The new Automaton Weapon skills!

[Guren]

From the look of the pictures released on the main site, it looks like it is a melee weapon skill. For the Puppetmasters around the world who went max magic merits and then saved their merits in other stats just for this situation, we now know we have at least 1 new melee weapon skill.

This weapon skill could be exclusive to the magic using automatons, or to both the Valoredge and magic using Automatons. Hopefully every single automaton will have their own exclusive weapon skill that is powerful enough to change the minds of those nonbelievers of Puppetmaster not being an incredible job.

Puppetmaster seems to be getting a nice boost in this next update. Just a heads up for all the Puppetmasters of Ffxionline!

~Takiri

Edit: What what weapon skills would you all like to see the Automatons learn? Name, effect, and what element skill chain. (An Automaton light making WS would be nice. ^_^)

[ioshua]

As I posted in the other thread, I'm iffy about adding more weaponskills. The elemental priority system for the already existing skills can be cumbersome at times, especially if you want to use a nonstandard maneuver setup for whatever reason. If I could, I'd straight up turn off Accura and Slapstick as there is often no reason to use them. Even when forming skillchains the damage you gain from the chain rarely makes up for the damage you lose off the ws itself.

That issue will likely be even more glaring when using an Inhibitor. Maybe they'll do it right but the cynic in me is saying it'll just make things more messy and unreliable. Imo, they need to install some dip switches so we can disable skills we have no desire to use, the maneuver based system just won't cut it as numbers of skills increase. As it stands, being able to force a higher skill with a specific maneuver is fine but the system will become more complex (have to have multiples? combinations?) as more skills go in just by the nature of the limited possibilities involved.

Here's to hoping that more info comes soon. :)

[KingOfZeal]

I'm interested in seeing what these new ones are, and regardless if we like them or not, SE isn't going to be taking them away. If it's something we don't like, we'd just have to adapt, as we always do.

Also, a quick note about what you said with the Inhibitor -- I was duoing with a BST a little while ago, and I was set up to do One Inch Punch -> Daze for a very nice SC (Transfixion for 200+). But, since I didn't like Nut firing off a Daze without me, I put on the Inhibitor. After that, he never fired Daze again with the Inhibitor. Instead, he would go One Inch Punch -> Acuballista for a very small amount of damage, both on the WS and the SC.

I'm kinda hoping that there may be a little bit of a fix to that in the coming update, but it's not likely.

And, we'll see what the update all entails tomorrow.

[ioshua]

Weird, I always get Daze off of One Inch. Getting Acura off of it would make me a sad panda.

[Guren]

I'm interested in seeing what these new ones are, and regardless if we like them or not, SE isn't going to be taking them away. If it's something we don't like, we'd just have to adapt, as we always do.

Also, a quick note about what you said with the Inhibitor -- I was duoing with a BST a little while ago, and I was set up to do One Inch Punch -> Daze for a very nice SC (Transfixion for 200+). But, since I didn't like Nut firing off a Daze without me, I put on the Inhibitor. After that, he never fired Daze again with the Inhibitor. Instead, he would go One Inch Punch -> Acuballista for a very small amount of damage, both on the WS and the SC.

I'm kinda hoping that there may be a little bit of a fix to that in the coming update, but it's not likely.

And, we'll see what the update all entails tomorrow.

With Inhibitor and Fire maker and Attuner, get 100% TP on automaton, have automaton stop attacking, and then finally, get 100%TP your self. Now heres the best part!

Spinning attack -> 3 Fire Manuevers (Already active) Daze = 700-1.1k damage Daze (On greater Colibri) + a 300-500 Damage Fusion. With fusion, theres a chance you can make light if you have a monk with Dragon Kick for huge damage all together.

It is by far the best puppetmaster + automaton combo out for weapon skill wise.

Just deactivate and activate for hateless automaton, or just ventriloquy.

~Takiri

Hope you find this helpful :D

[Malacite]

Here's a lot of great info from BG forums.


Order of the Blue Gartr • View topic - March 10th Puppetmaster WS testing~ (http://www.bluegartrls.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=31002)

original post by "Jkun"

Feel free to move this topic once the update hype is over. *It's 5:30am and I'm very tired :(*

Here's some basic testing on the new WSs. Any more info on Skillchain openers/closers, or any Damage increase modifiers are welcome. Speculations too, if you keep on the subject at hand. :D

:nomnomnom: Valoredge Frame (Level 75, 5/5 Melee Merits, full Melee/Acc setup):

As stated before, the new WS "Bone Crusher" is indeed a three-fold attack using both the sword and shield of Valor's frame to perform. Here's some test I ran:

No Maneuvers: Default Bone Crusher (will replace Chimera Ripper and String Clipper, woo!), roughly did 469~500 DMG on Colibri outside Al Zhabi.
Earth: Forced Chimera Ripper
Fire: Forced Chimera Ripper
Lightning: Forced String Clipper
Light: Forced Bone Crusher
Darkness: Forced Cannibal Blade

This is a great upgrade from the pansy, low level WSs, but maybe Hammermill or Earth-based items can increase it's damage? As always, Darkness forces Cannibal Blade, in case you need to top up your automaton's HP.

:invader: Sharpshot Frame (Level 75, 0 Ranged Merits, full Melee/RAcc setup including Target Marker):

Sharpshot's new "Armour Piercer" is nothing to lol about this time round.

No Maneuvers: Default Armour Piercer (will replace Arcuballista only if enemy is weak to piercing?), roughly did 1469~1600 DMG on Colibri outside Al Zhabi.
Wind: Forced Armour Piercer
Fire: Forced Arcuballista (;________;)
Lightning: Forced Daze
Light: Forced Armour Piercer
Darkness: Forced Armour Piercer

Wow. This new WS is incredible. The damage, the animation, the screeching sound effect, it's all there. And luckily, some useful maneuvers help force it such as Wind. You'll need this up anyway for a small increase in RAcc, and for Replicator since the automaton miiight pull hate with this one. Lightning forces Daze, as always.

:boaboa: Stormwaker/Soulsoother Frame (Level 75, 5/5 Magic Merits, 5/5 Melee Merits, Melee/Curing solo setup including Target Marker):

The Harlequin/Stormwaker frame has been decked out with a very useless confusing WS called "Magic Mortar". As of now, this WS could potentially be bugged or broken. The WS Damage depends on your Automaton's current HP. (carefully tested using Role Reversal and an MP-less automaton)

No Maneuvers: Default Magic Mortar (will replace Knockout), Did 0 damage on Colibri outside Al Zhabi. full HP.
Ice: Forced Magic Mortar
Wind: Forced Knockout
Fire: Forced Slapstick
Lightning: Forced Slapstick
Water: Forced Magic Mortar
Light: Forced Magic Mortar
Darkness: Forced Magic Mortar

This is the most useless WS of them all. Unfortunately, it replaces Knockout as the default WS, so if you solo or use Soulsoother in a party, your automaton will NEVER have low HP unless it runs out of MP or you stick a melee head on it for lulz.

- Notes courtesy of Lotan: Even if Mortar hits for 0, if the master uses Dragon Kick after it, you can successfully make a Light Skillchain. Tested and proved true. The extra damage seems to just a little bit better than a solo Howling Fist or Raging Fists, and you get to see the many disco balls while soloing.
- Thanks to Kurri, Magic Morter is also forced by Water.

Hope this helps clean up a few questions. No new attachments this update, but let's hope they keep bringing us some nice surprises.

[Tule]

If you read on other forum, Magic Mortar is the strongest ws out of all of them. I've seen screenshots of it doing almost 4k dmg as well as doing 2500ish to HNMs like Kirin and JoL. I havn't tested it out myself since it requires really low hp to do good dmg.

[Malacite]

An LS mate of mine is apparently able to do 3700 dmg to Byakko with it.

[Guren]

http://img233.imageshack.us/img233/1295/pupdmgsmallerrf5.png (http://imageshack.us)


Bam!

[Malacite]

:shocked:

Eat that all you "lolPUP" people :evil:

[KingOfZeal]

It's a shame I can't play with that yet... Most estimates have it at around 235 skill, my cap right now is only 220's.

[Guren]

Can someone post a link of that on Allakhazam on there for me? I really don't feel like making an account on there. This was done when I wasn't at 100% power on my puppetmaster.

This is just one of my minimum hits. I am really tired of lolpup people and crap.

Puppetmaster is a job in FFXI and almost all jobs are balanced enough for them all to be played and invited. They have all their high points. Puppetmaster will not be forgotten again after this.

~Pup

[Omgwtfbbqkitten]

There will always be an LOL<job>. The SAM bandwagon has been rekindled by the update and lolSAMS now follow in its wake.

If not for its lacking design it will be because the majority of players who pick a given job will opt to play it poorly.

PUP suffers from the same issue DRG was facing for years - Poor design and even more players behind it. PUP is brilliant in the hands of a skilled player and horrible in the hands of a player who's just rushing it to 75. Much like a BST must be dedicated to crafting and melee gear and subjobs to stand out, a PUP must be dedicated to gearing, subjobs and also hunting down the attachments to make the automation really shine.

[Akashimo]

With that damage.... I'll take an order of PuppetMaster, hold the lolSam, extra Drg, double Bst and kingsize the Blm.

[Guren]

There will always be an LOL<job>. The SAM bandwagon has been rekindled by the update and lolSAMS now follow in its wake.

If not for its lacking design it will be because the majority of players who pick a given job will opt to play it poorly.

PUP suffers from the same issue DRG was facing for years - Poor design and even more players behind it. PUP is brilliant in the hands of a skilled player and horrible in the hands of a player who's just rushing it to 75. Much like a BST must be dedicated to crafting and melee gear and subjobs to stand out, a PUP must be dedicated to gearing, subjobs and also hunting down the attachments to make the automation really shine.

Spoken like a true Puppeteer :D

[Tule]

Don't need an account on allakhazam to read forums but I got some of the links from there.

http://i62.photobucket.com/albums/h94/Zz10143478/MandyMM2.jpg
http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh196/Psionphoenix/img_20080315_214117.png
http://i18.photobucket.com/albums/b113/Darkdoom/03-15-08_2101.jpg
http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh196/Psionphoenix/img_20080315_034223.png

[Jaice]

From what i've read on the new weaponskill for the mage frame it's damage is proportonate to it's hp, do you just keep it more or less in the red when it's TP gets up there for a skill chain? How would you go about setting this skill chain up? Sorry.... my skills are no where near what I'm going to need to launch this anytime soon but dedication leads to rewarding explosions :)

[Guren]

From what i've read on the new weaponskill for the mage frame it's damage is proportonate to it's hp, do you just keep it more or less in the red when it's TP gets up there for a skill chain? How would you go about setting this skill chain up? Sorry.... my skills are no where near what I'm going to need to launch this anytime soon but dedication leads to rewarding explosions :)

The easiest way to set it up is to make sure you have the Inhibitor attachment on your automaton. Them, get your automaton's HP to about 1%-10% remaining. It will cure itself over and over. Once he runs out of MP get the HP back down to 1%-10%

Now, the skillchain is as follows.

Dragon Kick -> Magic Motar = Light Skillchain.

Have a blast :D

[Malacite]

<. < that is seriously hawt. 7000+ DMG Light chain WOW wtf. Reminds me of that DRK who did the 11k Darkness but that was on a Qutrub... dear god what would this do to one of those O O;


Now let's just hope morons don't start bandwagonning PUP. Bunch of hypocrites > < (I was initially against the job due to my desire to see mystic knight added to the game, but I've long since been a rather big fan of the job. Mine's only lv 10 but that's more because of the expense of attachments and not lack of interest. Plus I want Maat's cap >< )

[Akashimo]

I've been curious to level pup but 3 things stopped me. 1 the lolpup statements, 2 gil for parts 3 which character.

Even now I can't figure out the last two to kick down so I can actually touch leveling it.

[Guren]

We tested a new way to use it effectively. Use massive HP minusing gear on the PUP and then role reversal at the start. Right away you will have instant low HP on automaton. Once he does Magic motar you can Ventriloquy to get rid of hate and then repair the automaton and do it again.

Amazingness is over 9000!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Jaice]

We tested a new way to use it effectively. Use massive HP minusing gear on the PUP and then role reversal at the start. Right away you will have instant low HP on automaton. Once he does Magic motar you can Ventriloquy to get rid of hate and then repair the automaton and do it again.

Amazingness is over 9000!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

HA! Nice! Thanks for the tip! I knew there had to be a faster way to get this set up rather than having the monster beat on your puppet then try to get hate back before the weaponskill. Role Reversal... I never thought to use that power in it's reverse... instead of using the skill if your puppet is almost dead... you get to almost kill your puppet when your hp is low :) wow... the posibilities are just jazzy! :rofl:

[Celeal]

That sound interesting. May I ask what gear set/combination can use to achieve this massive negative HP swapping?

Added: May as well sub DRK to help lose HP a bit quicker by using Soul Eater.

[Guren]

PUP can use astrals and errent gear which swaps HP for MP and also loses HP on the Errent. PUP has most mage gear and can lower their HP for this very easy.

It requires almost no effort too :D

[Jaice]

PUP can use astrals and errent gear which swaps HP for MP and also loses HP on the Errent. PUP has most mage gear and can lower their HP for this very easy.

It requires almost no effort too :D

I've been thinking about that.... why do we have all of this mage gear? With the limited weapons we can use you'd think that the far eastern mnk/nin/sam gear would be beneficial to use for hth combat. I know that gear option is just a pipe dream that SE will never allow. I'm trying to figure out what subjob to use in the long run for my PuP and White or Redmage seems the most viable thanks to all of the evil mage gear we can equip - I've yet to unlock DNC but that may be what I'll have to do this weekend or after my finals next month.

[Celeal]

PUP can use astrals and errent gear which swaps HP for MP and also loses HP on the Errent. PUP has most mage gear and can lower their HP for this very easy.

It requires almost no effort too :D

A Taru would have less base HP, but for other races? I guess it needs time for setting up the condition.

[Guren]

True, I am a Tarutaru. But, in gear, I have about -700 HP lol. Not sure the exact amount but I can get pretty damn low. I will add it up when I have a chance to get on FFXI tonight.

Also, the best sub is /warrior for parties and /ninja for solo in my opinion.

Depending on the situation, /red mage is amazing when soloing things like the prime avatars.

If you want to main heal a party you can use WHM automaton with /dancer and massive ACC gear.

[Celeal]

-700 HP, wow geez XD

/em in panic mode

[Jaice]

What if you find something that will -hp and just keep equip/unequip it to knock down your ponits, it might save on inventory space (speaking as a newb with only my first gobbiebag quest done >.< ), would that work at all? I'll test it with my astrals when I get home - right now I'm just trolling this forum at work and waiting to get in trouble for it :evil:

[Tule]

equiping/unequiping won't work since if you take that piece of armor off, your stats return to what they were originally.