Would you like to see a new race?

[PhiberOpticks]

I was wondering about your guys' opinion on this. I think there should be. But I have no suggestions, at present.

[Feba]

no. Would screw over existing players far too much (this isn't a game where everyone has multiple characters than can level to cap within a couple weeks)

In addition, at this point, there's not really a place in the storyline for it. Tears of Altana and whatnot.

I wouldn't mind allowing players to get alternate Citizenships though. Have Selbina, Mhaura, and Tavnazia citizenships open up at lv30... have them be the same as their mothercountry (Bastok, Windurst, and San d'Oria. I know they don't get along much, but just go with it), as far as mission structure goes, and keep your mission order, but have it add side quests, equipment, and maybe a very minor storyline extra (like expansion missions though, not rank missions)

Then maybe offer Jeuno and Aht Urhgan later, as main countries. Jeuno rank missions could be very interesting.

[Gentoo]

no. Would screw over existing players far too much (this isn't a game where everyone has multiple characters than can level to cap within a couple weeks)

I don't get how this would screw over existing players. You either start a new character with the new race, or you don't. It's not like the situation is different if, for example, someone playing a Tarutaru suddenly decides they'd like to try an Elvaan character.

In addition, at this point, there's not really a place in the storyline for it. Tears of Altana and whatnot.Eh ... Easily solved with a little interbreeding among the beastmen, or the five Altana derived races and the beastmen. Or...


A new race would be interesting, but I think there are bigger roadblocks.
First, I doubt SE wants to ramp up a dev and creative staff to introduce a new race. FFXI is probably in milk-cow status at this point. Expansions, it would seem, have a decent RoI, but pouring lots of money into the game for a new race probably wouldn't be worth it for them at this point.
Second, there's the purported issue of the PS2 limiting SE from being able to do much more of anything.

[Quetzalcoatl]

what about these Qiqirn things... would be funny to see ppl runing around with this kind of race

[Feba]

I don't get how this would screw over existing players.If someone would've rather played as an Elvaan when they started, they could've made that choice, or at least made that choice before their point of no return. You can't expect players to give up their pimped out 75s in FFXI like you can in WoW.

Eh ... Easily solved with a little interbreeding among the beastmen, or the five Altana derived races and the beastmen. ...Ugh. You really don't know the story very well do you? This would screw things up very bad. Hell, it would basically make a substantial portion of COP meaningless.

[Krysta]

No I dont think there should be a new race simply because there is no need. Each race atm either specialises in one area of stats (STR, MIND and INT, DEX and AGI etc) so the only benefit they could do by adding a new race would be looks. I doubt they would make it excel more in any one of those stats over the other races because everyone would change so we would have clones runnign everywhere. I also dont think anyone would bother to start over just because they want to play as that race, ffxi isnt a game which it is possble to rush though it requires time and effort (like feba said).
Anyway would races could they add? i cant think of any that are already intergrated into the game which would work.

[PhiberOpticks]

No I dont think there should be a new race simply because there is no need. Each race atm either specialises in one area of stats (STR, MIND and INT, DEX and AGI etc) so we only benefit they could do by adding a new race would be looks. I doubt they would make it excel more in any one of those stats over the other races because everyone would change so we would have clones runnign everywhere. I also dont think anyone would bother to start over just because they want to play as that race, ffxi isnt a game which it is possble to rush though it requires time and effort (like feba said).
Anyway would races could they add? i cant think of any that are already intergrated into the game which would work.

What do you mean they would only be adding looks? There are 5 races. One of which, the Hume are balanced in stats. And every other race has a specialty in a different stat. So that would mean there would be at least one more stat for a race to be more powerful in.

I see what Feba is saying about the Tears of Altana and such. But, just to play devil's advocate, don't you think there could possibly be some plot integration with another expansion?

[Evion]

Negatively affecting long-time players aside, diversity is supposed to be a good thing. I know I was dissapointed with the lack of races when I joined. It would be absolutely sweet to have a race of fish men or lizard men running around. Would also be sweet if there were male Mithra and female Galka, but that's another discussion.

[PhiberOpticks]

Perhaps there could be a whole new aspect to the game. You could play as the Beastmen. Hell, they've already got their own place in Conquest.

[Raydeus]

I voted nah, because the whole history of Vana is about the 5 races, so except for Manthras being playable characters I don't see how they could implement the new race without screwing up all the storyline.

Although if they made Kuluu or Zilart playable races that would be nice of SE. :P

(They would be (Hume +10) like :thumbsup: ).

[Mhurron]

I wouldn't mind allowing players to get alternate Citizenships though. Have Selbina, Mhaura, and Tavnazia citizenships open up at lv30
This is like having citizenship in Texas instead of being an American. Selbina and Mhaura are already part of larger countries, Tavnazia hardly exists any more, Kahzam would be a member of the Mithran lands which we can't even go to yet. Norg and Rabao are outland squatters for all intents and purposes, not countries you can proclaim your allegiance with.

As for everyone else asking to be a Beastman race, male Mithra, female Galka, bestiality marriages and whatnot, damnit people, learn the story and find out why the world is the way it is before spouting off nonsense.

don't you think there could possibly be some plot integration with another expansion?No. The Children of Altana hardly get along as it is, but only do so because they share a common Goddess. There are 2 other main deities, Promathia and Uggalepih. Do the Children of Altana get along with the followers of them?

[Kaickul]

no. Would screw over existing players far too much (this isn't a game where everyone has multiple characters than can level to cap within a couple weeks)

Pretty much sums it up.

[Lilani]

Absolutely not.

1. It would mess with the story line. So far we have the 5 tears of Altana thing going, and I like that. What next? Are we going to pull a WoW and have our new race come from a meteor that didn't somehow destroy the planet?

2. Speaking of WoW, it would make us too much like them. I remember when I tried a WoW trial, I wanted to try blood elf, but I couldn't because it was a trial. I couldn't try the game in the manner I wanted, and I hated it.

3. Situations like this will, as Feba said, screw over existing players. Many might find this new race more appealing than their current one. They'll feel jealous, and have to start everything over to play the way they want.

4. If the race comes in the new expansion pack like the way WoW did it, the players who don't want the pack or who simply can't find/afford it are screwed as well.

So, no aliens. Prz.

I wouldn't mind optimizing the current character creations and adding in more options for body, figure, faces, hair, etc. but SE would definately have to find a way to let existing players change their characters too. If they only did it for freshly created characters, there would be too much of an uproar.

[Hantz]

This is like having citizenship in Texas instead of being an American.

Wait, that's not how it is? I'd say I'm a Texan first, and an American second. I think it has to do with the whole "right to secede" Texas is supposedly entitled to (put most ludicrously here (http://www.texassecede.com/faq.asp) for unintentional comic effect).

[Gentoo]

You can't expect players to give up their pimped out 75s in FFXI like you can in WoW.

That's a silly argument. No one would be forced to give up their pimped out 75's, period.

So a new race would screw people over because in order to try it, they'd have to start over? This is true even with the original five races.

...Ugh. You really don't know the story very well do you? This would screw things up very bad. Hell, it would basically make a substantial portion of COP meaningless.

Ugh, indeed.
Yes I know the story. I just don't consider set in stone. It's creative work. Application of good creativity could make it fit.

[Mhurron]

That's a silly argument. No one would be forced to give up their pimped out 75's, period.
So a new race would screw people over because in order to try it, they'd have to start over? This is true even with the original five races.
But you knew what you were choosing between then. You might kick yourself now for choosing to be an Elvaan (as you should) but it was your choice and your own fault. Adding a new race now forces you to give up everything you've done and starting over if you want to play it because you couldn't choose that option before you spent time on your existing character.

Your Race and Look are the only things in the game that can not be changed once you start without creating another character. This is why another character can cost money where as in other MMO's where your job is also set in stone they don't. So trying a new race in FFXI is stupid because it either means you must pay more or you must get rid of everything you've already done.

[WishMaster3K]

SE loves taking something that's already in the game and reskinning it. Or resizing it AND reskinning it: just look at the fact that we have only a handful of monster types in the game, but they're different colors and/or sizes, and the world is suprisingly large and not stagnant.

Unlike EQ, or WoW, who seem to not kare about enemy design. But anyway.

The only thing I see SE doing would be to take an existing race and re-color it, or as someone explained, add more customization options.

A new expansion to explain a new race would take too much development resources that kould be allocated somewhere else, bekcase they'd need to have a story, have missions, a goal, prizes, etc etc etc.

I was going to post and suggest they Cop-Out and do Dark Elvaan, like every other MMORPG, but have these Elvaan as the inverse of the Elvaan we know:

High MP, low HP, High INT, low MND, etc etc etc... But that would just be someone who wants the stats of a Taru w/o the looks. And they'd probably have some other diety they pray to (ie. Promathia), meaning that they wouldn't get along with other Adventurer's, who are together, "for the glory of our respective nations."

So I say we eat our cake while we have it, and not want to have one AND have one to eat.

[Lilani]

Ugh, indeed.
Yes I know the story. I just don't consider set in stone. It's creative work. Application of good creativity could make it fit.
But then we'd be turning FFXI into most soap operas these days. They have the main story, get bored with it, and then just start patching on all these new characters and sidestories, forcing them to add "But in the case of ..." catches onto things that, up until they got bored, were set in stone. I absolutely hate patchworked stories because it simply means that the writer couldn't come up with a new situation, so they just started scotch-taping catches onto the same idea.

Too much in FFXI is set in stone and is backed up with storylines to add in a whole new race, that isn't a beastman.

[PhiberOpticks]

4. If the race comes in the new expansion pack like the way WoW did it, the players who don't want the pack or who simply can't find/afford it are screwed as well.

That's hardly an issue. That's a choice of whether or not a person wants the extra content. Either way, they're losing out on something.

That's a silly argument. No one would be forced to give up their pimped out 75's, period.

People are less willing to switch to a whole new character. That's what he's trying to get at. It takes hella long to get to that level anyways.

or as someone explained, add more customization options.

*raises hand* Yes. That's definitely something this game needs. Especially with a game developer that's dedicated to that degree of high quality character design.

A new expansion to explain a new race would take too much development resources that kould be allocated somewhere else, bekcase they'd need to have a story, have missions, a goal, prizes, etc etc etc.

You're making it sound like they'd lose money by selling a new expansion with that type of content. And we all know that's hardly the case.

But I take back what I was saying about the beastmen race. It would turn into faction vs. faction and then would be that much closer to WoW.

[raidenn]

Yagudo!

[Omgwtfbbqkitten]

I was going to post and suggest they Cop-Out and do Dark Elvaan, like every other MMORPG, but have these Elvaan as the inverse of the Elvaan we know:

High MP, low HP, High INT, low MND, etc etc etc... But that would just be someone who wants the stats of a Taru w/o the looks. And they'd probably have some other diety they pray to (ie. Promathia), meaning that they wouldn't get along with other Adventurer's, who are together, "for the glory of our respective nations.

This is all wrong.

Dark Elvaans would be kind, loving and gentle. They'd be hippies.

Elvaan as they currently exist live to be pricks. They go to war at the drop of a hat.

[Murphie]

I voted no, for most of the reasons that have already been explained.

The only people who would benefit from a new race would be new players, and people who are actually willing to give up years of work on their current character to start again. Sure, there would be a lot of level 1 mules of the new race, but beyond that, most people wouldn't have much luck.

I'm already not a fan of adding new jobs, but I'd be behind that idea way before I'd be behind the idea of adding a new race.

[Feba]

Elvaan as they currently exist live to be pricks. They go to war at the drop of a hat.

Everyone says San d'Oria is modeled after the french, but that second bit has me wondering...

[Murphie]

Once upon a time they were far more warlike.

[kglover1969]

Maybe Half Elf or Half Mithra...just thinking that a sub race may be cool :thumbsup:

[PhiberOpticks]

It's an idea. But whether or not it's a good one is debatable. I don't think I could imagine it in a way that would look good. How weird would it be to see a half-galka half-tarutaru.

[nickofearth]

It'd be pointless to add them now since we already got the Tears of Altana, Arc Angels whom all races are based off of, etc. Races can't come out of thin air, that'd be stupid.

[Omgwtfbbqkitten]

I'd only ever want new races if meant you could play as the beastmen races, but then you'd have to dramatically restucture some of the beastmen strongholds to be starter areas and risk adding a faction system. And then people would scream for more PvP since there were "good" and "evil" sides.

Don't get me wrong, I do like a faction system and PvP in other MMOs, it just wouldn't work in FFXI at this point and SE handles them differently than most companies would.

[fallenintoshadows]

Releasing a new race would perhaps not scew over old players but be a bit unfair unless they offered a limited period to change your race and any racial specific equipment for a short time after the new race was added to allow for this. Also, as for fitting the race into the storyline, no matter how well written in will most likely be poorly thought of by players, especially those who have come to know and love the storyline. We really won't accept "And they came from the moon!" as an explanation.

Making people be able to create beastmen characters like Orcs screams WoW at me and makes me want to /stab all beastmen even more.


Manthras could be a possibility, as for female galkas= there is no such thing :P

Customization options sounds brilliant, it was the only thing I could really pick at when I started the game and the one defence WoW players I know use to argue that WoW is better than FFXI. The lack of customization. Things like the tattoos on humes and mithra could be optional for all and any race, more hair and facial types perhaps. Of course if this happened, same story for the older players who miss out purely because they've played longer? A tad unfair but easily solved if again they offered a limited time to alter your character once the new changes were put into effect. No doubt with a fee, something like the world transfer server.

[Pteryx]

I don't think we should get a new race for two reasons. One, it'd push the graphical limits of the PS2 pretty heavily, and if we're going to do that we might as well do it by expanding the range of customizability on character models on existing races instead -- letting you choose face and hairstyle seperately from each other, for example, would significantly increase the number of unique looks out there. Two, the story is centered on the five races of Altana, and the five-ness is a bit strongly ingrained. A sixth race of Altana or a PC beastman race would screw up existing story development. -- Pteryx

[Legal Fish]

Thanks for reminding why I tend to hate other people on this game.

[Omni]

But you knew what you were choosing between then. You might kick yourself now for choosing to be an Elvaan (as you should) but it was your choice and your own fault. Adding a new race now forces you to give up everything you've done and starting over if you want to play it because you couldn't choose that option before you spent time on your existing character.


this says it all.

i also dont think stat wise that this would be really viable since theres a nice balance right now.

currently we have a spectrum, if you will.

i goes something like:

galka -- elvaan -- hume -- mithra -- tarutaru
hp++ ------------------------------------ hp--
mp-- ------------------------------------ mp++

the left end of the spectrum is more physically attuned and durable while the right end is more magically attuned, dexterous and agile. hume make a nice middle with balanced stats across the board.

if you add a 6th race, where would you put it that:

1) is not a copy of another race (stat wise)
2) different enough where it makes sense to even add it? (meaning, i guess you can have a race with super high CHR or something but is that even necessary?)

[Armando]

No. Same reasons as above, you'll either mess up the story or you'd have a huge mess trying to implement beastmen races, it's really freaking late to add a new race, etc. etc.

[DieselBoy09]

I just want more variety. I don't really care either way. I'm happy with what we have, and I hear if they added another it would mess up the story line and such, but if they added another, I would welcome it openly.

[Silent Howler]

S-E adds new jobs, not new races.

[Malacite]

Okay here's the deal.

First and foremost, we can't have new races. SE is barely considering male mithra, and even then there's a good chance they'd be NPC only. Also, for the record Galka are male in appearance only. So there can't be "females" given that there aren't any males either, they're asexual and reincarnate (very strange combo but that's SE for you)


Second is the PS2. SE has already stated that they will not ever release new hair styles and faces because of memory limitations of the PS2. However, that's not the main reason.

The main reason is because of the insane work that would go behind it. They would have to essentially remake every single piece of equipment and animation in the game for these new styles. And you want them to make a new race? That would be even more work for them.

They've already stated in numerous interviews that as much as they'd like to, they won't because of the amount of work (and the limitations of the PS2) involved. They want to keep all 3 versions the same, which is part of why there won't ever be a graphics update for PC users. The other reason being they'd basically be remaking the entire freaking game all over again.

End of discussion.

[Omgwtfbbqkitten]

Hairstyles are one thing, it wouldn't bring PS2 to its knees for SE to expand on character hair color options, though. That's just a pallete swap. A couple more options per face model would be nice.

[Malacite]

Not according to Sage Sundi it isn't.

http://www.1up.com/do/newsStory?cId=3161097


1UP: Really? That's nice. In a past interview I did with you guys, you mentioned how you were slowly adding to the number of armor types because you weren't sure how much the [lowest common denominator] PS2 system memory could manage, in terms of displaying so much different armor. But with COP and especially now with TOAU's Assault and Salvage gear, you've got a lot of new looks. Have you ever thought of adding new hairstyles, character models, or races, and if not, why not?

KO: Yeah, the PS2 technology isn't going to get any better, so that's why we can't add any new races. The same with hairstyles, too.

1UP: Even though you've added so much new armor?

Hiromichi Tanaka: By adding a new hairstyle, we'd have to go back and remake every model for all of the armor on that new hairstyle. It's not just changing the color of the hair. If we change that, we have to change the helmet for how it looks on this type of hairstyle.


read it and weep :(

[Omgwtfbbqkitten]

Not according to Sage Sundi it isn't.

http://www.1up.com/do/newsStory?cId=3161097





read it and weep :(

QFT

Now, go back and read what I posted, then what you looked up and bolded in that quote.

I was talking strictly about hair color. They would not have to remodel helmets and such for that.

[Malacite]

It still doesn't seem very likely though.

[Magoo]

The question is whether you would like to see one, not so much whether SE is likely to do it.

I primarily played a hume for my first two years in this game, took a long break, and came back this past March to focus on my taru which had previously primarily been a mule. In the 6 months since I've been back I'm farther along than my hume in just about every aspect other than playing time (and HP D: ). Starting over isn't the end of the world if you choose to do it.

The nice thing about a new race to me though has nothing to do with the players currently playing though. A nice benefit would be the fact that it could attract new players to the game and very well might lure some former players back. Folks that deleted their characters long ago and don't have a way of getting them back and didn't really feel like starting a dhalmel...I mean, elvaan all over again might see a new race as something that is worth coming back for since they'd have to start over again for it anyway. While I think the player base of FFXI is still strong, an injection of new players for an MMO celebrating its 5 year anniversary certainly isn't a bad thing.

[Mhurron]

A nice benefit would be the fact that it could attract new players to the game and very well might lure some former players back.
A new job has the chance of adding players or making old ones consider coming back; a new race, not so much. Since there is nothing existing races can't do well, all a new race would be is something new to look at and it would only be new for a month at most.

How many people disregard getting a car and then change their mind because the manufacturer added a new colour. Thats all a new race to FFXI is, a new colour on a car.

[WishMaster3K]

S-E palette swaps all the time.

Look at the Mobs we've had the past 5 years.

They get larger and change colors the higher level they are.

[Magoo]

A new job has the chance of adding players or making old ones consider coming back; a new race, not so much. Since there is nothing existing races can't do well, all a new race would be is something new to look at and it would only be new for a month at most.

How many people disregard getting a car and then change their mind because the manufacturer added a new colour. Thats all a new race to FFXI is, a new colour on a car.

Is it really that much different than adding a new job at this point? Sure there will be differences, but any new job is either going to primariliy be a tank, a healer, a damage dealer or support - and those are pretty well covered by what we've already got. What would a dancer support job bring to the table that isn't already covered by bard and corsair? New outfits?

A lot of the existing races are pretty similar as they are already - there's not all that much difference between a Galka's stats and an Elvaan's? A taru has extremely low HP but can still play a tank (the only jobs where HP should really matter) without any real problems. Thinking about it, a race that had really high agility coupled with decent str would be nice to excel at ranged jobs (and ninja for that matter).

Regardless, you'd be suprised at just how important the aesthetics of their character is to some people.

[Lunaryn]

To be fair in responding to the question, I have wanted moogle available as a PC race since before I joined the game. I still do. I don't think it's practical for a number of reasons which have been stated, but I have to admit to wanting it. I do make do somewhat by being responsible for the majority of the moogle NPCs involved in my RPLS' storyline, at least. :P

As far as the hairstyle question, I'm not sure exactly where the clipping information on hair goes, since each helmet has a single data file per race/gender combo (with the exception of Tarutaru which only has one data file). However, even if this info is directly in the helmet, not in any way generic, but split categorically based on face, it should be split 8 ways; there is no possible excuse given the way faces were set up for it to be split 16 ways. My point being that while new hair styles may not be feasible within the current engine constraints (and I really have to wonder about the competence of the dev team given some of what I hear, but to be fair I don't have any PS2 dev experience, and it's entirely possible that a different team ported FFXI to Win32/DirectX after creation on too short a deadline, accounting for the apparent sloppiness in the PC version...), there's little excuse for why more hair colors per face couldn't be implemented (e.g. face 1-C, 1-D, 2-C, etc.) using the exact same preexisting styles. Some hairstyles (particularly on Tarutaru where each hairstyle was used twice) do have a decent set of color options, but no one could call them comprehensive. Not to mention eye color being totally dependent on hair color, if it's not completely fixed for a given hairstyle. I don't mind Kumei (8-A) having brown eyes, but given the choice I probably would have given her gray eyes.

In hindsight, the reason there are only 4 taru f and 4 taru m hairstyles may well be an 8-way split in helmet info combined w/ the fact that taru m and f share the same equipment; that would only further support the notion that an additional set or two of hair colors to the existing styles would not require modifying existing headgear.

[eticket109]

I don't think a new race would make much of a difference with gameplay mechanics as they are now. Until this recent update, racial differences were insignificant at best. Sure a taru has more mp and a galka has more hp but there is gear out there that can be used to mitigate those differences. Only now with the current str/atk and dex/acc ratios are we seeing any real difference in races, and even those aren't groundbreaking. I've seen tarus and elvaans both drop 3000 damage weaponskills.

Unless things were changed dramatically, a new race would only result in something new to look at. There are plenty of DATs out there that will accomplish this already.

imo, SE should implement some sort of racial ability for each race. An example would be a Galka one-handing a great sword or something along those lines. It would be difficult for SE to pull anything like this off without breaking the game though.