Whm/smn?

[Chaddie]

Well, im thinking of making a WHM, because in a different (Rose-Online) I was a cleric and i loved it.

But i dont want to be a WHM/BLM Because im going to have another Char, which will be BLM.

Any suggestions?
I want to be a PURE Healer/Buffer. NOT enfeebler.

(Ps. im new to this game.)

[Malacite]

I highly suggest you browse the stickies and the information over at the FFXI wiki.

That said, WHM/BLM is very good combo for beginners. It's mostly used for the extra MP, Conserve MP, Magic Attack Bonus (nice for banish spells and holy) and the utility spells (Warp and Escape).

You don't need another character by the way, to play BLM. In fact I highly advise against that. You can switch between all 20 jobs at any time via Moogle, so there's really no need to make more than one character (except for storage and crafting purposes)

Stick to WHM/BLM until you can unlock SCH.

[Clever Ninja]

The pretty much new token WHM subs are either /SMN or /SCH. SCH basically gives WHM's an ability called Light Arts, which increases their Healing to B skill(and healing skill is annoying to raise), as well as lower mp cost and recast time of all White Magic spells.

/SMN has always been acceptable imo. /BLM is still used, honestly, because of Conserve MP(and other clinch things such as Escape/Sleepga, and a free Warp on top of that). When you're in charge of either healing often or more than likely keeping a full Haste cycle, having that ability kick in does help. But SMN gives you much more mp and Auto-Refresh at 50 when you sub it, so it's more reliable. I can't remember if it's here or another forum but I think someone broke down Auto-Refresh versus Conserve MP.

So if you don't want to sub BLM it's perfectly fine, you still have /SMN and /SCH which are better for pure healing and buffing.

Also you don't really make 2 characters in this game. You can freely switch your job and subjob in this game at any mog house instantly, so you can play a WHM/SCH then level a BLM seperately on the same character. Although a few people do it(majority high level players) it's not recommended for new players since it means you have to go through all the new player hurdles(a slow 1-10 leveling, subjob quest, etc) twice. Being able to do almost everything outside of merits on the same character is one of FFXI's strengths.

[Sabaron]

/SCH exceeds the performance of /SMN I think now because of Aspir and the continuous 10% discount with a 50% discount every 4 minutes. I don't think 1mp/tick beats that.

/SMN used to be the best sub for WHM after a certain level when the WHM finds it unnecessary to include Aspir, Escape and Sleep in their reportoire.

/BLM allows the WHM to Sleep something (soundly) every 10 minutes with Elemental Seal or if that isn't necessary, to Aspir something (again with Eleseal). Escape is a great flight tool when you're in a dungeon, and Tractor can be indispensable when you have to Raise someone trapped amongs aggressive monsters (especially Death, Magic, and Sight aggros).

The SMN sub is basically used only for the large boost to MP and MND and the 1mp/tick Refresh.

The new SCH sub affords use of Aspir and Drain with much greater skill since Dark Arts gives you B skill even if you suck. It includes, of course, the aforementioned discounts and the odd bonus of actually being able to stick the odd low-end tier I or II nuke (not that you would ever use something like that instead of Drain).

I suggest you go with SCH. You'll never be a pure healer/support character because WHM has native enfeebling--Paralyze, Slow, Dia, and Silence. There are no "pure" classes in FFXI, but WHM comes the closest to pure healing/support. The best sub will be /SCH after 20th level. I don't think I can think if an XP based situation where you'd really want /BLM or /SMN more than /SCH unless you go into a cave planning to get eaten thus requiring Escape.

[TheGrandMom]

Just to touch on the 2 character issue, take the advise given and don't do it or at least don't do it until you have one character at a fairly high level. I have 7 characters and let me tell you, doing RoZ, CoP, and all the other missions over and over and over is NOT the highlight of my day. LOL (Not to mention raising up fame in all the cities, farming, camping for equips, VALKRUM DUNES, lol )

There are times I wish I could have been happy with just one character and leveled everything on that. One thing I would have done differently though is to level one character to a high level first and at the same time learn some crafting skills and be able to support myself fairly well........THEN made another character. It certainly would have been a LOT easier that way.

But BAH! when do I ever do anything the easy way anyways. ><

As for whm/smn, I would rate it at a B and /blm at a B+ or A-. I haven't tried scholar so I really can't say for that one. One arguement about /smn that I hear a lot is how you can use the summons for buffs eventually but rarely do I see a whm/smn utilize this. So isn't that like defeating the purpose of subbing it if you don't use it correctly. The extra mp is nice but a good whm knows how to use their mp well and really doesn't need it. About the only thing that I get happy about is the auto refresh!! <3 refresh! Also in the lower levels, I really don't think it has any benefit over /blm except for a bit of mp. Auto-refresh starts at level 50 for subbing it so it would be best to use /blm until then.

[Akashimo]

I've yet to touch sch, but given smn or blm subbed, no matter how much mp you get as a boost and the auto-refresh, /blm is a better choice, simple put, conserve MP. It kicks in enough times to make your mp really stretch out over that of auto refresh and max mp boost.

Also, bit different, but occassional uses, /rdm. If you got a rdm already or a brd and cor in your pty, this sub i find valuable for high pace parties that take little dmg. Fast Cast, and a good mind boost. Plus Dispel, so your pty won't annoy the brd or cor for it XD

TGM: 7 chars?! And ppl called me nuts for having two....
<.<; I'm already seeing doubts of doing my plan for an elvaan chick as a blm to 75 as a 3rd char. I bow to the greater multi-char player :P

[IfritnoItazura]

I suggest you go with SCH.
I concur; for White Mage, Scholar for support job is the is the way to go.

That said, it would be good to also have ready /SMN, /BLM, and /RDM at some point.

/RDM - Fast Cast II, for fastest cure casting.
/BLM - For utility of Elemental Seal, Sleep/Sleep II, Tractor, and Escape.
/SMN - For on the run events; Auto Refresh gives you MP even while moving.

For most activities, however, /SCH would serve a WHM best, IMO.

There are no "pure" classes in FFXI, but WHM comes the closest to pure healing/support.
MNK comes pretty close to being a pure DD job, I think.

[nanatsu]

well one thing that hasn't been mentioned that you might want to be aware of, is that you can't unlock smn until you get to level 30 anyway. And the accepted sub for smn is... whm. And you're not going to get whm to level 30 without a sub. So if you decide to level whm to 30 in preparation of using it as a sub for smn, well then....what are you gonna sub for whm? /blm sub for whm is already easily accessible.

Best to listen to what everyone else says and level one character.

[Icemage]

/SMN is terribly overrated. I personally think /BLM, /BRD, and particularly /SCH all outshine it, at every level, for almost every application.

For purposes of doing your job as a WHM, I almost think /PLD is superior to /SMN these days unless you're using your avatars to pull with for some god-forsaken reason. You're basically just using Auto-Refresh, might as well get some defense while you're at it if you're going to go that route (and no, I'm not being terribly serious about /PLD being good, but I DO think it's better than WHM/SMN).


Icemage

[Clever Ninja]

MNK comes pretty close to being a pure DD job, I think.

Didn't MNK's used to tank before the level cap was raised though? It's not as if they don't have the skills for it.

[Sabaron]

/SMN is terribly overrated. I personally think /BLM, /BRD, and particularly /SCH all outshine it, at every level, for almost every application.

For purposes of doing your job as a WHM, I almost think /PLD is superior to /SMN these days unless you're using your avatars to pull with for some god-forsaken reason. You're basically just using Auto-Refresh, might as well get some defense while you're at it if you're going to go that route (and no, I'm not being terribly serious about /PLD being good, but I DO think it's better than WHM/SMN).


Icemage

I did enjoy WHM/BRD for about 10 levels from 20-30 off and on. A lot of people required me to sub BLM for some odd reason though and I just gave up after 30th. I'm sure WHM/BRD is also very good in parties with multiple mages after 50th with Ballad--at least one step above /SMN since instead of just you, everyone gets free Refresh.

[Coinspinner]

You want to take BLM at least to level 17 for Warp. Beats having to carry multiple Warp scrolls or Warp Cudgels on missions or when using a Teleport to reach your exp camp (so you can pick up replacements when people leave, or pick up supplies if you need more.) And of course for Tele-Taxi, which is a nice source of income.

I'm not sure /SCH as a default sub is such a great idea. If you're near a zone/outpost/portal, great. Otherwise you are gambling a bit, especially in a pick-up-group.

[Chaddie]

Thanks for all the replies, (Finally done reading them all)

Ok, so im still newbie to the whole Job things, didnt realise job changing was so versatile.
So, heres what i plan on doing.

WHM/BLM Until WHM is level thirty.
Then
WHM/SCH

But, just one more question, SCH..is WoTG? Right..?
Lets hope by the time im 30 i've bought it :x! Lmao.

Once again thanks for clearing all these things up!
O and just one more question.
WHAT SERVER SHOULD I JOIN! :O

I was thinking Bahamut because someone told me that there was a good LS there for new people and the people on the server were very welcoming but then some say the opposite. Please dont be Biassed!

Thankies Again (and again)
Chaddie!

[Malacite]

Well, it I don't think SE has discontinued it just yet (they tend to do that rather quickly with their expansions) and it's also a fairly cheap (was only about $34.00 for me with the tax here in Canada) so you should pick it up ASAP.

All the servers are fine. If I recall correctly, Ragnarok and Bahamut have the largest populations, and Kujata I believe is host to our DiV linkshell?

It honestly doesn't matter. That said, you may wish to ask for membership in the DiV community LS and join Kujata for the sake of having good, helpful friends right off the bat. (I'm on Seraph personally. Had it thrust upon me years ago when you couldn't select your server and I've never looked back)



Oh yeah, and I'd take Light Arts (10% Conserve MP on every spell, as well as 10% cast and recast time reductions) over BLM's randomly activated, random percentile Conserve MP trait any day. (Not that it's a bad sub; it has its many uses!)

[Akashimo]

The DiV died a few weeks ago Malacite :P
Why you think I've poked you on Nekoai?

Quick question on arts. Dark Arts while subbing sch on whm, would that allow effect drain/aspirs compared tp that of /blm and /drk? I just gotta ask that.

[TheGrandMom]

TGM: 7 chars?! And ppl called me nuts for having two....
<.<; I'm already seeing doubts of doing my plan for an elvaan chick as a blm to 75 as a 3rd char. I bow to the greater multi-char player :P

Ya, I'd get to thinking "I wonder how rdm would be on a Elvaan...." and then I'd end up making an Elvaan and trying it. Then I started up with melee jobs and wanted to try them on Elvaan, Hume, Mithra, and Galka. It's like an addiction I swear. lol

I did enjoy WHM/BRD for about 10 levels from 20-30 off and on. A lot of people required me to sub BLM for some odd reason though and I just gave up after 30th. I'm sure WHM/BRD is also very good in parties with multiple mages after 50th with Ballad--at least one step above /SMN since instead of just you, everyone gets free Refresh.

I like subbing /brd for a challange but its not something that people want most of the time. I've been told too often to change my sub so now I don't even bother. Also with /brd you are one busy bee!! lol



So, heres what i plan on doing.
WHM/BLM Until WHM is level thirty.
Then
WHM/SCH

WHAT SERVER SHOULD I JOIN! :O
I was thinking Bahamut because someone told me that there was a good LS there for new people and the people on the server were very welcoming but then some say the opposite. Please dont be Biassed!
Thankies Again (and again)
Chaddie!


Let me amend that a bit:

WHM till 18 (if you have all sub job items by then - it's a quest)
Then BLM/WHM until 15
Then WHM/BLM till 30
Then SCH/WHM until 37
Then WHM/SCH all the way up!

As far as servers, its really a crap shoot. Choose whatever one you think sounds good to you. Try going to the individual server forums and posting on there asking how busy the server is, etc. You could also look at some forum members profiles to see what server they are on and PM them. Good luck!

[Icemage]

Quick question on arts. Dark Arts while subbing sch on whm, would that allow effect drain/aspirs compared tp that of /blm and /drk? I just gotta ask that.
Yes, it really does. Tack on a Dark Staff and watch as your Drains and Aspirs hit like a BLM's. :)


Icemage

[Pteryx]

Once again thanks for clearing all these things up!
O and just one more question.
WHAT SERVER SHOULD I JOIN! :O

If you don't have friends on any servers already, it really doesn't matter. FFXI, unlike many MMOs, doesn't have special-purpose servers -- no PvP vs. PvE, RP, or language-specific servers. All the servers are a stew of every type and quality of player. -- Pteryx

[Malacite]

Dark Arts boosts those skills (and caps them) to a B rating relative to your main job's level.

[Chaddie]

Thanks everyone for all the information.

So while my brain tries to take in all the abbrev. and things that make no sense to me let me get this straight.

WHM Till level 18.
Then level up as BLM/WHM Till the BLM is level 15.
Then WHM/BLM Till level 30
Then SCH/WHM Till SCH is 37
Then WHM/SCH :D

Thats correct?
Kinda hard for me to understand im new to all this stuff lol.

Yea with the servers ill go with Bahamut. :D
Just want to find some australian players thats all :x...

Once again (again, again) Thanks for all the help!

[Coinspinner]

Thanks everyone for all the information.
So while my brain tries to take in all the abbrev. and things that make no sense to me let me get this straight.
WHM Till level 18.
Then level up as BLM/WHM Till the BLM is level 15.
Then WHM/BLM Till level 30
Then SCH/WHM Till SCH is 37
Then WHM/SCH :D
Thats correct?
Kinda hard for me to understand im new to all this stuff lol.
Yea with the servers ill go with Bahamut. :D
Just want to find some australian players thats all :x...
Once again (again, again) Thanks for all the help!



BLM/WHM to 17, not 15. You want Warp.

[TheGrandMom]

WHM Till level 18.
Then level up as BLM/WHM Till the BLM is level 15.
Then WHM/BLM Till level 30
Then SCH/WHM Till SCH is 37
Then WHM/SCH :D
Thats correct?
Kinda hard for me to understand im new to all this stuff lol.

Here let me explain why. Ok for your first job you always level until level 18 (at least) because thats when you are able to do a quest that gives you your sub job. You will need to collect 3 items in order to complete it. Sometimes you'll go over level 18 because it can take a while to obtain one of the sub job items so don't worry if that happens.

Once you can open up your sub jobs, you'll want to level one up. (I'll use whm/blm as our example.) If you don't then when you equip your sub job it will be whm18/blm1....thats a little gimp! LOL Your sub job level is always 1/2 of your main job's level providing you have it leveled that high. If you level your blm to 10 and your whm's level is 30, then you would be whm30/blm10....again a little gimped! So try to keep your sub job leveled evenly with your main job. In that example it would have to be leveled to level 15. (As has been suggested, you might want to level up your blm to 17. At that level you can get a spell called warp. It will take you back to your homepoint so it saves you a lot of time.)

So once your blm is leveled to 15, then you can switch back to whm and keep leveling it until 30 and never have a gimped sub job. At 30, you can open scholar! Back to the beginning again!! Sch1/whm1 LOL Now you can level scholar all the way to 37 (that's as high as a sub job goes) and sub whm all the way.

Once you have scholar to 37, you can switch back to whm (if you want to!) and continue to level your whm all the way to 75 and not have to worry about your sub job. Whm75/Sch37! Now you can go back and level up blm or sch to 75 if you like or try some other jobs! There are just not enough hours in the day sometimes! Always remember though...HAVE FUN!! That is the most important rule!

[Malacite]

Even though SCH will be the optimal sub now most of the time, you may want to level BLM to 37 anyway. It's still a very useful sub to have for a number of situations, and you may end up liking it enough to take it further ^^

BLM is very good for end game activities and instanced battles (BCNMs, etc) and best of all, can solo very quickly off of BST pets (though some of the camps are quite risky)

[Chaddie]

Thanks mommy! I Understand the job system now.

Malacite i will Definately be levelling BLM to 75.
Phew well im finally ingame now, (6 Hours Later)

Phynks - Male TaruTaru - Bahamut - Level 2 WHM WOOT!

Wish me luck!

[Olorin401]

The only thing that gets to me about /SCH is the job is so horrible on its own I don't even want to level it.

Ah well, guess I'll hafta get in the mood for it won't I?

[Truece]

Yes, it really does. Tack on a Dark Staff and watch as your Drains and Aspirs hit like a BLM's. :)


Icemage

It makes dynamis so much easier, and the aspirs are more effective than /SMN 20MP/min auto-refresh or one good aspir once every 10 mins as /BLM. Once you /SCH, you'll never go back!

[Malacite]

The only thing that gets to me about /SCH is the job is so horrible on its own I don't even want to level it.

Ah well, guess I'll hafta get in the mood for it won't I?


You couldn't be more wrong.

[Coinspinner]

You couldn't be more wrong.

He's on the money actually. 1-16 on SCH is dreadful. 16-32 is basically RDM with slightly more MP (IE, a gimp WHM or BLM). Between 32 and 40 there's just no hiding how half-assed the job is.

[Malacite]

If you're that narrow minded that you can't see how to make the best of the job with the right food and SJ, then you might just want to quit right now :P

It learns nukes faster than RDM, has higher skill (with dark arts up) and gets regen very early. Honestly, sub BLM (20+) eat +1 pies (or Goblin Mushpots if /WHM and using enfeebs) and see for yourself. I did just fine 1-30 as an elvaan SCH.

The job's got some nice spells and abilities the further up you go. Don't be so quick to shoot it down.

[Coinspinner]

I'm sorry, but I did just that. 1-16 is completely awful any way you look at it. 16-32 it doesn't matter much, SCH is adequate, but you are still either weaker or have less utility, usually both. Then RDM gets Dispel. I suppose that might leave SCH ahead of SMN, I've never seen a SMN LFP and only once grouped with one outside of mission and BCNM.

[IfritnoItazura]

I fail to see why SCH is horrible between 10-16. With the Light/Dark Arts, low level SCH is more efficient at tossing cures and nukes than WHM and BLM. Sure, don't have Cure II, but no party that level should only have a single healer anyway.

Leveled my SCH to 26 recently, and it's been quite fun. Being RDM75, BLM56, and WHM44, I can say Scholar compares favorably to them in many ways.

To each his own, I guess.

[Coinspinner]

I fail to see why SCH is horrible between 10-16. With the Light/Dark Arts, low level SCH is more efficient at tossing cures and nukes than WHM and BLM. Sure, don't have Cure II, but no party that level should only have a single healer anyway.
Leveled my SCH to 26 recently, and it's been quite fun. Being RDM75, BLM56, and WHM44, I can say Scholar compares favorably to them in many ways.
To each his own, I guess.

It's true you generally need two healers, but before now it was typically assumed one would be a WHM or RDM, the first learning Barwatera and Cure 2 at just the right level for Dunes and learning the handy Curaga and Barfira along the way, the latter having the full set of enfeebles and decent melee. I used to groan seeing a party with no Cure 2 in dunes, having to scrape by with dual Cure 1 for an extra 3 levels sucks. Having a WHM or RDM means you are second healer, leaving you in the position to enfeeble or nuke. You have Para, or Para and Blind if you decided you didn't want Poisona. As for the nuking...

Before Fire at 16, even the tank may out damage a SCH's chain nuking. It hardly matters that you saved an MP or two per cast since you will be getting resisted more often, deal less damage per spell, and will be forced to use either Stone or Water on aquans until Fire. Or sit on your thumbs, waiting on Aero's cooldown.

Anyway, you get by, but it's not pleasant. I always felt, knew, that I could have served the party more ably as any of the other three White/Black users. That was my point; that it's a pain to play. I do not enjoy feeling gimp.

Between Cure 2 and Regen at 17/18, MAB at 20 and Wizard Earring at 30, I feel that SCH eventually becomes generally on par with other mages at specific tasks, but lacking their full utility (IE, I can sub BLM to nuke like a BLM, but I'd lack Poisona and Sleep.)

[Icemage]

Coinspinner is right in that SCH is very incomplete in the early levels. My SCH job is up to 23 now, and it's only since I hit 20 that I actually feel like a competent mage. Prior to that, you nuke like a RDM, cure like a RDM, enfeeble like a WHM... just mediocre all around no matter what you sub.


Icemage

[IfritnoItazura]

Er, I don't now, Icemage.

Post Lv.10, with the appropriate Arts up, you'd have higher Elemental Magic skill than RDM, higher Enfeebling Magic than WHM and BLM. If you say the difference between C rating and B do not make enough of a difference at low levels, then I'd say B rating isn't far off enough from A to make a difference either--making SCH competent all around.

Fewer tools in each specialty, but more efficient with the tools you do have, and a nice collection, to boot. It's not a better job than RDM, WHM, or BLM, but it certainly is not worse, and can replace their spot in party (at least at lower level) easily enough.

Sad to hear some people didn't enjoy it, but I look forward to leveling SCH again after I get one more MP merit. =b

[Icemage]

RDM is also a very incomplete job in the early levels, and SCH reminds me heavily of RDM, only worse. Even with the proper Arts up, enfeebles aren't as sticky as a RDM, nukes aren't as accurate as a BLM. Healing is still OK, but all mages heal equally competently at that level range.

There's also the issue of some enfeebles (Slow, Paralyze, Silence) which are actually worse. If you have Light Arts up, they cost a bit less, but you're stuck at D rank Enfeebling magic. If you have Dark Arts up, they cost more, but you get the B rank skill level.


Icemage

[Magoo]

Not having Cure II until 16 shouldn't really be a problem - Cure IIs in that level range are so grossly inefficient and likely to pull hate that a healer shouldn't be using it anyway.

[Malacite]

Having Regen in the dunes is huge since it's basically a 15(14) MP Cure III over time.

[Coinspinner]

Uncapped Cure 2 is not MP efficient, sure, but it's often time efficient. Finish healing and start resting sooner and you can more than make up the MP difference. And you don't wanna be spamming Cure 1 after a big Screwdriver or other nasty special.

Sad to hear some people didn't enjoy it, but I look forward to leveling SCH again after I get one more MP merit. =b

Crap, I forgot Merits can affect lower level jobs. I might just have a go at finishing BLM and getting some merits before I continue SCH.