Petition : Activate Recast

[Kolid]

Hello, I have made a petition about the Activate Recast. It seems that a 20 minute recast on a job-defining job ability, is just too much. If the Puppet dies early on, the Master cannot make up any damage for it.

The Puppet can die very easily high levels, and the easy death rate for theme excludes PUP from many endgame events, and also Conflict. Lowering the Activate recast also let's the Puppetmasters have the ability to customize the puppet much more often, utilizing the job of all of it's abilities. If you do not want to sign this petition, please disregard this thread.

If you do, please sign it here :
http://www.ipetitions.com/petition/FFXIPUP/

Thanks for your time, if it reaches a very high amount of signatures, I will submit this to Square, a GM told me that if I get a petition of PUPs together, maybe SE will change this.

Please do not sign anonymously.



This is not a game breaking change, Call Beast is at 5 minute recast, and Summoner can resummon at any time. Five minute recast is just fine, but 20 can exclude us from endgame events, and Conflict type events.

[eticket109]

Call Wyvern is 20 minutes as well. It used to be 2 hours. 20 minutes is just fine. I agree it can be frustrating to lose them that fast though.

[Omgwtfbbqkitten]

Or you could just tell people to send comments and concerns directly though the POL browser. Its there for a reason.

BTW: Cross-posting on different forums is annoying. Already saw this on Alla.

[Feba]

lol internet petitions.

BTW, I played dragoon for months with a *2 hour recast* on my pet. 20 minutes is getting into Girly-Man territory, anything lower would just be stupid.

[Legal Fish]

I'd say 10 Minute recast sounds pretty fair for both DRG and PUP. PvP does seem like a bit more of an issue, but I think that has more to do with the fact both grant gatebreach and shouldn't.

[Celeal]

May as well introduce a macro or command for Auto's MP. We have <pettp>, <pethpp>, but nothing for MP.

[Feba]

BRP has a bit of a point, PVP ONLY though. PUP and DRG should have a much easier time respawning their pets in PVP, I'd personally recommend something like a 1/1 Ring that "In Ballista: (30 seconds equip time, 2 minute recast) Raise Pet PUP/DRG", which will automagically respawn the wyvern or puppet.

[Kolid]

To the people who say the recast is fine, I take it you've never played PUP. Higher levels, Repair just doesn't do it. Your puppet can get one-shotted very easily, even on Valoredge, especially Stormwalker.

To the people who say DRG is fine with a 20 minute recast, you need to take two things in consideration. I know Call Wyvern is very important to a Dragoon, but Activate is a complete job-defining ability for PUP. Activate is the most important tool for a Puppetmaster, and most of us feel it should be lower, so we can actually be like Masters of our Puppets.

BST uses Call Beast every 5 minutes, and it's less of a job defining job than PUP. If it was a very job defining job, it would probly be at level one.

SMN can recast whenever, PUP cannot. If BST or SMN has a pet die, they can wait a very short time, while PUP must wait a very long time. The Puppet can cause 40-60% of a Puppet's damage, that is why we want a 5 minute recast, just like Call Beast.

[Feba]

I take it you've never played PUP.

I take it you never played DRG with a 2Hr Recall.

Trust me, 20 minutes recall on PUP and DRG is fine. BST and SMN are different jobs, about using the most effective tool for the job, not about having a partner that you constantly use.

Do you really think Spirit Link is that effective-- a small amount of HP every five minutes? You think Wyverns don't get killed easily? Trust me, if I could live with 2 hours between calls, you can live with 20 minutes. Having a partner for a pet is all about taking care of them-- if that means not fighting mobs that spam AOEs, that's what you do.

[eticket109]

I'd say 10 Minute recast sounds pretty fair for both DRG and PUP. PvP does seem like a bit more of an issue, but I think that has more to do with the fact both grant gatebreach and shouldn't.

BRP has a bit of a point


How in the hell did I not catch this before? lol

[Kolid]

I take it you never played DRG with a 2Hr Recall.

Trust me, 20 minutes recall on PUP and DRG is fine. BST and SMN are different jobs, about using the most effective tool for the job, not about having a partner that you constantly use.

Do you really think Spirit Link is that effective-- a small amount of HP every five minutes? You think Wyverns don't get killed easily? Trust me, if I could live with 2 hours between calls, you can live with 20 minutes. Having a partner for a pet is all about taking care of them-- if that means not fighting mobs that spam AOEs, that's what you do.

First of all : The Puppet does more damage and effectiveness than the puppet. Secondly, I've DRG long ago, before Call Wyvern wasn't a two-hour, and it was very tough.

Last time I checked, PUP wasn't DRG.

I don't know why you really seem to be against this Feba.... Puppetmasters cannot do events like Ballista, Brenner, CoP missions, Besieged, Dynamis, and a lot more endgame events because of the rediculous 20 minute recast on a job ability that DEFINES our job.

As you can see, from the signatures, many PUPs support this, and furthermore give more reasons why it should be raised.

Feba, I'm not trying to flame you and all, but based on what you're saying, I take it you have not only never tried PUP very high, but also not partied with barely any of them.

20 minute recast is rediculous. How would you like it if DRGs Jumps were 20 minute recasts? RDM Convert being 40 minute recast? SAM Meditate being 10 minutes? It's like that, and it should not be, if we are truly the master of our puppet.

[Ziero]

There's a glaring difference between a Drg having call wyvern on a 20 minute timer and Pups having activate on a 20 minute timer.

Drg's can work without a pet, Pup's can't.

I say this as someone who has no interest in either job.

[Legal Fish]

Just so you know Feba, I meant outside PvP too.

I think Job Abilities outside Merits with 20 min timers is pretty stupid. Every job ability obtained from merits would be 5 or 10 mins. But anyway...

A melee can die and be raised and be in full fighting shape within 5 mins. Unless he died 10 mins after he brought his pet out, neither DRG or PUP can say that for themselves. A 10 min timer would allow a PUP to take less precautions in the say melee do not have to thanks to having a healer to back them up.

[Feba]

Just so you know Feba, I meant outside PvP too.

I know you did, which is why I clarified that your point is only valid inside PVP.

I wouldn't be opposed to refreshing the job abilities everytime someone respawned at a home point or game out of weakness, it would make a lot of sense actually. Having a generic timer so low though encourages people to abuse their pets, which I am against as far as PUP and DRG go.

[Pteryx]

I wouldn't be opposed to refreshing the job abilities everytime someone respawned at a home point or game out of weakness, it would make a lot of sense actually. Having a generic timer so low though encourages people to abuse their pets, which I am against as far as PUP and DRG go.

There is a difference between a wyvern and a puppet, though. The wyvern is about a third of a DRG's usefulness, while the puppet is, what, three-quarters or so of a PUP's usefulness? That being said, though, making PUP able to reconfigure their puppet every five minutes just might make them a little too good; maybe a better solution would be a Raise-equivalent for puppets on a 5-to-10-minute timer, letting a PUP bring their last configuration of puppet back in a weakened state which wears after a minute or so. -- Pteryx

[Legal Fish]

I can not see how either can be abused on a ten min timer.

And I can not see how a PUP being able to modify his automation every 10 min timer is broken either.

You'll have to explain to me how so.

[KingOfZeal]

That being said, though, making PUP able to reconfigure their puppet every five minutes just might make them a little too good

Just for the record, as a Puppetmaster (and under the right conditions) I can change my puppet's configuration once a minute. If deactivated while at full health, the activation timer resets. Since the deactivation timer is 1 minute, assuming my puppet doesn't get any damage done to him (which is easy sometimes, and not so easy others)...

However, the argument that just because I could do this at every opportunity (that is, when the activation or deactivation timer is up) would make it too strong is slightly flawed. Since many of the more important attachments require a maneuver up to use, and since the automaton would immediately overload if you used a maneuver right after you activated, it would actually hamper performance for that instance. Instead, it's more often beneficial to leave the puppet out as long as possible and thus allow us to pack on more maneuvers of the same type at the same time.



Relating to the OP, I just want to say that I really don't mind a 20 minute timer on Activate. I will admit that, occasionally, a 10-15 minute timer would be nice, but if your puppet is constantly getting killed 5-10 minutes after you activated, you might be doing something wrong. In that situation, I would consider changing frames to a back line job (like any of the mages or even the ranged) and continue from there.

[Kolid]

letting a PUP bring their last configuration of puppet back in a weakened state which wears after a minute or so.

Heh, we already have that. A minute after summoning a puppet, your "Burden" is very high for the next minute, and if you use any maneuvers, your puppet will overload and you'll have to wait another minute.

[Omniblast]

I think with the way things are going for FAST PACED MMORPGS, SE would lose out players in that regard.

Everything should be halved. Timers and all. Instead of 2 hours, make it 1 hour. A lot of people are more casual players than not, as proven by Nintendo's widely popularized Wii console.

It's just my idea, no one has to agree with me, but I'm sure people would be happy if all timers were halved.

[Rain_Blade]

SMN can recast whenever, PUP cannot. If BST or SMN has a pet die, they can wait a very short time, while PUP must wait a very long time.

This thread may be a few weeks old...but the Puppetmaster section already seems a little dead in my opinion.

Anyway, I don't know too much about Beastmaster, but, when it comes to Summoner, we have a very short recast time because we have no backup when our pet is down. When a Dragoon's pet and a Puppetmaster's pet is defeated, the master is left to fight for their life. They can fight for their lives much better than a Summoner can. You have...

A Summoner with a Staff (with /whm magic, but nothin but avatars/spirits on main).
A Puppetmaster with Hand-to-hand (with evasion).
A Dragoon with a Polearm (with jump abilities).

A Summoner would most likely die. Why? Our str and att is bad. A staff compared to h2h and polearm is hilariously bad. /whm could save our lives if we weren't interrupted so much when we get hit, but smn have no abilities or magic (obviously besides summons) as main. Summoning skill still decreases summoning interruption, but obviously not 100% guaranteed...and we all know about the perpetuation (mp drain).

A Puppetmaster could fairly die or live. Why? Well, sure the specialize in evasion, but that doesn't mean they'll evade everything (espcially on the IT and VT and maybe T mobs). The C+ H2H is enough. I read a guy had a parse and he (as pup) was doing 32% of the party's damage (him doing 15% and the automaton doing 18%). If Pup's H2H was rank A, then MAYBE (keyword: MAYBE) it MIGHT (keyword: MIGHT) be overpowered. Plus, pup has some nice weapon skills that can do good damage.

A Dragoon could also fairly die or live. Why? Polearm is actually very nice from what I've seen (this is probably weird, but I haven't seen many "loldrgs" lately. I've seen many good-damaging ones). The delays in Polearms can be annoying since you'd like to fight faster when fighting for your life with no pet.

For the jobs themselves, I don't wanna say a job is more miserable than the other or say which job has it easier than the other. Just pointing out things about what you're left with when you're pet is gone.