Mezraq dethroned?

[Karinya]

Mezraq: DMG:93 Delay:492 STR+2 VIT+2 Additional effect: Impairs evasion
Thalassocrat: DMG:94 Delay:492 HP+10 DEX+2 VIT+2 Enhances "Resist Virus" effect Additional effect: Impairs evasion

AFAIK, the proc is the same, and for most purposes resist virus and +10 hp can be ignored. (If you were choosing a weapon for survivability in something like solo or campaign you'd choose Iron Ram Lance anyway.) So basically the tradeoff is 2 STR on Mezraq vs. 1 DMG and 2 DEX on Thalassocrat (plus the atk/acc those stats produce, which is either 1 or 2 points depending on rounding.)

Both STR and DEX have several useful effects, so it's hard to gauge how overall DPS would be affected by changing between the two (keeping all other factors constant). Probably there wouldn't be any very noticeable difference.

Jacaranda lumber doesn't have any AH history on my server, but if it's not completely ridiculous to obtain, Thalassocrat could be a hell of a lot cheaper to make than Mezraq (which is absurdly expensive ever since Salvage came out, because of the resulting enormous demand for imperial wootz). The other ingredients aren't anything too horrible (adaman ingots, which are likely to fall once more people start doing the new past-Bastok quest and replace all the ones sucked out of the economy for GB7).

[Mog]

Price of Mezraq has dropped drastically on Seraph.

Seems people are akin to the Thalassocrat

[Vyuru]

Jacaranda lumber is going for about 200,000 on my server. It took me about, oh, an hour, to an hour and a half of logging to get one I think. Kinda hard to say exactly because I spent a couple of attempts at it, with and without competition. Plus I had to find the logging points.

Myself personally, I think the Thalassocrat is probably the better of the two. The Mezraq has only dropped in price because of so many being sold at once. I'd expect it's price to pick back up after the inital rush is over.

Also, I thought that 1 point of damage is worth something like 4 Str, or is that wrong?

[Karinya]

It's not wrong, exactly, but it's misleading. STR has many effects and one of them is that approximately 4 fSTR (your STR - target's VIT, and normally a DRG can't change their target's VIT) = +1 DMG. But if the only difference between two weapons were 1 DMG vs. 4 STR, the 4 STR weapon would be better: str also gives you more atk, and is a modifier for a lot of ws (including most/all polearm ws).

Between the Thalassocrat being much cheaper to synth, and having near-equal or possibly superior stats, I doubt if many more mezraqs will be synthed ever again. What would be the point? (Unless SE introduces another source of khroma and makes imperial wootz reasonably priced...)

[eticket109]

If you already have a Mezraq, there's no reason not to hang on to it.

If you're choosing between the two and buying/crafting one, go with the Thalassocrat.

I logged the Jacaranda log and it took about 3 days. The easter even didn't help either. lol

[Sabaron]

If you already have a Mezraq, there's no reason not to hang on to it.

I would disagree with that characterization. Mezraq has a large price tag. If you can ride a price disparity between Mezraq and Thalassocrat then you can stand to make a good bit of cash off of the trade without losing any combat effectiveness. You just have to strike when the moment is right.

[eticket109]

I would disagree with that characterization. Mezraq has a large price tag. If you can ride a price disparity between Mezraq and Thalassocrat then you can stand to make a good bit of cash off of the trade without losing any combat effectiveness. You just have to strike when the moment is right.

With the current market for it, that won't happen any time soon. I could see it as a possiblilty down the line but I don't expect the price to ever really recover. Prices are at 33-50% of what they were before the update and the Thalassocrat is more costly now despite the cheaper ingredients.

The difference between the two seems mostly negligible.

So currently, if you have a Mezraq, you can hold onto it and be just as viable as you were before. The problem is, most of us went 'oooh! shiny!' when we saw the new polearm and in the process destroyed the old market.

[Sevv]

Mezraq out parses the new lance.

[Karinya]

This isn't a very helpful statement standing alone. Against what mobs, in what party setup, with what merits and food, wearing what other gear? Does it beat Thalassocrat in regular damage, jump damage, WS damage (with what WS?) or some combination, and by how much?

And in particular, how long was the parse and how statistically significant is the difference?

Thalassocrat should crit *slightly* more, because of the dex, and also be *slightly* more accurate; but in a short parse either or both effects could be swamped by luck.

[Sevv]

This isn't a very helpful statement standing alone. Against what mobs, in what party setup, with what merits and food, wearing what other gear? Does it beat Thalassocrat in regular damage, jump damage, WS damage (with what WS?) or some combination, and by how much?

And in particular, how long was the parse and how statistically significant is the difference?

Thalassocrat should crit *slightly* more, because of the dex, and also be *slightly* more accurate; but in a short parse either or both effects could be swamped by luck.

Trying to get the parse log from a friend.

ABout identical gear, about 670 fights, merits about the same. Mamools target difference about 4%.

[Vyuru]

How can a Mezraq outparse the new lance?

The main difference between the two of them is Mezraq has a damage rating of 93 and +2Str, Thalassocrat has a damage rating of 94 and +2Dex.

I could be wrong, but I just can't see +2str beating out +1 extra damage on WS, Jumps, and normal hits.

Trying to get the parse log from a friend.

ABout identical gear, about 670 fights, merits about the same. Mamools target difference about 4%.


Could you post the gear and the merits? I'm a little bit suspicious that the reason that the Mezraq parsed higher is due to the difference between the two gear/merit setups. The difference between the two weapons is so small that they should be fairly close, and I'd expect the new lance to be slightly ahead of the Mezraq.

[Sevv]

I know the merits:
5 jump
5 high jump
3 angon
3 deep breathing
8 polearm
5 str
4 crit

of the merits that would effect the parse.

[Yellow Mage]

effect the parse

Affect.

/nitpick

[Murphie]

Dude, it's Sevv. You just kind of have to roll with that sort of thing.

[Yellow Mage]

Sorry, I forgot. ^^;

[Sevv]

damn right i fail more when i just wake up lol can't believe i fucked that one up tbh

[LilithAngel]

Very easy mistake. :evil:

[Sevv]

but the attack rating for both polearms should be almost identical when equipped, I haven't equipped either cuz my drg never sees the light of day lol.

[Karinya]

Yeah, I call shenanigans on a 4% difference in either direction. The stats are way too similar to see that kind of difference without a second confounding influence.

Damage is a zero-sum game - the total damage dealt by the party to a given mob is limited to its HP, plus overkill (which is always less than one hit). So any change in a party member will change your damage per fight too.

[ItachiKujata]

I don't think a 4% difference is significant enough to be conclusive. Even if equipment were identical, you'd probably still get a +-5% difference because one person was faster at targeting and attacking or one person was better at knowing when to WS... what would have been nice to see is have those same people parse 50 battles one way and then switch weapons and parse another 50 battles...

[eticket109]

Attack is actually less with the Thalassocrat equipped. I think it was one point off.

Honestly, I'll use it because it just looks better. It's not enough of a difference either way to make one better or worse imo.