only hit for <200.

The INT will also help you with Helix spells

((YourINT -1) - EnemyINT) + 25 * Weather Bonus * Magic Attack Bonus) -is the suspect formula as per wiki.

you have 120 int vs a mob with 70 (SCH/BLM)

(120-1)-70)+25*1.10*1.24 = 83.1

against a set up of +20 MAB @ 100INT

100-1-70+25*1.10*1.44= 85.5

again virtually the exact same, now if INT does infact increase accuracy like I said in my last post it is the clincher for RDM and SCH to use, simply due to our lack of MAB if you took the same spell assuming a blm could cast helix

100-1-70+25*1.10*1.52= 90

another 5 point difference for 8 MAB provided BLM could use it, however it can't that is just simply to show you since you seem oblivious to the fact MAB is virtually Identical to INT in terms of damage for a SCH or RDM.

[Callisto]

I distinctly remember the inital SCH findings all saying the Helixes(Helices?) do not stack, although I suppose it would be really easy to test if you had a second SCH to spend a few seconds with, you cast yours, they cast theirs, if you both get the wearing off message then it does, if only they do it doesn't. I don't suppose you have another SCH friend that you could do a quick test with?

Edit: Who the hell uses SCH/BLM?

[Malacite]

o. O Really? The initial testing on it said otherwise. Now adimittedly my SCH is only 37 but I distinctly recall seeing on a number of threads that only 1 can be placed on a mob...

Lebross Cavern just got bent over...

[Taskmage]

The INT will also help you with Helix spells

((YourINT -1) - EnemyINT) + 25 * Weather Bonus * Magic Attack Bonus) -is the suspect formula as per wiki.

you have 120 int vs a mob with 70 (SCH/BLM)

(120-1)-70)+25*1.10*1.24 = 83.1

against a set up of +20 MAB @ 100INT

100-1-70+25*1.10*1.44= 85.5

again virtually the exact same, now if INT does infact increase accuracy like I said in my last post it is the clincher for RDM and SCH to use, simply due to our lack of MAB if you took the same spell assuming a blm could cast helix

100-1-70+25*1.10*1.52= 90

another 5 point difference for 8 MAB provided BLM could use it, however it can't that is just simply to show you since you seem oblivious to the fact MAB is virtually Identical to INT in terms of damage for a SCH or RDM.This math is all wrong because the parenthesis are in the wrong place. You're applying MAB and weather bonuses only to the base damage of the spell and then adding the INT difference to that value instead of incorporating dINT into the D value for the spell. At any rate it's already been established that INT is way better for helixes (helices or w/e) than MAB but bbq is primarily interested in improving Tier IVs.

I prioritize nuking gear like this: skill > mab > int. My philosophy is that any mob worth nuking is going to be a decently high level and likely to resist, which I want to reduce as much as possible. Skill is the best at that. After that obviously I want to do more damage, which mab is better at followed by int, so I fill as many slots as I can with mab and fill in anything else with int.

[Callisto]

Well RDM is slightly different than SCH there too, aside from a few exceptions, most of your bigtime INT slots are not also bigtime MAB slots, pretty much just Houppelande vs. Gomlek, and in that case they're practically equal in damage so I'd always take the Houppelande for slightly less resists and enmity, as well as the inventory+1 of not carrying Gomlek for nuking.

Otherwise, most RDM MAB is either in the hands or earrings, hands you can get a big chunk of MAB which generally outdoes the 4-5 INT you'll get out of the slot otherwise, and the +8-10 available from the legs really is too much to take whatever dinky MAB you can get from Cobra Gear in that slot.

SCH on the other hand has to make tough choices between skill, INT, and MAB all at the same time, between AF Body being thrown in the mix and their skill being low enough to seriously consider Genie Gages, and to a lesser extend Torque over Uggalepih Pendant for anything high-end.